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Health minister opposes cannabis rethink


thesultanofsheight
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If it was legal there would be no need for a couple of lads to import it on some fishing boat. Would be locally grown and sold, eliminating scenarios like this.

Right, but it isn't. So don't criticise the police for going after 100k of contraband. Protest decriminalisation sure, but the coppers are just doing their jobs.

And please dont be fooled by the 'street' value of £110k. Its a lot less.

Yeah, it's a crap way of sensationalising the bust, they should report weight. I doubt 'a few ounces' would warrant two blokes and a boat though.
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If it was legal there would be no need for a couple of lads to import it on some fishing boat. Would be locally grown and sold, eliminating scenarios like this.

Right, but it isn't. So don't criticise the police for going after 100k of contraband. Protest decriminalisation sure, but the coppers are just doing their jobs.

>And please dont be fooled by the 'street' value of £110k. Its a lot less.

Yeah, it's a crap way of sensationalising the bust, they should report weight. I doubt 'a few ounces' would warrant two blokes and a boat though.

 

 

I wasnt criticising the Police per say, but I do have a problem with people (Police or not) blindly 'following orders'. I recall a bunch of guys in the 1940's were just 'following orders', and that didnt work out too well.

 

Still, the OP from 2bee was more directed at Alan Bell I thought anyway. He says his personal view is that Cannabis should be decriminalized at the least. Then the next day/week, the police, under his policy and 'orders' shall we say, are busting some young lad (denting his future) for the exact same topic he was just saying should be relaxed. You then said 'well having 1 joint isnt exactly the same as importing/supplying' and my point was these young lads wouldnt have to be importing this stuff in the first place if it was legal. Ontop of that, these lads are only importing it BECAUSE of the money. Again, legalisation takes that incentive/intisement away.

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I wasnt criticising the Police per say, but I do have a problem with people (Police or not) blindly 'following orders'. I recall a bunch of guys in the 1940's were just 'following orders', and that didnt work out too well.

Godwins. You think the law should be optional? Let me know how you feel when some scumbag clears out your house.

Still, the OP from 2bee was more directed at Alan Bell I thought anyway. He says his personal view is that Cannabis should be decriminalized at the least. Then the next day/week, the police, under his policy and 'orders' shall we say, are busting some young lad (denting his future) for the exact same topic he was just saying should be relaxed. You then said 'well having 1 joint isnt exactly the same as importing/supplying' and my point was these young lads wouldnt have to be importing this stuff in the first place if it was legal. Ontop of that, these lads are only importing it BECAUSE of the money. Again, legalisation takes that incentive/intisement away.

The CM expressed his personal view that there was justification for a fresh debate, and that he thought cannabis use should be a health matter, not a criminal matter. He didn't say anything more than that. I'm not a fan of our drugs laws either, but I also don't want dealers who can fund 100k shipments to walk around unchallenged. I imagine there's some unpleasant people involved in that supply chain and I'm glad the police are providing a deterrent. The idea of staging a protest against this kind of bust is mind boggling.
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So when it was against the law to be gay, did the coppers actively pursue the king of the gays? Did they? No, they caught half a dozen medium sized gays who were knocking one off over each other in the loos at Nobles park (or something like that - I wasn't there) - which is exactly the same scenario as we have here, only I don't know any stoners that hang out in the loos at a park blowing smoke at each other.

 

Oh yez are all so fickle and law abiding, I do have to laugh.

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So when it was against the law to be gay, did the coppers actively pursue the king of the gays? Did they? No, they caught half a dozen medium sized gays who were knocking one off over each other in the loos at Nobles park (or something like that - I wasn't there) - which is exactly the same scenario as we have here, only I don't know any stoners that hang out in the loos at a park blowing smoke at each other.

It's not the same thing at all. It'd be the same as someone selling 100k worth of bottom action. You really don't see the difference in large scale supply and recreational use?
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So the pot belonged to the fisherman and his Douglas butty? They're not middle men?

