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Applebys: Something or other about planes and VAT. CM says Panic!


Declan
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1 minute ago, Albert Tatlock said:

It's really simple...UK has access to info...not acted on. Lax UK govt.

Err no. The IoM is responsible for enforcing the VAT legislation in the IoM not the UK. It used to be the UK and the IoM were just a UK VAT district. I think it changed in 1979. We are as 1 with the UK for VAT as our VAT position is totally reliant on hanging on to the UK's coat. Loose that and the IoM is truly stuffed although I am sure one or two will argue that if we had abrogation we would be quids in.   

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And that (my last post, previous page), incidentally, is why nothing much will change. They want the money to stay within British jurisdiction and flow through the City. They might issue some stern words. Maybe a rap over the knuckles but ultimately the system is better than the alternative to the people who matter.

Edited by woolley
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4 minutes ago, b4mbi said:

but there is no alternative to that! The voting demographic is not large enough for political party politics. I'd much rather have a bunch of individuals coming to a consensus rather than a two party system where power swings from one to the other.

That's not actually true.  A lot of places with a smaller population have party politics (Gibraltar for instance).  It seems to be more associated with islands around Britain - not just us and the Channel Islands, but the Island Councils in Scotland as well.

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The truth is that the UK facilitate avoiding tax.

They could quite easily deal with Apple, Google,  Facebook etc but they don't want to.    

The Mrs Brown's Boys lot was an interesting one.  But again, it appears an external (to the uk) production company supplies a product for which the actors appear to be paid offshore.   Are those actors living in the UK?  It's quite some system if they do, that allows them to obtain their pay in this manner.  But again they could stop this by simply stopping any form of loan being untaxed.  What they could do is tax the loan and then the recipient would simply pay back the company the net amount which would not be an issue if it was a genuine loan.

 

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26 minutes ago, notwell said:

I thought they were a bit light on facts really.

They have a Lewis Hamilton soundbite although at worst that appears to be a partial over refund?

Big Howard did better than I thought he'd do to be fair.

Does anyone know for a fact that VAT taken on the jets has formed any part of figures used to agree the current VAT payments from the UK?

I'm not talking about the BBC Panorama programme. You do know that a lot has been written about this in print media, press releases, and in parliamentary discussions? That will have a lot more impact than what was covered in some lame ass BBC programme. The facts are the facts and won't be affected by a TV programme. And the facts point to massive political pressure to review the VAT arrangement and other tax arrangements and close up loopholes.

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9 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

Err no. The IoM is responsible for enforcing the VAT legislation in the IoM not the UK. It used to be the UK and the IoM were just a UK VAT district. I think it changed in 1979. We are as 1 with the UK for VAT as our VAT position is totally reliant on hanging on to the UK's coat. Loose that and the IoM is truly stuffed although I am sure one or two will argue that if we had abrogation we would be quids in.   

If VAT is the be all and end all how do Jersey cope?

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Regarding the form of government, I think the answer that was given to Apple (?) could have been a lot more positive for them, and indeed more accurate.

The Isle of Man has never in its history had any significant party politics and so there has never been an opposition worth bothering about. The Isle of Man Government and authorities are reliant on and absolutely compliant to the finance sector (as demonstrated with the doorstepping).

Ah well, like The Film Industry supporters keep saying "we nearly had The Kings Speech you know", we could have been home to Apple.

 

Edited by gettafa
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3 minutes ago, notwell said:

The truth is that the UK facilitate avoiding tax.

They could quite easily deal with Apple, Google,  Facebook etc but they don't want to.    

The Mrs Brown's Boys lot was an interesting one.  But again, it appears an external (to the uk) production company supplies a product for which the actors appear to be paid offshore.   Are those actors living in the UK?  It's quite some system if they do, that allows them to obtain their pay in this manner.  But again they could stop this by simply stopping any form of loan being untaxed.  What they could do is tax the loan and then the recipient would simply pay back the company the net amount which would not be an issue if it was a genuine loan.

 

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Just now, gettafa said:

The Isle of Man has never in its history had any significant party politics and so there has never been an opposition worth bothering about.

Political parties are a waste of space and reduce democracy rather than expand on it. They increase a binary herd mentality rather than promote genuine opposition.

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Just now, Operation Mockingbird said:

I'm not talking about the BBC Panorama programme. You do know that a lot has been written about this in print media, press releases, and in parliamentary discussions? That will have a lot more impact than what was covered in some lame ass BBC programme. The facts are the facts and won't be affected by a TV programme. And the facts point to massive political pressure to review the VAT arrangement and other tax arrangements and close up loopholes.

But the rules are pretty clear anyway on VAT.

Clearly if there is a mistake then it nerds rectified.  

If Hamilton imported the Jet into the UK as a business lease jet would he pay VAT on it? 

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Just now, notwell said:

But the rules are pretty clear anyway on VAT.

Clearly if there is a mistake then it nerds rectified.  

If Hamilton imported the Jet into the UK as a business lease jet would he pay VAT on it? 

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5 minutes ago, woolley said:

They were getting a bit nearer to apportioning the "blame" where it belongs towards the end. The UK facilitates all of this. It is a complete fantasy to suppose that all of these British offshore territories are so smart that they run rings around London operating all kinds of abusive structures with impunity. If London wanted to shut it all down it could do so tomorrow with one email to each governor. The losses to the City of London would be catastrophic, all of the territories would become a burden on the exchequer and the people who actually have the power in the country - and I don't mean anyone at Westminster - would lose their nice tax avoiding gravy trains.

Totally agree. We are left to do our own thing provided we do not draw to much attention to ourselves for one reason or the other. Start abusing that or taking the micky then they tweek things to reign us back in.

I think I said pre program that my best guess of the upshot is that Appleby will have to ride the bad publicity, but for the IoM it will at worst mean no or little new business for the aircraft registry as they are told to stop the VAT reclaims and a tightening of IoM finances is indirect tax split becomes slightly less favourable. As you say the UK want us to an extent cos of the money channelled to the UK and they do not want to have to end up funding the IoM to keep afloat.  We just need to keep our heads down and not draw attention to ourselves to much

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