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20mph speed limits to be introduced

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2 hours ago, WTF said:

plenty of cyclists should  be getting done for speeding when this lot comes in then,  'bout time they had to have speedos fitted as standard as a legal requirement along with insurance

Get over yourself 

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On 6/26/2019 at 4:17 PM, doc.fixit said:

I see a major problem is caused by the slapdash choosing of arbitrary speed limits. There are very few limits that are sensible, logical or satisfactory. e.g. no speed limit outside our cottage with a bendy lane only 1 1/2 cars wide, same in Tholt y Will, yet a 30 or other  limit on some wide, straight, non residential roads with no particular hazards.

I disagree, doc, and this is one of my bugbears. There isn't "no speed limit" on your bendy lane. It is simply de-restricted, which means merely that an official speed limit has not been set, and it instructs you to drive according to the road conditions you encounter. It does not mean floor it and go as fast as the bloody thing will take you. It makes no recommendation at all as to speed, and the onus is on the driver to take all care in judging the safe level at which to proceed.

What I have the problem with is when the DOT come along and swap these perfectly appropriate de-restricted signs for a 50 or even a 60. They obviously think they are making it safer than "no speed limit". However,  if the road is only fit for 30mph or less, then a de-restricted sign is better than a designated speed sign which would mislead strangers into accelerating to a level that is patently ridiculous for that stretch of road. There are many examples of this on the Island.

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Maximum speed limits are fine, until you consider that most accidents occur on corners where the speed is probably below said speed limit anyway.

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23 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Maximum speed limits are fine, until you consider that most accidents occur on corners where the speed is probably below said speed limit anyway.

"Corners "

I saw what may have been the worst driving I have ever seen today at the Garth crossroads.

We were at the stop sign coming from the south and wanting to turn right, to head through the Braaid.

A white Fiesta driven by a young person overtook a mini just before the Crossroads on the left hand bend at about 75 mph. had I turned left we would all be dead.

Sure I saw the same people shortly after on Peel Road and the car was parked by the Gym. One kid even ran across the road in front of an oncoming car.

Driver education is the key here, esp. young drivers

It does not matter how safe you think you are, some arsehole will get you.

I have friends who have lost kids because of the sort of driving I saw today ( by kids) It needs to be addressed now.

Edit to add that had I clocked the reg number or had a dashcam, they would be in Dukes Ave. now.

Edited by dilligaf
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8 hours ago, woolley said:

I disagree, doc, and this is one of my bugbears. There isn't "no speed limit" on your bendy lane. It is simply de-restricted, which means merely that an official speed limit has not been set, and it instructs you to drive according to the road conditions you encounter. It does not mean floor it and go as fast as the bloody thing will take you. It makes no recommendation at all as to speed, and the onus is on the driver to take all care in judging the safe level at which to proceed.

What I have the problem with is when the DOT come along and swap these perfectly appropriate de-restricted signs for a 50 or even a 60. They obviously think they are making it safer than "no speed limit". However,  if the road is only fit for 30mph or less, then a de-restricted sign is better than a designated speed sign which would mislead strangers into accelerating to a level that is patently ridiculous for that stretch of road. There are many examples of this on the Island.

A speed limit is a risk assessment: an aid to the lowest denominator of driver to assist in their decision making.

unfortunately, because of its widespread and inappropriate deployment, it is generally interpreted as an endorsement by Government to go as fast as possible. Something along the lines of “yeah, the highways engineers have had a look at the data,  and we reckon it’s OK to crack on as you see fit mate”.

that position is not sustainable. Derestriction is a political position, and not one based on any sound logic in today’s prevailing road and traffic conditions.

it actually demonstrates that the politicians are actually running the place, as there isn’t a highways engineer inIoMG that would unilaterally put their name to derestricted policy.

 

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11 hours ago, woolley said:

I disagree, doc, and this is one of my bugbears. There isn't "no speed limit" on your bendy lane. It is simply de-restricted, which means merely that an official speed limit has not been set, and it instructs you to drive according to the road conditions you encounter. It does not mean floor it and go as fast as the bloody thing will take you. It makes no recommendation at all as to speed, and the onus is on the driver to take all care in judging the safe level at which to proceed.

What I have the problem with is when the DOT come along and swap these perfectly appropriate de-restricted signs for a 50 or even a 60. They obviously think they are making it safer than "no speed limit". However,  if the road is only fit for 30mph or less, then a de-restricted sign is better than a designated speed sign which would mislead strangers into accelerating to a level that is patently ridiculous for that stretch of road. There are many examples of this on the Island.

I agree with you, however, there are those of us who TRY and drive to road conditions and there are those who see a de-restriction sign as permission to go as fast as they like.