 

Probably Allan Bell's personal stash coming in.......

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I wasnt criticising the Police per say, but I do have a problem with people (Police or not) blindly 'following orders'. I recall a bunch of guys in the 1940's were just 'following orders', and that didnt work out too well.

Godwins. You think the law should be optional? Let me know how you feel when some scumbag clears out your house.

>>>Still, the OP from 2bee was more directed at Alan Bell I thought anyway. He says his personal view is that Cannabis should be decriminalized at the least. Then the next day/week, the police, under his policy and 'orders' shall we say, are busting some young lad (denting his future) for the exact same topic he was just saying should be relaxed. You then said 'well having 1 joint isnt exactly the same as importing/supplying' and my point was these young lads wouldnt have to be importing this stuff in the first place if it was legal. Ontop of that, these lads are only importing it BECAUSE of the money. Again, legalisation takes that incentive/intisement away.

The CM expressed his personal view that there was justification for a fresh debate, and that he thought cannabis use should be a health matter, not a criminal matter. He didn't say anything more than that. I'm not a fan of our drugs laws either, but I also don't want dealers who can fund 100k shipments to walk around unchallenged. I imagine there's some unpleasant people involved in that supply chain and I'm glad the police are providing a deterrent. The idea of staging a protest against this kind of bust is mind boggling.

 

 

Sorry but having issues with the Police blindly following orders is not the same as considering the law optional, its not as 'black' and 'white' as that. Its like saying what the Nazi's did was fine because they were just following Hitlers 'law' and orders. Yes I want the laws to change but realistically, what impact could I, or anyone else with the same views have on anything? Voting for the lesser or two evils gets you no where. I dont claim to have the answers, but I wish the guys with the power (Alan Bell) would do something (especially if their OWN personal views coincide) to spark a change and stop being massive pussies.

 

You seem to be constantly missing the point too, "but I also don't want dealers who can fund 100k shipments to walk around unchallenged". For the third time, could you please tell me how, if it was legal (and therefore bought/grown locally), this scenario with these 2 guys would have occured? My guess is that they wouldnt have bothered in the very first place as there is ZERO demand for their black market services. Unless you just have a problem with "bad guys" having 100k to spend?

 

And if the detterent theory is so effective, why has the war on drugs been a complete failure and we're still having guys risk their lives trying to smuggle some weed? Surely if the detterent theory is working, we wouldnnt have just had 2 guys attempt to smuggle a load of weed because it would have occured to them that thousands of people have been caught in the past, putting them off the idea? And please, dont say "Oh well then clearly we need to step up our number of busts so its an even greater detterent". Where do you stop? How do we know what a "good" amount of smugglers being stopped is? Maybe if there's always a demand, there will always be a supply? Making it pointless to even try with this approach (I can see similarities between alcohol prohibition..).

Edited by 3allz
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I wasnt criticising the Police per say, but I do have a problem with people (Police or not) blindly 'following orders'. I recall a bunch of guys in the 1940's were just 'following orders', and that didnt work out too well.

Godwins. You think the law should be optional? Let me know how you feel when some scumbag clears out your house.

>>>Still, the OP from 2bee was more directed at Alan Bell I thought anyway. He says his personal view is that Cannabis should be decriminalized at the least. Then the next day/week, the police, under his policy and 'orders' shall we say, are busting some young lad (denting his future) for the exact same topic he was just saying should be relaxed. You then said 'well having 1 joint isnt exactly the same as importing/supplying' and my point was these young lads wouldnt have to be importing this stuff in the first place if it was legal. Ontop of that, these lads are only importing it BECAUSE of the money. Again, legalisation takes that incentive/intisement

away.
The CM expressed his personal view that there was justification for a fresh debate, and that he thought cannabis use should be a health matter, not a criminal matter. He didn't say anything more than that. I'm not a fan of our drugs laws either, but I also don't want dealers who can fund 100k shipments to walk around unchallenged. I imagine there's some unpleasant people involved in that supply chain and I'm glad the police are providing a deterrent. The idea of staging a protest against this kind of bust is mind boggling.

