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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, rodders said:

I got told this by a chef that works for the brewery. From April 1st, all tips are to be sent to the brewery. The brewery are going to take a 20% cut, with the rest being shared out between the staff through their pay-packets, ensuring the tips are taxed. He ain't happy at all. 

That's all I was told. I wasn't told whether the tips will be divvied up per establishment or across the brewery as a whole. I cannot say for certain if it's 100% truth.

Is this a wind up , when I tip someone for good service it's a personal gift ( and given separately to that paying the bill)?

If the brewery take the tip and redistribute it as they think fit , taking some for themselves it's 'theft' in my book .

When I worked in pubs/restaurants, way back ,you 'worked' your tips, by smiling being friendly giving good and prompt service and being attentive , if my workmates adopted a similar attitude we split the tips if not then my tips were mine .

I got paid so little for waiting on back then without the tips it 'wouldn't have been worth the candle'

Rant over :D

Edited by paswt
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59 minutes ago, paswt said:

Is this a wind up , when I tip someone for good service it's a personal gift ( and given separately to that paying the bill)?

If the brewery take the tip and redistribute it as they think fit , taking some for themselves it's 'theft' in my book .

When I worked in pubs/restaurants, way back ,you 'worked' your tips, by smiling being friendly giving good and prompt service and being attentive , if my workmates adopted a similar attitude we split the tips if not then my tips were mine .

I got paid so little for waiting on back then without the tips it 'wouldn't have been worth the candle'

Rant over :D

We always tip too, but maybe we should just try to stuff a fiver in the waitresses hand and not pay the tip at the till.

Maybe the brewery would have to pay more for staff when the chefs all bugger off.

Nobody should EVER have to rely on tips to make a living. Shameful situation..( I always ask when paying by card if the tip goes directly to the staff, as if not I either give a cash tip for the jar, or even nothing if it goes to the brewery.)

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Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, Dave Hedgehog said:

State of the food in the brewery pubs I doubt the ‘chefs’ need worry about this affecting them too much.

You get what you pay for or, are willing to spend  for your needs that night.

If you want a trio of Lamb chops or deep fried Cod, the pub will do it better that you can at home because they have the griddle or big fryer and it wont go soggy in the paper from the chip shop!

You don't want to pay that much? Go for the Hamburger and in all cases. allow time for your food to be prepared, 10 mins and you're back at the bar complaining that your food is taking too long? Go home and see if you can produce it as well and quicker!

 

 

Chefs in Pubs getting tips!!! When did that start??? Maybe that's what it's all about?

 

 

 

Edited by Kopek
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Could be to do with not wanting to be indirectly facilitating tax avoidance. Tips are taxable income. If they take control of tips and then pay them with wages, they would then have tax deducted.

As long as all tips are shared out and the company make no gain, that's OK I guess. However I do like to think I'm tipping a particular person for a job well done.

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18 minutes ago, Capt_Mainwaring said:

Could be to do with not wanting to be indirectly facilitating tax avoidance. Tips are taxable income. If they take control of tips and then pay them with wages, they would then have tax deducted.

As long as all tips are shared out and the company make no gain, that's OK I guess. However I do like to think I'm tipping a particular person for a job well done.

Taxing tips, whatever next!

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If the Company take 20% out of the tips, that is the VAT element but the company will not pay 20% to the C & e, they will pay 20% less their input tax. If it is a means of fairly sharing the tips with the backroom people, rather than than the bar staff getting it all, then that might be a gain for the kitchen.

Are HnB suddenly in sympathy with Alf Cannan or is this a directive from the Treasury?

Best is to leave it as is, ie. the bar staff get the tips and the kitchen staff get paid more?.

 

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15 minutes ago, Kopek said:

If the Company take 20% out of the tips, that is the VAT element but the company will not pay 20% to the C & e, they will pay 20% less their input tax. If it is a means of fairly sharing the tips with the backroom people, rather than than the bar staff getting it all, then that might be a gain for the kitchen.

Are HnB suddenly in sympathy with Alf Cannan or is this a directive from the Treasury?

Best is to leave it as is, ie. the bar staff get the tips and the kitchen staff get paid more?.

