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Queen's Pier - £1.8M Spend


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Do you agree with the £1.8m spend on Queen's Pier  

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What would people think if money had not been spent on Laxey Wheel and the gardens over the years, they are very nice but have no practical use, you might as well flatten Peel castle while you are at it, it has no practical purpose :angry:

The difference between Ramsey Pier and Laxey wheel, is that Laxey wheel does not currently consist of just one spoke and 200 tons of rust and does not face a bill of £8M to add the other 55 (or however many) spokes and the rest of the wheel and support structure to put it all right.

 

We have always had to make choices on this island (even when there were many toursists about) as to what was economically viable in terms of 'tourism' etc. We have lost a grandeous pier in Douglas, a railyway line to Peel and the Douglas head railway etc. etc. and all in the heady days of tourism because they were not viable.

 

If you really think that there is an £8M business case for Ramsey pier, then work out the charges that would need to be applied and the likely number of annual visitors required to make it viable. I think you would find it to be one of the biggest white elephant projects you could ever create on this island - especially so when times are hard and cuts that we have never seen the likes of in living memory are yet to be made.

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I love to look at the pier but the more I think of it, the more I feel that money could be better spent elsewhere in the town.

 

The harbour area for example. It reminds me of Peel some years ago when it was sad, grubby, unattractive and neglected. But visiting Peel over the weekend, I was struck at the new positive look and feel to the place. I see many improvements have been made in the past few years and this regeneration should be created in Ramsey. It's badly needed and well overdue.

 

Sadly, I too doubt that the bits of the Pier, once removed, will ever be returned to site.

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Eight million over thirty years, with some Govt funded maintenance and wages, would be a yearly cost of some 300,000.

 

To recover this cost it could be that a Pub/Nightclub at the end of the pier could stand a rent of possibly 30,000/yr but this would leave the other 270,000 to be picked up by shops, cafés, stalls etc. These could probably only afford some 15,000/yr. So that would require 18 of these small business' for the Govt to break even. Hardly likely?

 

Far more than Heritage projects like the Pier or Habourside, what Ramsey needs are jobs that will hold and bring people to Ramsey. Manufacturing, service industries, call centres etc.

 

Smart cafés on the Quayside will only cause the ones in the street to close, so no gain. Perhaps a business plan to create NEW business' rather than replicate the existing?

 

If you can get people out of the min/low wage trap, then retail development will follow.

 

New Hotels? For whom? People who do not realise how far out of Douglas Ramsey is?

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Maybe more options could be examined?

 

Does it have to stay at that length?

 

Does it have to be public owned?

 

£1.8 million is one heck of a lot of money for little or no result.

 

How many prices have been requested for work on the pier?

 

Anyone answer?.... its just turning into a debate of "get it restored"...."no knock it down", Spending a couple of million every 5 years to "make it safe" is ridiculous but its clear the government have no interest in saving the pier otherwise it would have been renovated 15-20 years ago!! (would've lasted another 100 years too!)

 

So what other options are there?

 

Many piers across such as the one in Blackpool and Wales the cost of the pier is actually paid for by the shops, a section at the top for fishing (yearly pass, day rates etc..), Cafes and amusement arcades, these piers actually make a profit not a loss, its not what the piers were designed for but it works.

 

TT week it would be crammed full of tourists buying shitty "Manx memorabilia", spending money in the amusements and buy food etc...Sell the pier, make it somebody else's problem (or potential), If its scrapped the government were only going to do that anyway, if its restored....all well and good.

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It would be a shame to lose relics of bygone eras. These include the railway lines, horse trams, water wheels and of course piers.

 

We shouldn't look at it from an economic view point (obviously it will not pay for itself through tourism) but how we would feel if things no longer existed. I don't believe that there are many people who doesn't enjoy watching the steam train go past, but is it commercially prudent to continue to retain it? I doubt it.

 

I am in favour of renovating the pier but I would like to see it done within a structured budget and agreed timetable. If the cost could be offset by rents paid by vendors selling chips, souvenirs and amusements all the better, but i doubt it would be easy to open anything other than seasonal offers.

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New Hotels? For whom? People who do not realise how far out of Douglas Ramsey is?

 

I agree a hotel might be a bit ambitious but not everyone who comes to the Island wants to stay in Douglas.

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Ramsey?....far?....from douglas?....hahaha!

 

Back in the real world, piers are for tourism and most tourists like to travel ie "tour"!, I'm sure a tram/bus and taking the sights would be a pleasure for most tourists not a chore...

 

For those of us who live here, Douglas to Ramsey is what 20 mins?

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As much as I would like Queen's Pier to be repaired and love to be able to walk along it, it isn't as interesting and arouses curiosity for tourists and locals as much as Laxey Wheel and Peel Castle. Both of these places have a great deal of history.

