Jump to content
Manx Forums, Live Chat, Blogs & Classifieds for the Isle of Man
slinkydevil

TT 2019 - Megathread

Recommended Posts

41 minutes ago, Chutney said:

So where exactly does one find an up to date road closure list and their plans for tomorrow  

http://www.iomtoday.co.im/article.cfm?id=50457&headline=Festival of Motorcycling: Delay to Monday's race schedule, MGP Newcomers race postponed until Tuesday&sectionIs=sport&searchyear=2019

Try This. 

Newspaper makes an effort to update their website. Manx Radio operated by Civil Servants - hence the lack of information, and today being a bank holiday. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The way they post relevant information is piss poor. It’s a clear ‘fuck you’ to the residents. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Chutney said:

The way they post relevant information is piss poor. It’s a clear ‘fuck you’ to the residents. 

It’s petty political playing. or news manipulation to suit their own agenda,

i have found overall information on race and practice, road closures not as good as previous years. Manx Radio standards have slipped, due to their squabbling and automatic sense of entitlement over broadcasting of the TT etc. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, MrPB said:

It does, You must have something wrong with your eyesight.

“There is good news for passengers. Foot passenger fares will be frozen until a new vessel replaces the Ben-my-Chree and 450,000 special offer fares will be made available each year, compared to 275,000 under the current deal.”

Many other statements have been made too about ownership encouraging tourist development for the IOM. Why else would they spend £125m if it had no potential to increase tourism numbers? But the fact is SPC fares seem to be actively putting people off coming here at peak times now the SPC is in public ownership. 

But your claim is that the purchase is to increase tourist numbers. It wasn’t. It was to secure the island life line for the island, freight supplies and for most of the year us residents.

The new agreement isn’t in force yet, so can’t have affected this year’s fares, and the Steam Packet have used a version of market demand pricing ( like budget airlines ) for years. You’d expect higher prices at times of peak demand.

Have you any evidence, other than anecdotal, that people ( general, not individual ) are put off from coming. Aren’t the TT and MGP ferry services full, over subscribed. What gain would there be in reducing prices? If they’re full they can’t squeeze on the extra passengers a fare reduction might attract.

Its a truth that for most of the year there is over capacity AND that fares are less in real terms than 41 years ago when Manx Line introduced competition. But yet tourists don’t flock here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Have you any evidence, other than anecdotal, that people ( general, not individual ) are put off from coming.

Yes, I've seen posts on Facebook and elsewhere from qualified marshals from the UK have complained about pricing for the FOM and not come this year.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, GD4ELI said:

Yes, I've seen posts on Facebook and elsewhere from qualified marshals from the UK have complained about pricing for the FOM and not come this year.

 

That’s anecdotal. It happens every year. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, MrPB said:

I thought you understood what anecdotal means. The example I used was not anecdotal it was specifically related to a relative who chose to fly because the cost of the boat was outrageous. I have also spoken to a few visitors who thought fares were a rip off too and who said they wouldn’t be back though that is anecdotal. The fact is fares charged by our own government via our own national shipping line would appear to be actively disincentivising tourism. 

that's the plan.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, MrPB said:

I thought you understood what anecdotal means. The example I used was not anecdotal it was specifically related to a relative who chose to fly because the cost of the boat was outrageous. I have also spoken to a few visitors who thought fares were a rip off too and who said they wouldn’t be back though that is anecdotal. The fact is fares charged by our own government via our own national shipping line would appear to be actively disincentivising tourism. 

I do understand.

You don’t.

Do you understand the meaning of “arms length”?

What do you say is different about the 2019 fare pricing structure from previous years, given we are still using the old user agreement.

The new pricing structure, the freeze, ( foot passenger fares only - not with bikes, cars, vans or freight ) will make no meaningful difference. Neither will the extra special fares as the specials were a minimum and Steam Packet already offers that number, in off peak times.

The purchase deal was sold to Tynwald and the public on the basis that the debt payment was to be recovered from revenue profits over 7 years. So it was neutral.

You say it’s actively disincentivising  tourism. But the boats are full and passengers can fly.

Until it’s known how much the new boats will cost, and I’m betting on double the figures in the estimates at the time of the purchase, fares can’t be reduced at peak times, nor should they. That won’t increase tourism. It’s full then.

Cheaper fares at other times may incentivise tourism.

Im in the middle of a trip. Mid August to mid September. Car, to Dublin, back from Belfast,  £220 return. Paul did two motorbike day returns, 2 and 8 August, £79 and £89.

What appears on social media isn’t definitive. It’s what was in the official reports recommending purchase and the new user agreement.

The purchase was to guarantee our life line. That has a tourist component, but it’s small and we also need to take account the other 46 weeks of the year. ( I’ve added a week to each of TT and FoM to allow for getting people/bikes on and off before and after )

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, MrPB said:

That’s quite a sweeping statement. At least I understand what anecdotal means whereas you seem to be confused. The boats are only full this week and TT Week where people are coming for specific events and will pretty much pay what they have to pay to attend those events. Outside of that they are not full and I’m sure pricing has a lot to do with that as our family experience this week shows as the boat fare simply could not be justified for a trip to the IOM. 

