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Doi To Push On With Douglas Prom Work


Lisenchuk
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If you're going to change to that, why not change to having no horsetrams instead? Are we retaining the heritage of the word 'horsetram' or the actual vehicles and track they use? The latter I would suggest.

 

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My picture was initially in jest. I prefer option 2 - no horse trams at all. Sorted, next...

Though what about prisoners, welfare cheats, smokers, dog owners, cyclists or [insert people you don't like] pulling trams in penance?

Its always going to be members of Comin for me,at least they're already familiar with wearing blinkers.

And tether all the Legco members together should we decide to reintroduce Donkeys onto the beach.

Edited by Lisenchuk
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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

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Don't build rails at all. Save a load of cash, keep the horses in jobs.

This is easily the most sensible suggestion.

 

Hardly, it could end up costing more - it has the conversion costs, the issue of increased wear on the tarmac (exactly how long has the road surface lasted compared to the tramrails? Probably no where near as long. In addition the rails offer less rolling restance to the vehicle as a horsetram flange is far far narrower and much smoother than a car tire (plus the wheels are sprung loaded in such a way that the horse tram keeps rolling with little input from the horse once it has created the initial momentum) - therefore coupled with the fact the horse would be walking on conventional tarmac rather than the rubberised surface used between the rails converting the horsetram into a rubber tyred horse bus is going to mean increased wear and tear on the horse meaning they need to see a vet far more, and that they'll have to be retired sooner (so they will require upkeep whilst making zero revenue plus another horse to be purchased to take their place).

 

The cheapest option would be to leave the trams as is. If they need to be separated from the traffic then lay a kerbstone each side of the double track, this allows you to tarmac either side, get rid of the parking bays and turn the useable potion of the summerland site into a park and ride. This gives you a dual carriageway down Douglas prom and gets rid of the parked cars which are the real problem on the promenade...

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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars (a mode of transport belonging to the 1950's and 60's - most modern cities are turning to alternative options such as tramways and railways - the Isle of Man and many of it's inhabitants are just typically behind the times as always not seeing the merits of such systems) are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

Edited by StuartT
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As I've said before if you're going to put the trams in a reservation then it should be on the landside rather than the seaward one. If the route was to substantially change I'd suggest a landward reservation from Derby Castle to the Villa, then through Strand and Duke Street to the Harbour as this is where the main body of modern passenger traffic is located.

 

Interesting routing suggested. How about double track Derby Castle to the Villa then loop of single track along Market Street, through new Lower Douglas development and then single track back along Prom. I heard rumour that current proposal was to finish tram at Regent Street or something though.

 

I made personal submission to Lower Douglas Master Plan planning consultation that at least the following should be included in requirements for Lower Douglas site in plan:

 

1. Siting and specifications for a high quality public transport interchange and facilities, and routing of trams and buses in connection with this interchange;

2. Route of the long-proposed cycleway (between existing cycleways at Quarterbridge and on the Promenade) through North Quay, Lord Street, Middlemarch and Parade Street sites) and associated specifications;

3. Minimum and maximum number of car parking spaces to be provided in Lord Street, Parade Street and Middlemarch sites, and encouragement for co-ordinated provision.

 

I think I'd go for that as a good routing suggestion, with a spur up to the Railway Station. Depending on the state of the cable car tracks (whether they're intact and structurally sound enough) up to the junction with Ridgeway Street it may even be possible to lift off the tarmac and run a horsetram up that way, though as the junction is missing and there's been extensive remodelling of that area in recent times there's probably a section missing between Victoria Clock and the horsetram tracks, plus some services may have severed some sections.

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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

I heard they have yellow submarines in La La Land too - is it true?

 

If you think people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - you need your bumps felt mate.

 

Will never happen. Uneconomic, unrealistic, unnecessary, unnatural, unneeded and the costs are unnumerable - to save and achieve WHAT?

 

 

 

 

.

Edited by Albert Tatlock
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Get rid of the parking bays on the prom too. We shouldn't be encouraging people to use cars, it's time to make it more convenient to use the alternatives instead.

 

Once the "alternatives" are in and running, then get rid of some parking places..... However, at the moment, people feel the need to be able to park in town. I don't live on or near a bus route, I don't live near an electric or steam railway track and I don't live near the horse tram! There is no pay or display coming in from the north, and why should I pay to park my car and then pay to get a bus into town, when I can park for 2 hours on the prom for free??

 

Out of town parking (at the nearest railway/tramway station) could be made inclusive with the tickets to get you into Douglas and to your destination beyond. Try to see the solutions and not the obstacles, it's not that difficult an option to resolve. Let's say hypothetically if they pulled the mirroring bus services and instead used smaller buses to feed to and from the various railway stations you'd be getting a better quality service for the same level of cost.

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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars (a mode of transport belonging to the 1950's and 60's - most modern cities are turning to alternative options such as tramways and railways - the Isle of Man and many of it's inhabitants are just typically behind the times as always not seeing the merits of such systems) are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

But the reality is that there'll be no investment in a practicable railway infrastructure. Not one that services the needs of the majority. Unlike cars and, dare i say, buses. As for the steam railway, i couldn't give two hoots that it attracts 'enthusiasts' who apparently add to our economy. In real terms, it's still a money-pit. Give it over to the said 'enthusiasts' and then see how long it lasts.

Same goes for the MER, the Snaefell run being the exception....

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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

I heard they have yellow submarines in La La Land too - is it true?

 

If you think people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - you need your bumps felt mate.

 

Will never happen. Uneconomic, unrealistic, unnecessary, unnatural, unneeded and the costs are unnumerable - to save and achieve WHAT?

 

 

 

 

.

