johnquayleiom Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 I was on the boat (to heysham) a few days ago and spotted a very large livestock wagon that was full of sheep. I made a few enquiries and it turns out that they were sheep being sent away for slaughter somewhere in UK. I dont know much about this subject, but it raised 2 questions. 1. I thought the abattoir we have over here is pretty good - I know as ive been on the tours, so why dont they get slaughtered there? 2. Wasnt there a big issue surrounding this a few years ago at the ports in the south of England, from what i remember it was the welfare of the animals being crowded into wagons on horrendous journeys. Does anybody know any real facts about this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 I don't know any real facts, but I won't let that stop me. 1 - they probably got a better price from whoever bought them. 2 - think I remember something about some crowded veal wagons once. What's the connection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manx viking Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 I watched the Ben My Chree unload in Heysham last night (11.30pm) and noticed a small box trailer packed to the gunnels with sheep, presumably heading onward to some UK destination. This was a private operation. You know the sort of thing - "buy local" - but as long as local farmers can get a better deal elswhere then they will!" Hypocrites I made a mental note that UK ports normally will have RSPCA inspectors on hand to confirm the welfare and well being of stock in transit. None evident at Heysham - and I would be more than surprised if there had been one at Douglas. Are there any IOM standards or UK welfare standards for minimum space per head and the length of time in transit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Probably bound for the halal meat market. A horrible fate for any beast, sheep especially and involving NOTHING like the method of slaughtering undertaken for the kosher meat market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 (edited) I was on the boat (to heysham) a few days ago and spotted a very large livestock wagon that was full of sheep. I made a few enquiries and it turns out that they were sheep being sent away for slaughter somewhere in UK. I dont know much about this subject, but it raised 2 questions. 1. I thought the abattoir we have over here is pretty good - I know as ive been on the tours, so why dont they get slaughtered there? 2. Wasnt there a big issue surrounding this a few years ago at the ports in the south of England, from what i remember it was the welfare of the animals being crowded into wagons on horrendous journeys. Does anybody know any real facts about this? 1. they are old cull sheep, no use to breed from and the abattoir wont take them here as there is no market, so old cull sheep are exported to the uk where at least there is some value in them still. saves killing them and putting them in a hole that used to happin. 2. the stocking amounts will be in EU guidelines for shipping and movement. all stock is checked by a vet b4 they can be shipped and loaded. random checks are made here and in the uk on wagons to make sure there not over stocked, and DEFRA vets will be at the unloading end to check as well all stock shipped into the island gets met by department workers on the dock side b4 its allowed out of the port to check the stock etc. The sheep you seen in a private trailer were prob being sent out for sale as breeding sheep not for killing as a trailer full would not cover the cost of the boat alone if it was for killing. these will be going to a sale where buyers from all over the UK will be buying, so its got nowt to do with buying local and to get a better deal elswhere then they will!" and being Hypocrites. this sheep would not have been sold in the isle of man as there is only a handfull of breeders that would want this top class breeding sheep. but dont let the facts get in the way now Edited March 5, 2010 by gazza Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Probably bound for the halal meat market. What are you basing this assumption on Rog? Or were you just looking for today's excuse to criticise Islam? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Perhaps they were off for a weekend at Southport? I hear it's nice there this time of year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Ayres Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 Probably bound for the halal meat market. What are you basing this assumption on Rog? Or were you just looking for today's excuse to criticise Islam? It's that the majority of Jews are fair skinned and the majority of Muslims dark skinned. Not rocket science, Rog is a died in the wool racist, pure and simple. He just hides behind his religion, like most cowards and bigots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 It's that the majority of Jews are fair skinned and the majority of Muslims dark skinned. Not rocket science, Rog is a died in the wool racist, pure and simple. He just hides behind his religion, like most cowards and bigots. maybe he could explain the difference between kosher and halal anyway the Scottish Islands have the lucrative contracts for export to Saudi Arabia etc - even have a special ship to ship only livestock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manx viking Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 1. they are old cull sheep, no use to breed from and the abattoir wont take them here as there is no market, so old cull sheep are exported to the uk where at least there is some value in them still. saves killing them and putting them in a hole that used to happin. 