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Smart Meters are coming

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 The money saving reason is almost meaningless, with households saving on average £30 a year.  

Agreed but that is not the fault of the equipment. It is the fault of the user not doing anything about the information that is presented. The higher the unit charge the more the potential saving and we must have one of the highest per unit charges around. However the big money saving for the supplier not having to drive a van around the island to read your meter 6 times a year is obvious.

 

- They do not work well in areas of poor cell phone reception (That's Governor's Hill then), and this can lead to false readings.

What evidence do you have to support the fact that they can give false readings? If there is no GSM signal then obviously they can't be remotely read but still can be accurately read manually if all else fails. There is hardly anywhere on the rock apart from Andy's garden in Onchan where the is zero GSM reception. If they work in my son's cellar in a very rural part of the Peak District, there must be very few places they don't.  

 

- They can cause fires if poorly fitted.

So can any meter smart or otherwise. This very rare issue is not just a problem with smart meters. As woody would say, this is fake news. The Daily Wail and Watchdog stories that reported this put it down to the installer rather than the equipment. That is an entirely different issue.

 

The big advantage to the user is they make it easier to switch providers which is irrelevant here.

No, whilst irrelevant to the IOM if you swop suppliers, they rarely install a new meter. Apparently the reverse could be true if the smart meter cannot contact the new supplier which has been reported.

 

My concern would be that useage patterns can very quickly be established and charging systems adapted to charge more at peak times. I would only have concerns about this if there wasn't a commensurate drop in off peak times.

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19 hours ago, yootalkin2me said:

Well if you want to be in the Tufty club you have to play by Tufty's rules otherwise start your own club.

"Tufty's emigrated to Oz!!.

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I

14 minutes ago, ballaughbiker said:

 The money saving reason is almost meaningless, with households saving on average £30 a year.  

Agreed but that is not the fault of the equipment. It is the fault of the user not doing anything about the information that is presented. The higher the unit charge the more the potential saving and we must have one of the highest per unit charges around. However the big money saving for the supplier not having to drive a van around the island to read your meter 6 times a year is obvious.

 

- They do not work well in areas of poor cell phone reception (That's Governor's Hill then), and this can lead to false readings.

What evidence do you have to support the fact that they can give false readings? If there is no GSM signal then obviously they can't be remotely read but still can be accurately read manually if all else fails. There is hardly anywhere on the rock apart from Andy's garden in Onchan where the is zero GSM reception. If they work in my son's cellar in a very rural part of the Peak District, there must be very few places they don't.  

 

- They can cause fires if poorly fitted.

So can any meter smart or otherwise. This very rare issue is not just a problem with smart meters. As woody would say, this is fake news. The Daily Wail and Watchdog stories that reported this put it down to the installer rather than the equipment. That is an entirely different issue.

 

The big advantage to the user is they make it easier to switch providers which is irrelevant here.

No, whilst irrelevant to the IOM if you swop suppliers, they rarely install a new meter. Apparently the reverse could be true if the smart meter cannot contact the new supplier which has been reported.

 

My concern would be that useage patterns can very quickly be established and charging systems adapted to charge more at peak times. I would only have concerns about this if there wasn't a commensurate drop in off peak times.

I think you will find either side of Baldrine main road is particularly bad, as is Sulby. parts of Laxey and some western spots. Unless this project can be rolled out over all the Island then there will be no perceived benefit.

Despite what you say above I still think this is one of those 'nice to have' things.

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It is a nicer thing to have, no doubt, Andy. We have managed perfectly well up to now, but it seems a better way, generally. 

There are bound to be some GSM zeo coverage spots but I'd wager that is a tiny percentage of the island's properties. MT reckon they have 95% 4G coverage. I just wish my house was in that....:unsure:. No system will be perfect but I am always wary of the general whataboutery we suffer on here with anything new.

I just hope they don't buy some meters cheap because they are (for example) out of date or have another issue. They haven't fixed that new airport radar yet......

Edit, not sure why Sulby is a problem area. MT have a cell in the middle of the village and Sure have one opposite the Ginger. I suppose somewhere in the back of Old Sulby or up the glen might be a bit thin on signal.

