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DOI Says To Hell With Local Business


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Agreed and it's strange. When the redevelopment was first proposed (and the sky was going to cave in if it wasn't done?) it was at least partly on account of the promenade foundations having been unde

That’s not the reason it happens. It happens because it comes out of a different purse.  This happens all the time.  Take the Laxey sea wall as an example. For years the commissioners paid f

There was a quote from Mr Harmer in the past month that work was being majorly delayed on account of encountering "uncharted services". On a Victorian promenade. Who'd have guessed?

18 hours ago, NoTail said:

Heard today that the rails all need to be taken up because putting them on concrete is too noisy, cracking the concrete and a very uncomfortable ride. Some kind of rubber has to be put down as a sort of substitute for sleepers. 

If that's a fact why on earth didn't they follow good practice from elsewhere?

It seems that we always try to invent the wheel instead of using proved methods.

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6 hours ago, Donald Trumps said:

It is pitiful really that government institutions are losing so much money that they feel private bodies can do the job better

It automatically means they fully accept that their own management is appalling, & anyone else could immediately take it under control & make a bit of cash out of it

That’s not the reason it happens. It happens because it comes out of a different purse. 

This happens all the time. 

Take the Laxey sea wall as an example. For years the commissioners paid for a worker and digger to move the stones, lowering the beach at the eastern end. 

I’ve no idea of the cost but let’s estimate 30 000 for the year. 

The lowering of the beach assisted sea toppover. 

Then come the financial cuts to the commissioners. 

Then comes the notion of a sea wall costing 6.5 milllion pounds. The height of the sea wall will increase by 12 inches. Bugger all use when there are waves of 30 foot or more during the winter. 

But the commissioners don’t pay for this. It comes out of another purse. It saves them 30k a year even though it’s useless. 

This happens all the time and it’s happening with the prom too. 

Money shite. The problem is at source. With administration, with devolvement, with everything. Shite. That’s what it is. 

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1 hour ago, NoTail said:

Not wanting to labour the point but I would appreciate an actual member of DOI or similar to confirm or deny this rumour that the rails have to be taken up again.

Paging Rob Callister.... He's asking a couple of questions on the Prom in Tynwald on Tuesday maybe he could follow up with this as a supplementary?

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https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/doi-aims-to-make-up-nine-week-delay-to-prom-works/

 

Finally admission from the DOI that their scheme is way behind! We can safely add another third on to their '9-10 weeks' as most problems are understated by them. 

 

"Within budget.." - so far yes, because they haven't yet had to dig up the broken concrete and faulty tracks 

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They can't possibly be 9 - 10 weeks+ behind schedule and still be "within budget". It's a contradiction in terms.

And you can bet that the "contingencies" for money will involve going back to Tynwald cap in hand for another handout. Which Tynwald will/would be unable to refuse or the capital's promenade is left looking like a bombsite. Win win if you're DOI.

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1 hour ago, foxdaleliberationfront said:

https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/doi-aims-to-make-up-nine-week-delay-to-prom-works/

 

Finally admission from the DOI that their scheme is way behind! We can safely add another third on to their '9-10 weeks' as most problems are understated by them. 

 

"Within budget.." - so far yes, because they haven't yet had to dig up the broken concrete and faulty tracks 

Now there's a interesting bit that was let slip...." 6 million-odd vehicle movements" (presumably per year) along the prom and it's a main artery. And to think that they were going to introduce shared space!

What planet are these people on?

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4 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said:

Now there's a interesting bit that was let slip...." 6 million-odd vehicle movements" (presumably per year) along the prom and it's a main artery. And to think that they were going to introduce shared space!

What planet are these people on?

And they want to run horse and carts among the 6 million vehicle movements! 

 

You're right to ask... what planet are these people on!! 

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1 hour ago, hissingsid said:

Just let them get on with it....allexperts at sod all.

Sid, FWIW here's my view: 

Why oh why are they fecking around with fecking tramlines when the fecking elephant of the whole project is seemingly being ignored, ie the utilities? The guy this morning has admitted that the task of dealing with that is the most challenging. The tramlines and associated crap can be dealt with at the end, when all utility problems have been resolved and all costs known. Cart before horse seems the appropriate phrase.

What we need is an infrastructure fit for purpose.

Stop wasting taxpayers money!

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1 minute ago, Andy Onchan said:

Sid, FWIW here's my view: 

Why oh why are they fecking around with fecking tramlines when the fecking elephant of the whole project is seemingly being ignored, ie the utilities? The guy this morning has admitted that the task of dealing with that is the most challenging. The tramlines and associated crap can be dealt with at the end, when all utility problems have been resolved and all costs known. Cart before horse seems the appropriate phrase.

What we need is an infrastructure fit for purpose.

Stop wasting taxpayers money!

well as suggested above, it makes sense to get the middle section down during the summer so that can become a carriageway during the winter. that way the landward services can get finished with 'minimum' *** disruption to the hoteliers and businesses. most of what's going on at present seems to be fact finding for the big dig. if i'm right, then the seaward side would be tackled next spring / summer. 

this is only my guesswork as a former civil* engineer 

* i swore too much to stay in that business 

*** this isn't a joke honest, what is going on now is nothing compared to what it can become :(

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A project of this magnitude, commenced KNOWING that there were going to be so many variables and unknowns has the potential for huge cost and time overruns. With no other option if those unknowns are encountered other than to simply embrace those overruns and suck it up. Once it was started there was a one way ticket on it (no pun intended).

That's why there was such cynicism over this project and its budget, only partly due to the involvement of the horsetrams. £25M? Lets look at £35M or £40M maybe. And a couple of years more than estimated as well maybe. Nobody knows. Because nobody CAN know. It's DOI justification heaven.

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1 hour ago, english zloty said:

well as suggested above, it makes sense to get the middle section down during the summer so that can become a carriageway during the winter. that way the landward services can get finished with 'minimum' *** disruption to the hoteliers and businesses. most of what's going on at present seems to be fact finding for the big dig. if i'm right, then the seaward side would be tackled next spring / summer. 

this is only my guesswork as a former civil* engineer 

* i swore too much to stay in that business 

*** this isn't a joke honest, what is going on now is nothing compared to what it can become :(

The middle bit is only being prioritised so that the DOI can play trains/trams with their expensive toy set. 

 

All the tram lines should have been left until right at the very end horse trams should have been suspended for 3 or 4 years (or even better scrapped altogether) - they're the least important and only non-essential bit of the whole project. But no, somebody in DOI had to prioritise them so they could fuck around pulling an empty tram up and down 500 yards of road. 

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