 

A bit of imagination and it could be a valuable attraction. A decent cafe/restaurant at the end would be a novelty in itself for Ramsey. Add an ice cream parlour, miniature railway, boat trips, fishing trips and so on, and you've got something worth travelling to Ramsey for at weekends. It might not make a lot of money in itself, but if gets people up north, they'll spend money elsewhere as well. If we take the kids to Peel on a sunny weekend, we'll go the castle, have a bit of lunch somewhere, probably get an icecream from Davison's, and have a wonder round and buy various other stuff from the other shops. Looking at the island as a whole, the more there is to do the better, surely? We're not exactly rammed with visitor attractions at the moment.

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A bit of imagination and it could be a valuable attraction. A decent cafe/restaurant at the end would be a novelty in itself for Ramsey. Add an ice cream parlour, miniature railway, boat trips, fishing trips and so on, and you've got something worth travelling to Ramsey for at weekends. It might not make a lot of money in itself, but if gets people up north, they'll spend money elsewhere as well. If we take the kids to Peel on a sunny weekend, we'll go the castle, have a bit of lunch somewhere, probably get an icecream from Davison's, and have a wonder round and buy various other stuff from the other shops. Looking at the island as a whole, the more there is to do the better, surely? We're not exactly rammed with visitor attractions at the moment.

 

Oddly enough that's more-or less what we had in the 60's and 70's - along with tourists but it still didn't pay its way even with volunteers helping out.

 

Dynamite!

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A bit of imagination and it could be a valuable attraction. A decent cafe/restaurant at the end would be a novelty in itself for Ramsey. Add an ice cream parlour, miniature railway, boat trips, fishing trips and so on, and you've got something worth travelling to Ramsey for at weekends. It might not make a lot of money in itself, but if gets people up north, they'll spend money elsewhere as well. If we take the kids to Peel on a sunny weekend, we'll go the castle, have a bit of lunch somewhere, probably get an icecream from Davison's, and have a wonder round and buy various other stuff from the other shops. Looking at the island as a whole, the more there is to do the better, surely? We're not exactly rammed with visitor attractions at the moment.

We're not, but we never will be, because the Island is a bit of a crap place to come to, except if you are getting on a bit or are into the TT. The countryside is lovely but the towns have no life in them.

 

But I would agree about it being really great if Ramsey Pier could have a cafe, a miniature railways, and have people fishing of it. And I would be willing to pay my part in taxes toward it. It's just convincing others of this. And if most don't want it, it's not going to happen.

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You know, I came from North America with my 1/4 Manx wife, straight to the Isle of Man, didn't stop in England and didn't stay in Douglas. We stayed at King Bills, a week on the Calf (what a undervalued place that is), a pricey converted stable / convention centre in Kirk Lonan, a B&B in Peel, a few days in another B&B in Ramsey, another outside Jerby East and back to King Bills again.

 

We had rail passes most of the time. And walked around a lot getting to and from the buses, trams and trains from the places we were staying. We visited your museums, pubs, restaurants, churches and graveyards. She talked to your docents in rude and crude Manx. Got invited home and looked at peoples family bibles and photo albums back to the 1600's. We talked 'wall building' and 'basket weaving' with people that actually speak Manx. We even saw some wallabies in the Curraghs with John Dog.

 

We talked history with your seniors, attended the Bunscoill Ghaelgagh with your kids, drank beer and attended Manx classes in your pubs and attended the Manx language AGM. We discussed tourism with officials from the Manx Museum and the Irish Museum in a pub watching Manxmen and women singing songs in Gaelg.

 

There are lots of ex-pat Manxies and descendants who want to see where their parents and grandparents came from. That makes you a target destination. We are all getting older and there is a lot of us. We had a little money put aside that we decided to spend on this stuff, in your country. Myself personally, this was the trip of a lifetime and I spent most of the money I had to do it as a present to my wife. It cost us in the neighbourhood of about 4000 pounds - 2500 on the island itself and the rest on airfare in 30 days. We spent some of that in Ramsy photographing your pier. That was a quarter of our yearly gross income and way more that I could afford. It was worth it.

 

We hung out in Ramsey for days, at the pier, at the harbour, at the Moorgh, at Sulby, at the freaking Bus Stop .... The place is great - except for what you are going to allow to happen to that foreshore park - that's messed up. Trading waterfront greenspace for apartments? Next to derelict historical buildings in need of restoration? You got to be kidding?

 

I just checked the spelling of Moorgh with Google Earth and I found it by looking for the IOM and then zeroed in on your pier. It is a locator beacon from space that peaks the curiosity of tourists any where in the world and it points right at your town. Even the Chickens Light House didn't make the google earth cut. I've spent years looking at places with google earth, but yours is the one I eventually made it to.

 

People will come to your country and visit. But not for the malls, not for the commercial radio stations and not for the urban sprawl. We have tons of that stuff right here in the fastest growing community in Canada. BTW you have excellent urban containment boundaries. It's what you have that others don't that makes your home unique. Like the Queens Pier.

