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How Can The Government Save And Make Money?


Cambon
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P.S. the counter cry from government will be that if you cut down a lot on the PS you will increase one-off costs and unemployment payments. Still it would be interesting to see how that balanced out.

 

P.P.S. the other issue that should be considered IMO is the terms of the of redundancy payment rules versus those in the private sector.

I agree, Turkeys don't vote for christmas.

 

My fear is that it will be more of the same after September. No one of any calibre is coming forward to stand and likely to address the issues. It is extremely worrying.

 

I fear we will have long sank before most of the electorate on the Isle of Man even notice they are getting their feet wet.

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If the government started a pension fund by putting in £1000 for each child born every year, that would cost approximately £1,000,000 per year, but would wipe out the need for state pensions in 65 years. State pension payments are a major part of the Government's outgoings at the moment.

 

If the government is putting in the money then surely it is a state pension??? you said serious right??? do you 'work' at the fsc? remember goverments don't have their own money, they have ours.

Edited by WTF
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If the government started a pension fund by putting in £1000 for each child born every year, that would cost approximately £1,000,000 per year, but would wipe out the need for state pensions in 65 years. State pension payments are a major part of the Government's outgoings at the moment.

 

If the government is putting in the money then surely it is a state pension??? you said serious right??? do you 'work' at the fsc? remember goverments don't have their own money, they have ours.

 

They aren't putting any money in though, that is Cambon's point. Very little of the IOMG pension or state benefits system is 'funded' at all. Those paying tax are basically giving it straight to those who are in retirement - there is no 'fund' for anything.

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  • Abolish Ministerial Government - This acts as an aegis for the public sector and thus reduces transparency and accountability. It certainly doesn't add value and the idea of having elected managers is a nonsesnse
  • Reform the budget process - This should be open to Parliamentary scrutiny before being passed the same day it is announced
  • Establish a committee dedicated to reviewing discretionary spending - The gross over-spending and mis-management of capital project cannot continue. How the advocates of the Richmond Hill project can look themselves in the mirror I will never know
  • Modernise working conditions - The Whitley Council has to go, and employees must accept that their normal working hours must be attuned to the actual times of service

 

Not unexpectedly, a few people have said the size of the public sector needs to be cut. The problem with that is that its not really a policy; its barely even a vague aspiration. The fuss over the sacking a handful of people on the heritage railway suggests that slicing chunks out of the state workforce is going to be tiresome at best.

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Not unexpectedly, a few people have said the size of the public sector needs to be cut. The problem with that is that its not really a policy; its barely even a vague aspiration. The fuss over the sacking a handful of people on the heritage railway suggests that slicing chunks out of the state workforce is going to be tiresome at best.

 

Natural wastage. Rather than replace staff, redeploy/retrain people. Agree with your comments on working conditions.

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If the government started a pension fund by putting in £1000 for each child born every year, that would cost approximately £1,000,000 per year, but would wipe out the need for state pensions in 65 years. State pension payments are a major part of the Government's outgoings at the moment.

 

If the government is putting in the money then surely it is a state pension??? you said serious right??? do you 'work' at the fsc? remember goverments don't have their own money, they have ours.

 

They aren't putting any money in though, that is Cambon's point. Very little of the IOMG pension or state benefits system is 'funded' at all. Those paying tax are basically giving it straight to those who are in retirement - there is no 'fund' for anything.

 

 

there was one cos it got raped ( due to being excessive according to the excuses for using some of it ) to go towards the new hospital. the problem with private pensions, a bit like banks, is every now and then someone fucks off with the money and claims bancruptcy leaving those that payed in screwed. it ought to be upto government to provide a 100% safe pension scheme for everyone ( not just its own workers ) so the conmen can't screw people who are too old to do anything about it when they find out.

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Don't spend money if you want to save.

 

The Government is ridiculous and have no idea of how to run an economy.

 

Look at the prison, a cost of £41.5 million give or take I believe. There is no way it costs £41.5 million to build a facility that only holds 150-200 people. You could of done it for far less.

 

The fact they sold most of the Government owned nursing homes for the elderly. They now rent!