 

Getting you fat f@ckers out of your car, utilising the infrastructures already in place and saving the NHS a fortune from having to treat you because of your lack of exercise because you're so damn lazy that you can't walk a little bit. As for La La land the amount of time you spend in the car avoiding exercise probably means you're closer to being a telly tubby than I ever will be...

 

Your problem is you're seeing things from the angle of how things are at the minute in this car obsessed society, not how I suggested they should be. More like get out of your house door the minute you see the hail and ride minibus approaching the stop outside your house, the bus takes 10 minutes to get to the station arriving at a set time to meet the train as it arrives at the station, a couple of minutes to get on board, arrive at the terminus where minibuses are waiting to take you pretty much to your office door. It's not that hard to put in place if you cut unecessary mirroring routes.

Edited by StuartT
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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

I heard they have yellow submarines in La La Land too - is it true?

 

If you think people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - you need your bumps felt mate.

 

Will never happen. Uneconomic, unrealistic, unnecessary, unnatural, unneeded and the costs are unnumerable - to save and achieve WHAT?

 

 

 

 

.

 

Getting you fat f@ckers out of your car, utilising the infrastructures already in place and saving the NHS a fortune from having to treat you because of your lack of exercise because you're so damn lazy that you can't walk a little bit.

Agghhh! Run away! - Nanny State Trams!

 

Infrastructure? You mean the 19th century museum piece tram system? No thanks mate.

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Whats the problem with the horse trams? only time they shouldn't be running is rush hour.

Well, my problem with the horse trams is that they lose money, year on year and are an out-dated, albeit quaint, form of transport, rush-hour or not. Who uses them? Tourists we don't have anymore? Back in the day, they were usually full of happy, smiling holidaymakers. I haven't seen one, in years, full to capacity.

 

So get rid.

 

Cars are filled to far less capacity than horsetrams and their occupants are rarely smiling.... more like time to get rid of the motorcars particularily as providing the expensive infrastructure for the fuel wasting luxuries cost far more than any other part of the Island's expenditure. Those of you who are too lazy to walk or cycle can use a railway system once the infrastructure has been invested in....

I heard they have yellow submarines in La La Land too - is it true?

 

If you think people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - you need your bumps felt mate.

 

Will never happen. Uneconomic, unrealistic, unnecessary, unnatural, unneeded and the costs are unnumerable - to save and achieve WHAT?

 

 

 

 

.

 

Getting you fat f@ckers out of your car, utilising the infrastructures already in place and saving the NHS a fortune from having to treat you because of your lack of exercise because you're so damn lazy that you can't walk a little bit.

I ain't no fat fucker and i get plenty of exercise. (My waist size hasn't changed in 30 years!) To defend your skewed reasoning by resorting to general insults just shows the fragility of that reasoning.

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Agghhh! Run away! - Nanny State Trams!

 

Infrastructure? You mean the 19th century museum piece tram system? No thanks mate.

 

Once you put the systems in place to make it work effectively you can invest more. If needs be pull the necessary revenue from the road budget. At least the money goes back into the government pocket rather than into the pockets of the greedy oil industry. If the petrol and motor companies had to put into place the infrastructure require to run their machines, then it would cost even more for petrol and cars than it currently does. As it is the whole industry freeloads off the back of the taxpayer far more than any railway system does. But car drivers won't see that because the fumes have already affected their cognitive abilities.....

Edited by StuartT
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Don't build rails at all. Save a load of cash, keep the horses in jobs.

This is easily the most sensible suggestion.

 

Hardly, it could end up costing more - it has the conversion costs, the issue of increased wear on the tarmac (exactly how long has the road surface lasted compared to the tramrails? Probably no where near as long. In addition the rails offer less rolling restance to the vehicle as a horsetram flange is far far narrower and much smoother than a car tire (plus the wheels are sprung loaded in such a way that the horse tram keeps rolling with little input from the horse once it has created the initial momentum) - therefore coupled with the fact the horse would be walking on conventional tarmac rather than the rubberised surface used between the rails converting the horsetram into a rubber tyred horse bus is going to mean increased wear and tear on the horse meaning they need to see a vet far more, and that they'll have to be retired sooner (so they will require upkeep whilst making zero revenue plus another horse to be purchased to take their place).

 

The cheapest option would be to leave the trams as is. If they need to be separated from the traffic then lay a kerbstone each side of the double track, this allows you to tarmac either side, get rid of the parking bays and turn the useable potion of the summerland site into a park and ride. This gives you a dual carriageway down Douglas prom and gets rid of the parked cars which are the real problem on the promenade...

(plus the wheels are sprung loaded in such a way that the horse tram keeps rolling with little input from the horse once it has created the initial momentum)

Is this where the F1 teams stole the idea for KERS technology from by any chance?

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Nope quilp you just show that you're totally unaware that in general most modern disorders which are on the increase such as obesity and type two diabetes are linked to the generally sedantery lifestyle and poor diet. Having to walk a bit would do a lot of people a lot of good....

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Agghhh! Run away! - Nanny State Trams!

 

Infrastructure? You mean the 19th century museum piece tram system? No thanks mate.

 

Once you put the systems in place to make it work effectively you can invest more. If needs be pull the necessary revenue from the road budget. At least the money goes back into the government pocket rather than into the pockets of the greedy oil industry. If the petrol and motor companies had to put into place the infrastructure require to run their machines, then it would cost even more for petrol and cars than it currently does. As it is the whole industry freeloads off the back of the taxpayer far more than any railway system does. But car drivers won't see that because the fumes have already affected their cognitive abilities.....

How about you stick with going back to the future plans,and the rest of us can look forward to using the next generation of personal transport that utilises sustainable energy sources(ie.electric vehicles recharged with renewable electricity).

Why don't you tell us whats affecting your cognitive abilities? We won't take the piss or anything, I promise.

Edited by Lisenchuk
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