Edited by ballaughbiker

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1 hour ago, ballaughbiker said:

 The money saving reason is almost meaningless, with households saving on average £30 a year.  

Agreed but that is not the fault of the equipment. It is the fault of the user not doing anything about the information that is presented. The higher the unit charge the more the potential saving and we must have one of the highest per unit charges around. However the big money saving for the supplier not having to drive a van around the island to read your meter 6 times a year is obvious.

Agreed to an extent. However how easy is it for the user to make these saving given that the meter only gives you the overall usage figure. It is a fair bit of detective work to work out which devices make the most difference, and then are these devices that the user is prepared to live without. The fact is these are marketed as money saving devices to the user which in real life they are not.

I also agree that the main reason for these things is that in time it eventually saves the supplier money. However what the R.O.I. on 18million is is highly debatable. Plus we will be asked to pay in some way for the upfront investment, and I think its a safe bet to say we will never see the benefit of it passed on in the longer term.

- They do not work well in areas of poor cell phone reception (That's Governor's Hill then), and this can lead to false readings.

What evidence do you have to support the fact that they can give false readings? If there is no GSM signal then obviously they can't be remotely read but still can be accurately read manually if all else fails. There is hardly anywhere on the rock apart from Andy's garden in Onchan where the is zero GSM reception. If they work in my son's cellar in a very rural part of the Peak District, there must be very few places they don't.  

I am mealy quoting articles read from newspaper reports found on the internet. There are many areas of the IOM that have poor mobile signal (maybe not no signal). We have issues in our home near Governors Hill and have been told that the issue exists due to few masts in the area.

- They can cause fires if poorly fitted.

So can any meter smart or otherwise. This very rare issue is not just a problem with smart meters. As woody would say, this is fake news. The Daily Wail and Watchdog stories that reported this put it down to the installer rather than the equipment. That is an entirely different issue.

Fair point. However lets remember the Manx gas conversion and how well the subcontractor did with those installations!

The big advantage to the user is they make it easier to switch providers which is irrelevant here.

No, whilst irrelevant to the IOM if you swop suppliers, they rarely install a new meter. Apparently the reverse could be true if the smart meter cannot contact the new supplier which has been reported.

I believe the advantage comes from knowing your energy usage profile and being able to better match it to a plan a supplier offers before you switch.

My concern would be that useage patterns can very quickly be established and charging systems adapted to charge more at peak times. I would only have concerns about this if there wasn't a commensurate drop in off peak times.

Overall I still maintain that I see little or no advantage to the user for this huge outlay. However I do see the potential for cost to us.

Due to reckless lending and massive debt the Isle of Man is in a strange situation where the vested interest of the energy supplier to make us use more energy matches that of the government (as they are essentially the same group). Therefore we should be very nervous of the MUA committing to any more massive spends as the likelihood is we again will be the ones to pay..

Edited by Millman
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Therefore we should be very nervous of the MUA committing to any more massive spends as the likelihood is we again will be the ones to pay..

We will definitely be the ones who will pay.

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4 hours ago, ballaughbiker said:

We will definitely be the ones who will pay.

its worse than that-they are taking out a loan so it costs even more......

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8 hours ago, woody2 said:

its worse than that-they are taking out a loan so it costs even more......

With their record on loans it's a wonder anybody will touch them..... :lol:

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23 hours ago, Andy Onchan said:

 

I

I think you will find either side of Baldrine main road is particularly bad, as is Sulby. parts of Laxey and some western spots. Unless this project can be rolled out over all the Island then there will be no perceived benefit.

Despite what you say above I still think this is one of those 'nice to have' things.

This is where your 5G technology comes in. The plan is to have a 5G transmitter on every lamppost and more areas besides. The timeframe for smart meters is coincidentally the same as the proposed 5G rollout. In theory.

Completely unnecessary, unless you are working from a directive from the UK to get it done. In which case the money will be found.

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5 hours ago, Non-Believer said:

With their record on loans it's a wonder anybody will touch them..... :lol:

wonga......

its only £30 million.......

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They have some pretty smart vans so they may make a few bob flogging those.   There are some really nice vans on the road on the moment owned by the water board, Corpy etc. top of the range, glad they can afford them must have generous backers....hold on they do...us.

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