2. the stocking amounts will be in EU guidelines for shipping and movement. all stock is checked by a vet b4 they can be shipped and loaded. random checks are made here and in the uk on wagons to make sure there not over stocked, and DEFRA vets will be at the unloading end to check as well all stock shipped into the island gets met by department workers on the dock side b4 its allowed out of the port to check the stock etc. The sheep you seen in a private trailer were prob being sent out for sale as breeding sheep not for killing as a trailer full would not cover the cost of the boat alone if it was for killing. these will be going to a sale where buyers from all over the UK will be buying, so its got nowt to do with buying local and to get a better deal elswhere then they will!" and being Hypocrites. this sheep would not have been sold in the isle of man as there is only a handfull of breeders that would want this top class breeding sheep. but dont let the facts get in the way now Now without letting the facts get in the way - or trying to pull the wool over any ones eyes - 1. A lorry load of sheep are perceived by 'gazza' as cull sheep who then states as having little or no value so therefore it must have been breeding sheep in the private trailer on the way to a sale? Fact or fiction - I thought breeding ewes at this time of year were to busy having lambs and suckling young so is this the time of year when breeding ewes are being sold? Me thinks not e.g. SALE DATES 2010 at Borderway unless otherwise stated Lazonby Wednesday 21st April Sale of Ewes, Shearlings, Hoggs & Lambs at foot, also geld hoggs (Entries close 10am Wednesday 14th April) Carlisle Monday 10th May Special show and sale of ewes and hoggs with lambs at foot (Entries close Monday 3rd May) So I guess they are just going to hang about in a field somewhere off the M74 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 1. they are old cull sheep, no use to breed from and the abattoir wont take them here as there is no market, so old cull sheep are exported to the uk where at least there is some value in them still. saves killing them and putting them in a hole that used to happin. 2. the stocking amounts will be in EU guidelines for shipping and movement. all stock is checked by a vet b4 they can be shipped and loaded. random checks are made here and in the uk on wagons to make sure there not over stocked, and DEFRA vets will be at the unloading end to check as well all stock shipped into the island gets met by department workers on the dock side b4 its allowed out of the port to check the stock etc. The sheep you seen in a private trailer were prob being sent out for sale as breeding sheep not for killing as a trailer full would not cover the cost of the boat alone if it was for killing. these will be going to a sale where buyers from all over the UK will be buying, so its got nowt to do with buying local and to get a better deal elswhere then they will!" and being Hypocrites. this sheep would not have been sold in the isle of man as there is only a handfull of breeders that would want this top class breeding sheep. but dont let the facts get in the way now Now without letting the facts get in the way - or trying to pull the wool over any ones eyes - 1. A lorry load of sheep are perceived by 'gazza' as cull sheep who then states as having little or no value so therefore it must have been breeding sheep in the private trailer on the way to a sale? Fact or fiction - I thought breeding ewes at this time of year were to busy having lambs and suckling young so is this the time of year when breeding ewes are being sold? Me thinks not e.g. SALE DATES 2010 at Borderway unless otherwise stated Lazonby Wednesday 21st April Sale of Ewes, Shearlings, Hoggs & Lambs at foot, also geld hoggs (Entries close 10am Wednesday 14th April) Carlisle Monday 10th May Special show and sale of ewes and hoggs with lambs at foot (Entries close Monday 3rd May) So I guess they are just going to hang about in a field somewhere off the M74 ooo wow a couple of dates and you have proven me wrong. i think not. shall we go and do what u do and show dates On Wednesday evening, 3rd March 2010 Harrison & Hetherington Ltd. held the Annual Sale of 38 Crowned In Lamb Swaledale Ewes, (really they should be in the field lambing should they not) Monday 8th Borderway Inlamb ewes and ewes with lambs at foot Monday 15th Borderway Inlamb ewes and ewes with lambs at foot Monday 22nd Borderway Inlamb ewes and ewes with lambs at foot thats for march. and funny its from the same site. whould u like me to put some more dates up from diffrent sales, private sales and the likes you see that part inlamb ewes there called breeding sheep. maybe they were tups being sent out as there not lambing now are they, so im glad to see you think not or dont think, or think you know what your talking about, because unless the dates are lieng all them sheep must be out in the field lambing should they not. please do tell us that you know the dates for every farmer in the isle of mans lambing season or is it because you know lambs are allways born in the spring. also these breeding sheep could have lambs at foot being born well b4 december, or does that not fit into what u been told about lambing in the spring . Also i have not perceived what was in the wagon, i know what was in the wagon and i could tell you