Donald Trumps 5,536 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Do they have an alternate source of legal advice? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
asitis 5,759 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Do they have an alternate source of legal advice? I would have assumed that knowing the position of the Attorney General that entirely separate legal advice was required, I have no idea but would seem to be common sense to me anticipating future questions ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Torry loon 145 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Do they have an alternate source of legal advice? Yes, the Government can and do use various firms of advocates, and they have their favoured ones. The Government even use advocates such as who may have advised the MEA that the loans - of which details were kept from the Government themselves - were legal. The legal world. Funny old world innit. Especially in the Isle of Man. Toodly pip. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
woolley 19,198 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Nobody listening to Tynwald this evening then? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Moghrey Mie 1,499 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Yes. Well done Kate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Donald Trumps 5,536 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 ¨CoMin indulging in casino capitalism when it should be looking after ordinary people¨ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lxxx 5,826 Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Kate Beecroft, that girl will be offered a plum job soon. Guaranteed. Bell will try and buy her off no question. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fossils 573 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 (edited) Kate Beecroft - The People's Heroine! I heard some of her report and was pleased to hear her open numerous cans of worms, and let some unexpected cats out of bags. However, I suspect that most of those will have been sealed in again overnight. Let's have this information made fully public. I can't access this link to a Manx Radio Listen again beec-leak clip, whereas I can access other links on the site. Strange that. http://www.manxradio.com/oNews/uploaded/audio/beec-leakMay214543.wma Edited May 22, 2013 by Fossils Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lost Login 1,710 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Kate Beecroft - The People's Heroine! I heard some of her report and was pleased to hear her open numerous cans of worms, and let some unexpected cats out of bags. However, I suspect that most of those will have been sealed in again overnight. Not mine. I agree she did raise some interesting points but she goes at things like a bull in a china shop. Rather like her party leader. I think if she thought a bit more subtly and strategically she would do a much better job. e.g. last night the motion was a straight forward attack on the council of ministers so it was not going to get anywhere. I would much prefer for her to set down a motion calling for the introduction or restatement of the rules and regulations for the use of certain funds and powers of Ministers to lend funds without Tynwald approval. You could still have got your digs in but it appears you are being proactive and not negative etc and is more likely to get support Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hagar the horrible 733 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Kate Beecroft - The People's Heroine! I heard some of her report and was pleased to hear her open numerous cans of worms, and let some unexpected cats out of bags. However, I suspect that most of those will have been sealed in again overnight. Not mine. I agree she did raise some interesting points but she goes at things like a bull in a china shop. Rather like her party leader. I think if she thought a bit more subtly and strategically she would do a much better job. e.g. last night the motion was a straight forward attack on the council of ministers so it was not going to get anywhere. I would much prefer for her to set down a motion calling for the introduction or restatement of the rules and regulations for the use of certain funds and powers of Ministers to lend funds without Tynwald approval. You could still have got your digs in but it appears you are being proactive and not negative etc and is more likely to get support Subtlety in Manx politics, casting pearls before swine Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Donald Trumps 5,536 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 I thought Ms Beecroft & Mr Cannan spoke intelligently & with some passion on the matter Was the CM weeping into his hanky? I think we should be told.. What I can't get over is the sheer co-incidence that govt loaned Sefton Group £1.3m in cash, and that the former Co Sec sold shares to the value of £1.3m before accepting the position of Acting Attorney General 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lost Login 1,710 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 What I can't get over is the sheer co-incidence that govt loaned Sefton Group £1.3m in cash, and that the former Co Sec sold shares to the value of £1.3m before accepting the position of Acting Attorney General If it had been a buy back of own shares the co-incidence might have been worth commeting on. That he presumably sold to a third party makes it less so and the fact that he sold the shares on the Seftron Group and so is unlikey to have benefitted from the effects of the loan makes it even less worthy of mention Quote Link to post Share on other sites
newsnight 719 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Mrs Beecroft gave Bell, Teare and Shimmin’s excuses for why they gave the Sefton millions of pounds of taxpayer’s money such a careful factual and evidence based battering, at the end of which the many changing excuses they have made for the bail-out of the Sefton lay at their feet like a very old and cheap colander, full of holes and not much use at all. So much for due diligence on the part of the Treasury Minister! Mr Bell predictably did his famous Michael Flatley impersonation while all the while having a frothy hissy fit as fact after fact was hammered into place by Mrs Beecroft. The MHK’s who voted against the motion for the most part had no idea if what she was telling them was good or bad, they simply couldn’t follow it. Mrs Beecroft had so many facts and figures their fears grew in keeping with them. However, instead of thinking for themselves (difficult if not impossible for most of them) they went where the Chief Minister pointed them to. Falling back on the tried and tested knee-jerk reaction they decided to attack the messenger and shout down the message. The essence of it is as I understand it, a small interconnected group of wealthy men who could have financed the Sefton out of their own resources as shareholders of it, didn’t. Instead of which they used the Isle of Man Government as a source of cheap money. Sound familiar? I can’t wait for the Hansard to be published and I’ll bet neither can the UK Press either. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1304723/David-Rowland-Tax-exile-shady-financier--political-liability.html 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dr Gonzo 15 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 I can’t wait for the Hansard to be published and I’ll bet neither can the UK Press either. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1304723/David-Rowland-Tax-exile-shady-financier--political-liability.html Nobody I know in the UK press would give a shit about a loan to a hotel in the Isle of Man. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lost Login 1,710 Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 The MHK’s who voted against the motion for the most part had no idea if what she was telling them was good or bad, they simply couldn’t follow it. Mrs Beecroft had so many facts and figures their fears grew in keeping with them. However, instead of thinking for themselves (difficult if not impossible for most of them) they went where the Chief Minister pointed them to. Falling back on the tried and tested knee-jerk reaction they decided to attack the messenger and shout down the message This goes back to my original posting about going about thimgs like a bull in a China shop and rather than being subtle and strageic. Her motion was "That Tynwald does not approve of the actions of the Council of Ministers in respect of the loans to the Sefton Group and the purchase of the Middlemarch site from the Sefton Group" That automatically means the Council of Ministers and members of departments or at least those in relevant departments are going to oppose. You have basically blown your chances before you have even spoken. It is far better to reign back, allow a bit of wiggle room to give yourself a chance of getting a bit more support however much that appears unlikely. Finally I hope that she publishes everything in full on the LVP website or wherever as there are a few suggestions that there were certain matters where she was relying on parliamentary priviledge to get away with. If you are telling the truth I would assume you do not need such protection and it perturbs me if she or any member would make an allegation in Tynwald that they would not repeat outside I agree with you about Bell though, I am getting fed up with his perpetually moaning about the Island been damaged when people do not agree with him rather than putting forward an argument. Two more points, I wish that Beecroft had simply asked why if XY and Z wealthy investors did not appear to think it was worth lending money to the Sefton Group to keep afloat but Govt did as I think that would have got more attention. Finally I like line 452 and 453 in Hansard early publications where Teare states " we have had feedback now that confidence has been restored to the ECONOMY and that this will enable the company to trade more successfully" It is my highlighting but the idea that their action in this one case has resortered confidence in the economy seems to really summarise Teare and Bells own opinion of their self worth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.