 

We really have hit rock bottom if we're taxing a few coppers gifted to minimum wage (or less) worker's!

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Posted (edited)

If this is true, I think it is likely that income tax is at the bottom of it, not H&B profits or VAT. Gratuities given freely to staff are outside the scope of VAT, and I would very much doubt that H&B are among those unscrupulous employers who insist on taking a cut of the tips for themselves. Perhaps the Income Tax Division has had a quiet word? As has been said above, tips are taxable income and indeed this is nothing new. Many years ago back in the UK when I was much younger and wetter, I did some poorly remunerated bar work as a second job. The basic bar wage was taxed by the pub on an SB (0T in the UK) standard rate code and, to add insult to injury, not only did the Inland Revenue tax your tips, they ASSUMED the level of tips you would get and taxed you accordingly via an adjustment to your PAYE code and deducted it at source from your main employment salary. They made no allowance either for whether you were a pretty girl or a hairy beardy git like me. Total bastards.

This led to me jacking the job in as I would rather forego the pay than give them the tax.

Edited by woolley
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5 hours ago, woolley said:

If this is true, I think it is likely that income tax is at the bottom of it, not H&B profits or VAT. Gratuities given freely to staff are outside the scope of VAT, and I would very much doubt that H&B are among those unscrupulous employers who insist on taking a cut of the tips for themselves. Perhaps the Income Tax Division has had a quiet word? As has been said above, tips are taxable income and indeed this is nothing new. Many years ago back in the UK when I was much younger and wetter, I did some poorly remunerated bar work as a second job. The basic bar wage was taxed by the pub on an SB (0T in the UK) standard rate code and, to add insult to injury, not only did the Inland Revenue tax your tips, they ASSUMED the level of tips you would get and taxed you accordingly via an adjustment to your PAYE code and deducted it at source from your main employment salary. They made no allowance either for whether you were a pretty girl or a hairy beardy git like me. Total bastards.

This led to me jacking the job in as I would rather forego the pay than give them the tax.

When I read the OP comments I thought that perhaps Income Tax was behind this as well.

And my immediate reaction was..... there's a barrel that needs scraping!

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14 hours ago, rodders said:

I got told this by a chef that works for the brewery.  bloke down the pub

I corrected you post for clarity.

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Danger here is that IOMG will now give Chefs/cooks a tax code that assumes they are receiving tips

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Tips are taxable and have been since at least 1946. Anyone receiving tips should declare them on their tax return and pay whatever is due.

Section 2 of the Income Tax Act 1970 (and you will see from the margin note that the root clause was from the 1946 Act) https://www.legislation.gov.im/cms/images/LEGISLATION/PRINCIPAL/1970/1970-0003/IncomeTaxAct1970_35.pdf

"gratuities made to or received by any employed person by reason of or in the course of his employment"

 

That said, the tax office has issued nothing recently which indicates a crackdown on tips and I agree that its hardly likely to be a big issue for Alf (especially as the general consensus is that restaurants and service is shit here in any case).

This will be an H & B thing if indeed its true. Most likely connected to distribution of tips made by card.

 

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4 minutes ago, piebaps said:

Tips are taxable and have been since at least 1946. Anyone receiving tips should declare them on their tax return and pay whatever is due.

Section 2 of the Income Tax Act 1970 (and you will see from the margin note that the root clause was from the 1946 Act) https://www.legislation.gov.im/cms/images/LEGISLATION/PRINCIPAL/1970/1970-0003/IncomeTaxAct1970_35.pdf

"gratuities made to or received by any employed person by reason of or in the course of his employment"

 

That said, the tax office has issued nothing recently which indicates a crackdown on tips and I agree that its hardly likely to be a big issue for Alf (especially as the general consensus is that restaurants and service is shit here in any case).

This will be an H & B thing if indeed its true. Most likely connected to distribution of tips made by card.

 

I'll stick my neck out here and guess that not many people declare tips on their tax returns. There, I've said it...

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5 minutes ago, Neil Down said:

I'll stick my neck out here and guess that not many people declare tips on their tax returns. There, I've said it...

Many bar staff don't work enough hours to reach the lower tax threshold.

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