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No wonder the psychiatric service is a shambles

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The Tynwald of today is a supine, spineless, featureless adjunct to government, devoid of passion, challenge or vibrancy. Perhaps this is unsurprising when one assesses just how many colourless and dull makeweights occupy the seats. 

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53 minutes ago, Uhtred said:

The Tynwald of today is a supine, spineless, featureless adjunct to government, devoid of passion, challenge or vibrancy. Perhaps this is unsurprising when one assesses just how many colourless and dull makeweights occupy the seats. 

Don't hold back now...

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14 hours ago, dilligaf said:
15 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

[1]  It's worth reading the whole session in full for the information as well as the comic spectacle of Ewart trying to explain scientific and mathematical stuff to a committee consisting of David Cretney and Martyn Perkins.   

Speaks volumes.

I think what annoys me isn't so much the they don't know about the technicalities (no one can be expected to know everything) it's that they seem uncaring to find out or understand even the simplest things that flow from the data.  For example Ewart had to explain that they have to use rolling three-year averages because of the small numbers involved.  With small numbers you are always going to get spikes and drops in the numbers that aren't caused by any underlying reason but just because random variation will be bigger and more noticeable around a number that is smaller.  This something that you come across all the time when you are looking at statistics relating to things on the Island and we even joke about it:  "OMG the numbers have doubled - from 1 to 2".  There are things you can do to put the figures in context and see if changes are genuinely significant or just 'noise'.

Now I wouldn't expect Manx politicians to be able to work out confidence intervals from scratch, but I would expect them to grasp the basic idea that the figures will vary by quite a lot randomly.  But they didn't seem to or even be interested.  Instead they just babbled on about us being a close community and endless cliches (like the stuff about social media) vaguely recollected from the London media.  They didn't even ask what the comparative suicide rates were after Ewart said they were about the same as England[1].

It's not just the individuals, it's a political culture that makes such a lack of interest in what actually happens on the Island acceptable - and not just among politicians but civil servants as well.  A lazy and arrogant assumption that what they think is happening must be what is happening.  Ewart said in her evidence: I mean, why were we not doing this? I was horrified when I came into post and found that none of this was being done.  This is the sort of thing that the Victorians could (and did) work out elsewhere - why has it never been done here?  (Or if it was, why did it stop?).

 

[1]  They weren't mentioned in the session, but from the Excel dataset that comes with the Public Health Outcomes Framework, the Manx rate was 10.2 suicides per year per 100,000 people based on the average for 2015-17 inclusive, compared to the figure for England of 9.9.  The Manx rate is based on 26 suicides in total over those three years, so even one less would put it below the English average - a good illustration how random events will make these statistics look better or worse if you don't look at them in context..

 

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14 hours ago, Patient centred said:

Which goes back to my point about policies being cut and pasted from UK documents by managers and shown as evidence of care. No one on the front line is told about these but they act as a false reassurance to those looking at the service.  The key is what is practice compared with the policies ie audit. 
I know that a senior psychologist here cut and pasted a whole care pathway for eating disorders without any expertise in eating disorders and without any of the doctors involved or knowing about it. When they did find out it was totally unrealistic for the island. too late. Policy done and signed off. Looks good but totally meaningless. 
 

How many policies are signed off without Tynwald debate and consent? In other words why are the people creating these policies unaccountable? Policy should be set by Tynwald on the advice of COMIN and the executive.

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8 hours ago, Andy Onchan said:

How many policies are signed off without Tynwald debate and consent? In other words why are the people creating these policies unaccountable? Policy should be set by Tynwald on the advice of COMIN and the executive.

Hospital policies have nothing to do with Tynwald in terms of seeing them up and implementation. That would be unrealistic and they do not have the expertise. 

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21 hours ago, Uhtred said:

The Tynwald of today is a supine, spineless, featureless adjunct to government, devoid of passion, challenge or vibrancy. Perhaps this is unsurprising when one assesses just how many colourless and dull makeweights occupy the seats. 

If you tgink so, why not stand in the elections?

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2 hours ago, Patient centred said:

Hospital policies have nothing to do with Tynwald in terms of seeing them up and implementation. That would be unrealistic and they do not have the expertise. 

With respect and by what I'm reading on here we obviously can't trust the professionals either.

And I regard the last sentence as typical of the way that the medical profession view the main stakeholder, the patient. A little humility wouldn't go amiss. After all it's the taxpayer that's funded the training and the equipment etc so that they can practice.

 

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1 hour ago, Dr. Grumpy said:

If you tgink so, why not stand in the elections?

Because I’m too old and wouldn’t effectively contribute to turning Tynwald into a modern, forward looking 21st Century Parliament.

And by trotting out the tired and irrelevant ‘Why don’t you stand then’ response you’re letting the current incumbents off the hook. They stood, declared they’d make effective public representatives, and it’s absolutely legitimate for the rest of us to hold them to account, whether we choose to stand or not.

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On 10/10/2019 at 11:25 AM, Uhtred said:

The Tynwald of today is a supine, spineless, featureless adjunct to government, devoid of passion, challenge or vibrancy. Perhaps this is unsurprising when one assesses just how many colourless and dull makeweights occupy the seats. 

Very true

Tynwald has become a dead dog of an organisation

It's vital to our democracy that vibrancy is restored

(Or initiated for the very first time)

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3 hours ago, Donald Trumps said:

Very true

Tynwald has become a dead dog of an organisation

It's vital to our democracy that vibrancy is restored

(Or initiated for the very first time)

 Correct Donald. This Tynwald is virtually inert - it’s no more than a rubber stamp for government. Quite appalling really.

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5 hours ago, Uhtred said:

Because I’m too old and wouldn’t effectively contribute to turning Tynwald into a modern, forward looking 21st Century Parliament.

And by trotting out the tired and irrelevant ‘Why don’t you stand then’ response you’re letting the current incumbents off the hook. They stood, declared they’d make effective public representatives, and it’s absolutely legitimate for the rest of us to hold them to account, whether we choose to stand or not.

Not everyone is suited to or has the verbal advocacy skills to make the right contribution in a largely verbal - & such verbals! - environment

In time deliberative democracy will move things forward & remove the political frauds from the system

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6 hours ago, Andy Onchan said:

With respect and by what I'm reading on here we obviously can't trust the professionals either.

And I regard the last sentence as typical of the way that the medical profession view the main stakeholder, the patient. A little humility wouldn't go amiss. After all it's the taxpayer that's funded the training and the equipment etc so that they can practice.

 

So we should let the guys at Tynwald come up with the policies such as infection control or management of the diabetic patient prior to theatre? Don’t be stupid. 
 

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On 10/9/2019 at 10:11 PM, thesultanofsheight said:

Ha ha I must be one of the most anti establishment posters on here and I think my extremely negative views on the hospital management have been pretty clear for years. But reading a load of mental old bollocks (that’s already largely been posted on FB by the same attention seeking conspiracy mentalists) is genuinely a bit tedious. 

You misunderstand me Sultan (possibly deliberately).  There are establishments and establishments - defined, as I said by vested interests.  For example, the senior doctors in Noble's/mental health/GP land are an establishment, and act together to protect their vested interests.

I accept that your views about hospital management are clear enough!

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1 hour ago, Patient centred said:

So we should let the guys at Tynwald come up with the policies such as infection control or management of the diabetic patient prior to theatre? Don’t be stupid. 
 

No more stupid than someone copying and pasting a policy.

 

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1 hour ago, Andy Onchan said:

No more stupid than someone copying and pasting a policy.

 

It’s not the doctors that cut and paste. It’s the managers and noctors

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