 

Sorry but having issues with the Police blindly following orders is not the same as considering the law optional, its not as 'black' and 'white' as that. Its like saying what the Nazi's did was fine because they were just following Hitlers 'law' and orders. Yes I want the laws to change but realistically, what impact could I, or anyone else with the same views have on anything? Voting for the lesser or two evils gets you no where. I dont claim to have the answers, but I wish the guys with the power (Alan Bell) would do something (especially if their OWN personal views coincide) to spark a change and stop being massive pussies.

 

You seem to be constantly missing the point too, "but I also don't want dealers who can fund 100k shipments to walk around unchallenged". For the third time, could you please tell me how, if it was legal (and therefore bought/grown locally), this scenario with these 2 guys would have occured? My guess is that they wouldnt have bothered in the very first place as there is ZERO demand for their black market services. Unless you just have a problem with "bad guys" having 100k to spend?

 

And if the detterent theory is so effective, why has the war on drugs been a complete failure and we're still having guys risk their lives trying to smuggle some weed? Surely if the detterent theory is working, we wouldnnt have just had 2 guys attempt to smuggle a load of weed because it would have occured to them that thousands of people have been caught in the past, putting them off the idea? And please, dont say "Oh well then clearly we need to step up our number of busts so its an even greater detterent". Where do you stop? How do we know what a "good" amount of smugglers being stopped is? Maybe if there's always a demand, there will always be a supply? Making it pointless to even try with this approach (I can see similarities between alcohol prohibition..).

 

 

 

A very good post, you can't really argue against the logic.

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If it was legal there would be no need for a couple of lads to import it on some fishing boat. Would be locally grown and sold, eliminating scenarios like this.

Right, but it isn't. So don't criticise the police for going after 100k of contraband. Protest decriminalisation sure, but the coppers are just doing their jobs.

>And please dont be fooled by the 'street' value of £110k. Its a lot

less.
Yeah, it's a crap way of sensationalising the bust, they should report weight. I doubt 'a few ounces' would warrant two blokes and a boat though.

 

I wasnt criticising the Police per say, but I do have a problem with people (Police or not) blindly 'following orders'. I recall a bunch of guys in the 1940's were just 'following orders', and that didnt work out too well.

 

Still, the OP from 2bee was more directed at Alan Bell I thought anyway. He says his personal view is that Cannabis should be decriminalized at the least. Then the next day/week, the police, under his policy and 'orders' shall we say, are busting some young lad (denting his future) for the exact same topic he was just saying should be relaxed. You then said 'well having 1 joint isnt exactly the same as importing/supplying' and my point was these young lads wouldnt have to be importing this stuff in the first place if it was legal. Ontop of that, these lads are only importing it BECAUSE of the money. Again, legalisation takes that incentive/intisement away.

 

 

You say they blindly follow orders what they are following here is the law not blindly following orders. At the end of the day they are human beings they have mortgages/rent to pay families to feed if their sergeant or Inspector tells them to do something they do it they might not like it and can raise it to superior officers but when a higher ranking officer tells you to do something you do it unless you fancy being on the dole. I do enjoy how everone is an expert without doing the job do people tell their surgeon how to operate on them or their dentist how to do root canal surgery? as for any protest if your unhappy with how the law is no point in protesting outside a cop shop go to your MHK

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NEVER compare a police man/woman with a doctor, dentist or vet - ever. That's like comparing pot smoking with gayness....totally redickuless.

 

 

Much as it pains me....I do have to agree with you (in part) about the seeing your MHK (which I have done & not just mine...), you seem to have missed the point I was making which was, pin pointing certain people is mean & totally unfair, if all the people who have ever smoked pot turned up at the police station it would make for a fair playing field - Arrest them all type of thing.

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