Even though we have had a car upside down into the garden wall and a white van on it's side just up the lane, to name a few of the many incidents, the DOI or whatever it was called ten years ago, said there monitors had got an average speed of 55 mph which was fine!

I would say that enforcement of existing limits, even though some are totally illogical, is a first step towards safer roads.

Edited by doc.fixit

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18 hours ago, dilligaf said:

Edit to add that had I clocked the reg number or had a dashcam, they would be in Dukes Ave. now.

I'm not sure that they would! A few weeks ago, I reported a near head-on, on the Ramsey to Laxey coast road, caused by a dickhead in an English registered van overtaking three vehicle, including me, at high speed while approaching the blind bend, after Bulgham and before the Ever-lasting Bend. 

Cops took all the details, including English reg of the offending vehicle and the other two cars in the overtake. Unfortunately, it all happened too fast to get the number of the innocent oncoming vehicle who was nearly wiped out.

They did call me back, to say that despite the English reg, they'd found it was insured to an address in Ramsey. The female cop asked "What do you want us to do about it? Will it be OK if I track him down and tell him not to drive like a prick?"

I said "No". 

I heard no more about it.  They're not interested, until someone dies. 

Edited by Nellie

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I suppose that Plod telling him not to drive like a prick might be better than nothing. Strange that he's had the time to get it insured in Ramsey but not to register it on the Island. You did the right thing though. They will at least have a record the next time somebody reports him for doing something similar. Let us hope that it doesn't take a death, as you say.

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1 hour ago, Nellie said:

I'm not sure that they would! A few weeks ago, I reported a near head-on, on the Ramsey to Laxey coast road, caused by a dickhead in an English registered van overtaking three vehicle, including me, at high speed while approaching the blind bend, after Bulgham and before the Ever-lasting Bend. 

Cops took all the details, including English reg of the offending vehicle and the other two cars in the overtake. Unfortunately, it all happened too fast to get the number of the innocent oncoming vehicle who was nearly wiped out.

They did call me back, to say that despite the English reg, they'd found it was insured to an address in Ramsey. The female cop asked "What do you want us to do about it? Will it be OK if I track him down and tell him not to drive like a prick?"

I said "No". 

I heard no more about it.  They're not interested, until someone dies. 

I wouldn’t go as far as to say that, but I would agree it can be difficult to motivate some officers to see the importance of following things up effectively 

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12 minutes ago, Derek Flint said:

I wouldn’t go as far as to say that, but I would agree it can be difficult to motivate some officers to see the importance of following things up effectively 

Then those “officers” are in the job for the wrong reasons.Protect and serve I thought?

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Going off topic slightly but the driving standards seem to be getting worse. point in question when is a no entry sign not a no entry. When its on the end of Market street apparently, Just back from sitting out the back of M&S five cars straight through to use the office parking spaces. When pointed out looked at me like I was mad, and the quality of driving  how they passed beats me if they bothered.

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2 hours ago, Dirty Buggane said:

Going off topic slightly but the driving standards seem to be getting worse. point in question when is a no entry sign not a no entry. When its on the end of Market street apparently, Just back from sitting out the back of M&S five cars straight through to use the office parking spaces. When pointed out looked at me like I was mad, and the quality of driving  how they passed beats me if they bothered.

I think that was relaxed during the building of the Premier Inn, so that cars could park in their allocated spaces and taxis could pick up from M&S side door.

 I agree about the driving standards though, absolutely shocking. Is seems to be more serious to park on a yellow line than to drive like a total twat. Easier catch.

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3 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

I wouldn’t go as far as to say that, but I would agree it can be difficult to motivate some officers to see the importance of following things up effectively 

In which case, the entire "Road Safety Strategy" is a complete and utter waste of time. 

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6 hours ago, Nellie said:

In which case, the entire "Road Safety Strategy" is a complete and utter waste of time. 

Disagree. It’s 90% how I’d have written it, although I’d have resigned on a point of principle, due to COMIN interference on the issue of speed limits, had I been Road Safety Manager. 

It is the nonsensical and unsustainable stance of that group, and particular ministers, that makes the whole thing harder to do than it needs to be. The Chief Constable is most certainly pressing against this, which is refreshing to see

 

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5 minutes ago, Derek Flint said:

Disagree. It’s 90% how I’d have written it, although I’d have resigned on a point of principle, due to COMIN interference on the issue of speed limits, had I been Road Safety Manager. 

It is the nonsensical and unsustainable stance of that group, and particular ministers, that makes the whole thing harder to do than it needs to be. The Chief Constable is most certainly pressing against this, which is refreshing to see.

So why hasn't the stupidly over-graded and thus over-paid CC tended his resignation on this point of priciple?

It's called leadership.

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