But you’re contradicting yourself. It’s FoM. That’s why fares are high. Your family member is travelling at FoM so will have to pay FoM prices.

You're right, half terms and Xmas/Easter apart,  they aren’t generally full. That with fares cheaper in real terms than 40 years ago. More sailings than 1977. You can book car, driver +1 for sub £200 most of the year.

Your family member may be specific and concrete for him/you ( although it’s confusing, if  he came  by pane anyway, it’s FoM but he doesn’t expect to pay FoM prices ) but it’s anecdotal as to disincentivising tourism generally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, MrPB said:

The example I used...was specifically related to a relative who chose to fly because the cost of the boat was outrageous.

I liked that anecdote!

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, MrPB said:

I’m not contradicting myself at all. That seems to be another thing that is confusing you when I have been consistently clear. My original post was on the cost differential between the plane (owned by a private listed company with no vested interest in the IOM economy) and the boat (owned by the IOM government which has a vested interest in the success of the IOM) where the boat fair actively disincentivized a tourist from arriving in the IOM by boat. The other arguments were ones you added not me. Despite it being the FoM coming by air was considerably cheaper so that’s what my relative had to do as they had to be here for a family event. Of course that is disincentivising tourists. Two to be specific in this non anecdotal situation.  

They came anyway. They just chose the cheapest form of transport. It’s a market place. I think what it shows is that the Steam Packet pricing over FoM ensures maximum bikes, cars, vans, and foot passengers are voting with their feet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, MrPB said:

I’m not contradicting myself at all. That seems to be another thing that is confusing you when I have been consistently clear. My original post was on the cost differential between the plane (owned by a private listed company with no vested interest in the IOM economy) and the boat (owned by the IOM government which has a vested interest in the success of the IOM) where the boat fair actively disincentivized a tourist from arriving in the IOM by boat. The other arguments were ones you added not me. Despite it being the FoM coming by air was considerably cheaper so that’s what my relative had to do as they had to be here for a family event. If they didn’t have to be here they wouldn’t have come to be honest due to cost. Of course that is disincentivising tourists. Two to be specific in this non anecdotal situation.  

boat vs plane never stacked up long before IOMG got involved and started squeezing the pips

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, MrPB said:

Because they had to so no option to not travel to the IOM during the FOM. Yes the cheapest form of transport which wasn’t our state owned shipping company (which my taxes helped to buy) which was outrageously expensive. 

You’re changing ground. What has that to do with tourists being disincentivized

The boats were full, or almost full. In modern transport pricing that means highest fares, especially if booking late.

Can I ask you to clarify, for the rest of us tax payers, are you suggesting that IoMG should change policy about the loans it too over and not recover from profits over 7 years. That’s a change from tax payer neutral to tax payer burden.

Are you suggesting, that IoM government, aka the tax payer, should fork out 60% of the cost of every fare by subsidy, just like Caledonian McBrayne.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, MrPB said:

Exactly so exactly what is the point of buying the SPC if all you are going to do is continue that ridiculous situation or put up fares to make the differential even worse? 

To stop further Vulture Capitalists from buying it and really taking the piss with prices! The Australian and Portugese banks were bad, but it could have been far worse. 

It's important that the Steam Packet remains profitable as it needs to pay back the C.£124m loan and fund two new vessels. 

 

It can't just be allowed to become the Bus Vannin of the seas. 

Edited by foxdaleliberationfront
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, MrPB said:

No I’m not at all. You’re just making that up. 

Its almost a perfect example of tourists being disincentivized as they wouldn’t have come if they absolutely didn’t have to attend a wedding here. So I’m sure there may well be several tourists who didn’t strictly have to be here over bank holiday weekend who just elected not to come when they saw the boat fare. Cheaper to spend bank holiday in the Lakes rather than come from the UK on the boat so it’s hardly helping us attract tourists us it? 

It’s always been cheaper to spend a weekend in Blackpool, Brighton, Skegness, or Windermere than cross the Irish Sea.

Did they explore sail/rail? Often cheaper than foot passenger only fares, especially at peak season. I know that’s bizarre, but it’s true. Leeds to Douglas via Liverpool at TT was half the price of Liverpool to Douglas, and that was booked the week before. Not sure what would happen if you just turned up at the Pier Head without using the train part of the ticket. Perhaps that’s what the QR codes are all about!

so they wanted to come at August Bank holiday/FoM, second busiest dates of year, and didn’t expect to pay more?

Plane fares are cheaper than the boats at TT & MGP ( or whatever it’s called this year) because the Steam Packet maximises bikes, cars, vans, and occupants, not foot passengers. It’s capacity, occupancy and revenue management. Book 830 foot passengers and the bikes etc can’t come over as there’s no space for their riders.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...