what farm it come from and whos it was. and if i really wanted to i could find out how many sheep were on that wagon. so i have perceived northing because i know. so please do come back and tell me all lambs are born in the spring and that no breeding sheep will be sold till that first sale you posted about. but i will prceive you know northing about this apart from a quick search on the net and stopped at the first page you seen a date that suited you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 the animal transporters (like horse boxes) are loaded last and off first on the Ben - you can usually smell their previous presence on the lower car deck - however the large fancy double deck transport that came over on the Weds sailing last week was parked at St Johns - I've seen it backed up in a couple of farms in that area over the last week - don't think it was manx plated but the driver seemed to know exactly where he was going as he was first off the boat, straight through the port yard and very fast up to Peel road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manx viking Posted March 5, 2010 Share Posted March 5, 2010 1. they are old cull sheep, no use to breed from and the abattoir wont take them here as there is no market, so old cull sheep are exported to the uk where at least there is some value in them still. saves killing them and putting them in a hole that used to happin. 2. the stocking amounts will be in EU guidelines for shipping and movement. all stock is checked by a vet b4 they can be shipped and loaded. random checks are made here and in the uk on wagons to make sure there not over stocked, and DEFRA vets will be at the unloading end to check as well all stock shipped into the island gets met by department workers on the dock side b4 its allowed out of the port to check the stock etc. The sheep you seen in a private trailer were prob being sent out for sale as breeding sheep not for killing as a trailer full would not cover the cost of the boat alone if it was for killing. these will be going to a sale where buyers from all over the UK will be buying, so its got nowt to do with buying local and to get a better deal elswhere then they will!" and being Hypocrites. this sheep would not have been sold in the isle of man as there is only a handfull of breeders that would want this top class breeding sheep. but dont let the facts get in the way now Also i have not perceived what was in the wagon, i know what was in the wagon and i could tell you what farm it come from and whos it was. and if i really wanted to i could find out how many sheep were on that wagon. so i have perceived northing because i know. So why not just post the facts you have first hand knowledge about instead of allowing us plebs to speculate on the state of sheep shite? Bah seriously "gazza" - you do know your sheep - so who am I to argue with? Only Manxforums.com could get a thread running on SHEEP! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza Posted March 6, 2010 Share Posted March 6, 2010 1. they are old cull sheep, no use to breed from and the abattoir wont take them here as there is no market, so old cull sheep are exported to the uk where at least there is some value in them still. saves killing them and putting them in a hole that used to happin. 2. the stocking amounts will be in EU guidelines for shipping and movement. all stock is checked by a vet b4 they can be shipped and loaded. random checks are made here and in the uk on wagons to make sure there not over stocked, and DEFRA vets will be at the unloading end to check as well all stock shipped into the island gets met by department workers on the dock side b4 its allowed out of the port to check the stock etc. The sheep you seen in a private trailer were prob being sent out for sale as breeding sheep not for killing as a trailer full would not cover the cost of the boat alone if it was for killing. these will be going to a sale where buyers from all over the UK will be buying, so its got nowt to do with buying local and to get a better deal elswhere then they will!" and being Hypocrites. this sheep would not have been sold in the isle of man as there is only a handfull of breeders that would want this top class breeding sheep. but dont let the facts get in the way now Also i have not perceived what was in the wagon, i know what was in the wagon and i could tell you what farm it come from and whos it was. and if i really wanted to i could find out how many sheep were on that wagon. so i have perceived northing because i know. So why not just post the facts you have first hand knowledge about instead of allowing us plebs to speculate on the state of sheep shite? Bah seriously "gazza" - you do know your sheep - so who am I to argue with? Only Manxforums.com could get a thread running on SHEEP! i did post the facts there in the first post i made so not sure what your going on about. i said what the wagon was on the boat and what the stock was that was on the boat, so i did say the facts. then you went of on some witch hunt saying ooo no there all in the field lambing you cant be right . so i did post the facts then u posted some things that werent the facts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graculus Posted March 6, 2010 Share Posted March 6, 2010 so i did post the facts then u posted some things that werent the facts gazza and Vicky Pollard - might they be related? I think we should be told. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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