 

Richmond Hill, no explanation needed there.

 

Someone had the smart idea to waste a few million on the promenade because it is too "bumpy". What do they think is going to happen to it over the years as it is dug up like every other road.

 

The MHKs themselves are one massive waste of money. I can't think of a single one who is any good or even a real statesman.

 

The solution is for us to try and elect people who are actually going to have common sense, who care about the Isle of Man and aren't complete morons who throw money in the fire.

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Not unexpectedly, a few people have said the size of the public sector needs to be cut. The problem with that is that its not really a policy; its barely even a vague aspiration. The fuss over the sacking a handful of people on the heritage railway suggests that slicing chunks out of the state workforce is going to be tiresome at best.

TBH, as I implied in my own comments, in my case I know little about the workings and efficiency of the PS The organisation charts make it look top heavy - i may or may not need to be. For the reasons you state about sacking a handful of people (and other reasons too) I would personally look first at the top levels of the tree as it is here that potentially the bigger quick hit savings could occur.

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Stop at once the funding of films on the island and take whatever money is still left in the pot back into reserves.

 

Invest that money with Conister Bank, for example, on a 5 year fixed term and note the massive difference in return, remembering not to be so stupid with the taxpayers money again, when it no longer helps us screw money out of the UK under the Vat Sharing Agreement.

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Stop at once the funding of films on the island and take whatever money is still left in the pot back into reserves.

 

Invest that money with Conister Bank, for example, on a 5 year fixed term and note the massive difference in return, remembering not to be so stupid with the taxpayers money again, when it no longer helps us screw money out of the UK under the Vat Sharing Agreement.

 

Great posts from Manshimajin and a suggestion from Blade Runner that should be acted on as a matter of urgency. I wonder though just what we'll get back from the film fund if the money is to be 'repatriated' back into Treasury ? Are we in for another twist in the story ? I've been sceptical about the film industry after the Irish experience in the 1980's, a lesson that sadly we never learnt from. Alan Bell will lead us down the road to ruin if he has any more smart ideas. I agree with most of Manshimajin's suggestions to rebalance the economy but the ultimate decisions will be political ones and any cuts will start at the bottom, well away from the real money. You could save a few million quid straight away by doing away with LegCo and the International Business School. We're not being told yet what this latter folly has been costing us. We're also paying a fortune for at least half of the MHK's who couldn't even run a jumble sale never mind our economy.

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not bad manshimajin.

but a few points on some of the things.

 

Tax cars on a 'user pays' basis through an extra tax on fuel - save the costs of the current administration of annual tax and encourage low mileage users onto public transport increasing its income

 

that is all well and good. But at the end of the day it is a stealth tax for everybody.

most people who have a car, use it to go to work, that is the main point of there car, Yes they use it at weekends and to go to the shop etc etc. And while a tax on the user pays may well get more people on to transport, stop them driving to the shop as they may well walk instead. The govenment may lose out in the end as jo publics milage gos down, jo public can change his habits to suit his budget

 

But everything you buy everything you use, has to be transported by something that uses fuel, the homes you buy, the food you eat, the TV you watch, it all has to be moved with cars,trucks etc.

the plumber the joiner the sparky, these people you need to do jobs in your home,

 

These companys people can not alter there milage, they cant change there habits, yes more eco cars,vans etc but apart from that, the fact remains that these people WILL have to past the cost on to YOU,

There is no ifs buts or maybe that is fact,

what the govenment may gain in tax on the fuel and the added VAT that will go on to the increaed prices charged by the services that are supplyed, they well lose on other things, as jo public does not have the extra cash in his pocket to go and spend.

 

this then has a knock on effect to other companys on the island, less to spend which means less need for other services, so yuo have companys shutting down, laying staff off, reduced income to the vat man, reduced income TAX, NI etc etc.

These people will then need govenment help with bills etc, there taking out of the pot, lose there home as they cant afford to pay for them, so once again the govenmnet has to step in and supply them with a house, because what govenment will allow a family to live on the streets with say a 4 year old and 9 months old baby.

I think its called the butterfly effect.

