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Tonights Sidecar Practise Red Flagged


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A racing accident is just that, the police have to call these incidents as our americana blame culture can lead to legal claims etc but within racing eveyone accepts that accidents will always happen, be it caused by lack of course knowledge, mechanical failure or at times just plain bad luck.

 

Worst case, if a preceeding outfit dropped oil which led to this accident, it was certainly not their intent to do so, outside of the what they must be feeling right now, there should be no further action taken against.

 

If an outfit was negligent and went out on a machine that wasn't fit for racing and as a result someone lost their lives, then isn't it correct that the negligent ones should be found responsible?

 

 

At this time, this is all a terrible accident and I think that the riders, their families, the marshalls and emergency services need our support and compassion, and not a load of half baked assumptions, heresay and wild accusations.

 

I agree with this, but you post has a fair bit of that too.

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...Worst case, if a preceeding outfit dropped oil which led to this accident, it was certainly not their intent to do so, outside of the what they must be feeling right now, there should be no further action taken against.....

 

 

Not if the previous riders knew of the leak and failed to stop as I said before <_<

 

And BTW; speculation, wild accusations, and heresay are what forums are all about :D

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Define capability.

 

After the first practice session, they were lying in 9th place out of 38. Faster and safer than most og the younger competitors.

 

That requires great capability in my opinion.

not really, it requires course knowledge ( how many years have they been coming here?? decades by all accounts ) which some of the newer/younger not been here many times before entries won't have, and/or loads of money spent on a shit quick machine. money can make up for skill/knowledge

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I certainly agree that the Police are far better equipped to investigate the reasons for any accident on the TT course, my query was more to do with their ability to seize race machinery as there could be no criminal proceedings if nothing other than race machines were involved (unless criminal intent was involved of course).

 

A racing accident is just that, the police have to call these incidents as our americana blame culture can lead to legal claims etc but within racing eveyone accepts that accidents will always happen, be it caused by lack of course knowledge, mechanical failure or at times just plain bad luck.

 

Worst case, if a preceeding outfit dropped oil which led to this accident, it was certainly not their intent to do so, outside of the what they must be feeling right now, there should be no further action taken against.

 

If it was caused by a member of the public stepping onto the course, or a none race vehicle (involving a real 3rd party, cattle wagon for example) then I can see why it would immediately become a Police issue as criminal charges would most likely be brought.

 

As for the Marshalls, they do an incredibly tough job in sometimes terrible conditions for nothing, a whisp of oil coming from a machine can be nigh on invisible to the naked eye but cause enough loss of traction to cause a crash; furthermore they are stationed at pre-determined places on the course, and it could be that the problem area was outside of their field of vision.

 

At this time, this is all a terrible accident and I think that the riders, their families, the marshalls and emergency services need our support and compassion, and not a load of half baked assumptions, heresay and wild accusations.

 

I quoted the whole post because I think it sums everything up.

Great post SB

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For Scotteo

Not if the previous riders knew of the leak and failed to stop as I said before <_<

 

Do you honestly think that a rider would carry on if he new of a leak? Nope I don't think so.

Furthermore, those bikes cost thousands of pounds, if a leak was detected by a rider, they'd pull up before it seized and cost them even more thousands of pounds .

 

And BTW; speculation, wild accusations, and heresay are what forums are all about

 

Have you read the terms and conditions?

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Wildog, you'd think so, but that's the whole thing about criminal negligence isn't it? If people stuck to what they should do, it wouldn't exist.

The Scrutineers?

 

They do a complete mechanical inspection? Impressive!

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.....then isn't it correct that the negligent ones should be found responsible?

 

The Scrutineers?

 

Slim, I was talking about the reactions to certain possible causes, not speculating on those causes.

 

As WSAG states, every bike has to go through scutineering prior to every session, checks for oil leaks etc are part of that, as are checks for lock wire on brakes and sump plugs etc.

 

IF a machine failed to have its lockwire fitted and oil leaked from the sump plug, then the mechanic is accountable, however the ultimate responsibility falls with the race scrutineer who has the training to look for these things and stop the machine from leaving the pits.

 

If the oil escaped from a blown seal or engine failure, then these are really unforseeable things, seals blow, even new ones. Engines blow, even new ones. At that point it would be just down to a racing accident.

 

I will not speculate on the causes of this accident, I will however ardently defend the competitor's rights to race on the best road circuit in the world.

 

To live and die in your plastic bubble, or live and die carrying out your dreams; the choice is yours.

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As WSAG states, every bike has to go through scutineering prior to every session, checks for oil leaks etc are part of that, as are checks for lock wire on brakes and sump plugs etc.

 

IF a machine failed to have its lockwire fitted and oil leaked from the sump plug, then the mechanic is accountable, however the ultimate responsibility falls with the race scrutineer who has the training to look for these things and stop the machine from leaving the pits.

 

If the oil escaped from a blown seal or engine failure, then these are really unforseeable things, seals blow, even new ones. Engines blow, even new ones. At that point it would be just down to a racing accident.

 

 

 

What I disagree with is the notion that riders are not responsible for each others safety. You said anything that happens between the riders of the course is a racing incident. That's just daft. If a bike decides to race round backwards for a laugh, that's not a racing incident is it?

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The ACU has released a statement in relation to Tuesday nigh'ts fatal accident involving sidecar crew Bill Currie and Kevin Morgan.

 

Earlier today (Thursday) it was reported a sidecar had been impounded by police as investigations into the incident continue.

 

This lunchtime's release from the ACU says 'As is standard practice for the event, any bike that could've been involved in an incident is analysed.

 

'The Dave Hudspeth Carpets/Nick Crowe Racing machine of Simon Neary and Jason Crowe was impounded but has now been released following analysis and the competitors are free to participate in tonight's qualifying session.

 

'The investigation into the incident is ongoing'.

 

Manx Radio

 

 

 

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To my mind there is a sliding scale from Gross Negligence to Negligence to Shit Happens.

 

The purpose of the investigation is to determine where the incident falls and act accordingly.

 

Witchunting or over simplification of the facts of the case do neither side any favours.

 

Agree

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Wildog, you'd think so, but that's the whole thing about criminal negligence isn't it? If people stuck to what they should do, it wouldn't exist.

The Scrutineers?

 

They do a complete mechanical inspection? Impressive!

 

I can only speak from a rallying perspective, but in those events, the cars are overhauled by the MSA Scrutineers to check safety issues such as roll cages, seats, fire extinguishers, helmets, engines etc.....any vehicle involved in an "incident" and wishing to carry on is subject a re-scrutineering. Any deficiencies found on initial inspection need to be remedied before the car is passed.

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