 

Your country is small. Your island is the size of the valley I live in, we have similar populations. I just drove 100k and back for a MRI the other day. I put 500K on my truck almost every week. Your distances mean nothing to me. We went from Port St. Mary to Kirk Lonan and people were amazed that we were going to do it 'all in one day'. We did it in the evening on 2 buses in about 2 hours. It took longer waiting for bus transfers and walking from the bus stop to the place we were staying with our heavy packs then it did to travel that distance. Who ever posted the comment that tourist don't care how far it is from Douglas to Ramsey was entirely correct. 'A hotel in Ramsey? Great, somewhere to stay so we can travel from there to somewhere else and back'.

 

If you allow them to take bits of the pier away they will never put them back.

If you allow them to defer fixing up the pier it will never be rebuilt.

If you allow them to kill the pier you are nutz. YMMV :-)

Did I say that out loud?

 

At least that's what this loud noisy 'Come From Away" had to say on the subject. Just the kind of person I hate to hear from around here. Sorry about that.

 

<mooghey jannoo ronneeaght>

 

Lhiats

gragor

Wishing I could afford to be there for May

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Well said gragor, it just goes to show some of the so called locals have probably never been out of douglas, and some have deffo never been off the island ! Well ramsey is a long way from douglas :lol:

Hope you manage to make it here again !

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I am more concerned about the People of Ramsey than Ramsey itself.

 

Ramsey is definately a pack of sandwiches and flask away from Douglas!!!

 

... and we could do with a Filling Station on the Mountain road, then more people would actually get to Ramsey.

Edited by Kopek
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You know, I came from North America with my 1/4 Manx wife, straight to the Isle of Man, didn't stop in England and didn't stay in Douglas. We stayed at King Bills, a week on the Calf (what a undervalued place that is), a pricey converted stable / convention centre in Kirk Lonan, a B&B in Peel, a few days in another B&B in Ramsey, another outside Jerby East and back to King Bills again.

 

We had rail passes most of the time. And walked around a lot getting to and from the buses, trams and trains from the places we were staying. We visited your museums, pubs, restaurants, churches and graveyards. She talked to your docents in rude and crude Manx. Got invited home and looked at peoples family bibles and photo albums back to the 1600's. We talked 'wall building' and 'basket weaving' with people that actually speak Manx. We even saw some wallabies in the Curraghs with John Dog.

 

We talked history with your seniors, attended the Bunscoill Ghaelgagh with your kids, drank beer and attended Manx classes in your pubs and attended the Manx language AGM. We discussed tourism with officials from the Manx Museum and the Irish Museum in a pub watching Manxmen and women singing songs in Gaelg.

 

There are lots of ex-pat Manxies and descendants who want to see where their parents and grandparents came from. That makes you a target destination. We are all getting older and there is a lot of us. We had a little money put aside that we decided to spend on this stuff, in your country. Myself personally, this was the trip of a lifetime and I spent most of the money I had to do it as a present to my wife. It cost us in the neighbourhood of about 4000 pounds - 2500 on the island itself and the rest on airfare in 30 days. We spent some of that in Ramsy photographing your pier. That was a quarter of our yearly gross income and way more that I could afford. It was worth it.

 

We hung out in Ramsey for days, at the pier, at the harbour, at the Moorgh, at Sulby, at the freaking Bus Stop .... The place is great - except for what you are going to allow to happen to that foreshore park - that's messed up. Trading waterfront greenspace for apartments? Next to derelict historical buildings in need of restoration? You got to be kidding?

 

I just checked the spelling of Moorgh with Google Earth and I found it by looking for the IOM and then zeroed in on your pier. It is a locator beacon from space that peaks the curiosity of tourists any where in the world and it points right at your town. Even the Chickens Light House didn't make the google earth cut. I've spent years looking at places with google earth, but yours is the one I eventually made it to.

 

People will come to your country and visit. But not for the malls, not for the commercial radio stations and not for the urban sprawl. We have tons of that stuff right here in the fastest growing community in Canada. BTW you have excellent urban containment boundaries. It's what you have that others don't that makes your home unique. Like the Queens Pier.

 

Your country is small. Your island is the size of the valley I live in, we have similar populations. I just drove 100k and back for a MRI the other day. I put 500K on my truck almost every week. Your distances mean nothing to me. We went from Port St. Mary to Kirk Lonan and people were amazed that we were going to do it 'all in one day'. We did it in the evening on 2 buses in about 2 hours. It took longer waiting for bus transfers and walking from the bus stop to the place we were staying with our heavy packs then it did to travel that distance. Who ever posted the comment that tourist don't care how far it is from Douglas to Ramsey was entirely correct. 'A hotel in Ramsey? Great, somewhere to stay so we can travel from there to somewhere else and back'.

 

If you allow them to take bits of the pier away they will never put them back.

If you allow them to defer fixing up the pier it will never be rebuilt.

If you allow them to kill the pier you are nutz. YMMV :-)

Did I say that out loud?

 

At least that's what this loud noisy 'Come From Away" had to say on the subject. Just the kind of person I hate to hear from around here. Sorry about that.

 

<mooghey jannoo ronneeaght>

 

Lhiats

gragor

Wishing I could afford to be there for May

 

Good grief, what a fabulus post!

 

How about being or next Minister for Tourism?

 

If not, I do hope that someone in charge of tourism reads that.

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