 

High fuel prices are the main reason that econmoys stagnat and slow and decline, this is fact as well, This is why we only really see 1-2ppl put on at a time,

it gives us a chance to get used to the price rise to budget for it, and gives the govenmnet time to see if the tax is crippling the econamory.

 

The only way you could do it would be to excempt company etc from this rise, and only apply it to the public, because it will be the public that pay for it in the end and we could all be worse off.

 

 

Not sure about this - but can the replacement lifespan of vehicles bought and operated by the government and local councils be extended to reduce replacement costs?

 

Now this is a good point, the whole buying of new vehicles in the DOI is down to ONE man, yes ONE man, what he says gos.

now for a long time he would keep the vehicles well past there useable life in the aspect that he was saving cash by not replaceing them.

And because of the way the figures or paper trail works it looked good on paper, That the replacemnet cost was nil the odd van here and there, looks good on paper.

 

But the reapir bills were sky high. needless thoushands were spent on repairs that should not have been carried out and the vehicle should have been scrapped long ago.

 

 

This was solely down to bad managemnet, and somebody wanting to make a name for themselfs, and to show a healthy profit in his department as the cost of repairs are billed to the section the vehicles were in. not his budjet so no worrys

 

all was swell intill things got to a point that everything needed to be replaced.

Point is the longer you keep something the more you need to spend on it, there is a point where its cheaper to replace then fix, its just some people havent a clue.

(that person is still in the same job) gross mmanagermant and he should have gone 10 years ago.

 

anyways since then somebody eles has had a say in what gos on about buying and keeping. i am led to belive that they have gone from a keep till it falls apart, to replacemnet after 3 years, and im sure in the last 2 years they have gone with the option of replacment after 5 years.

 

Once again there is a fine line between keeping them to long and selling to early.

after 3 years all warrantys tend to be up, depends on the maker of the item, But as this point they should look in to what vehicles have given problems, any which have had problems should be sold while there value is still high, theres getting rid of the burden of the possable repair bill. (2 cars are never alike and some have more problems than others)

 

Then moniter them up to 5 years, any givin more problems should be sold off before that age,

Now the hard part at 5 years the lifespan of these new vehicles are about half way, between now and 7 years the value drops right out and more repairs are needed, but this times more expensive repairs,

but you get the gist,

 

hell of a lot info needed to make the right choice, milage age problems, market price etc etc. so not just an easy call.

And also the more you buy in one go the less cost there is, so for them say changing say 10 vans at 3 year old may well be more cost effective than doing it at 5 year old.

with out the right dater and costings we cant make that choice.

 

Now really speaking if thay are changed early and less repairs needed then you need less staff to look after them, so that has to be taken in to accont as well.

 

I AM Barrie Stevens and i claim my own £5 :rolleyes:

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numbers of vehicles need looking at as well, there are roles where private vehicles could be used with an appropriate allowance to their owner to make it worthwhile, but nevertheless a considerable saving over vehicle ownership. Manchester have been doing this for years making considerable savings from Police non frontline posts, to surveying health & safety etc etc.

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Thanks for the comments. I was just tryng to do a 'brain dump' so I appreciate the comments that some ideas may not be good ones!

 

Overall I think we need a big change in politicians' mindsets. Clearly they have to run our mini-state and to find ways of funding services for the public. Whilst I accept that many things work reasonably well on the Island a number of threads here make me wonder if the folk in Tynwald are competent financial managers. So many things seem to be done in a vacuum, without effective controls or costing and with no measurable benefits. Thinking something is 'nice to do' doesn't make it a 'must do'. The lack of an FOI Act (and the wish to exclude the CoMin from it) reinforces their lack of accountability. Sadly I don't think our world is about to change at the next election - due to voter indifference.

 

If the rumours about further large cutbacks in the UK VAT subsidy are correct we need to find, as Cambon has pointed out, big cuts or large revenue increases. Little things here and there help but there also have to be some big ticket changes - hopefully not just by increasing income taxes to near UK levels.

 

In my fantasy world I would love to see some good business people come up with a range of costed suggestions that the electorate could select from and the politician be required to implement. I think I am mirroring a suggestion others have already made!

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