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UK General Election Dec 2019

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1 hour ago, P.K. said:

I think we can all be pretty sure that a resurgent Russia is trying to influence elections in the Western Democracies. Including the referendum.

So there must be a reason why Russia would want the UK to leave the EU.

I wonder what it could be....?

Being a totally immoral serial philanderer and inveterate liar Boris Johnson is the PERFECT choice to back financially to get the result you want. Bought and paid for.

Especially if it's a no deal exit....

They aren’t bothered who they manipulate or who wins any particular election. The interest is in spreading false information, fanning populism and destabilising. It’s a destabilised, weakened, Europe, turning on itself and its constituent parts on each other,  that is in their long term interests.

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Just now, John Wright said:

They aren’t bothered who they manipulate or who wins any particular election. The interest is in spreading false information, fanning populism and destabilising. It’s a destabilised, weakened, Europe, turning on itself and its constituent parts on each other,  that is in their long term interests.

I think a weakening of the EU would very much be in their interests.

Plus Trump making noises about NATO likewise.

Not exactly "reds under the beds" but very much "Ivan on social media...."

Of course, if their intervention tallies with your own interests you'll deny it's even happening....

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1 hour ago, P.K. said:

I think a weakening of the EU would very much be in their interests.

Plus Trump making noises about NATO likewise.

Not exactly "reds under the beds" but very much "Ivan on social media...."

Of course, if their intervention tallies with your own interests you'll deny it's even happening....

Tester for you then P.K.

I did / have fought on behalf of NATO against the then Soviet Union - Did you?

I am a Brexiteer - You are a remainer - but you make me out to be pro Russia, anti NATO, and you to be the opposite.

Please explain your anti Russia / Pro NATO credentials - do you have any?

What, specifically, have you done to defeat the attempt to weaken the influence of the Soviet Union on the EU/UK?.

Actions not Words.

For the sake of brevity, I'll make an opening statement, you have done nothing, zero, zilch to stop the influence of Russia. You enjoy free speech but have done nothing tangible to defend it. You are, in basic terms 'All mouth and no trousers'.

Prove me wrong. What actions are on your credibility sheet?

Edited by Manximus Aururaneus

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10 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

Tester for you then P.K.

I did / have fought on behalf of NATO against the then Soviet Union - Did you?

I am a Brexiteer - You are a remainer - but you make me out to be pro Russia, anti NATO, and you to be the opposite.

Please explain your anti Russia / Pro NATO credentials - do you have any?

What, specifically, have you done to defeat the attempt to weaken the influence of the Soviet Union on the EU/UK?.

Actions not Words.

I must have missed the war between USSR and NATO. Perhaps you refer to proxy wars somewhere?

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14 minutes ago, John Wright said:

I must have missed the war between USSR and NATO. Perhaps you refer to proxy wars somewhere?

Perhaps you should have spent the 260 days a year at sea (underwater) that I did away from my family during the 70/80's that I did off Murmansk - then you would have a clue what you are talking about. (P.K.?). On this subject, you know nothing.

Edited by Manximus Aururaneus

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1 hour ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

Perhaps you should have spent the 260 days a year at sea (underwater) that I did away from my family during the 70/80's that I did off Murmansk - then you would have a clue what you are talking about. (P.K.?). On this subject, you know nothing.

There was a very intense cat and mouse game during the Cold War with our hunter killer subs probing and challenging USSR defences. Intelligence was gathered and spying done. The Warsaw Pact subs would shadow our subs and also probe the sea around the UK just we probed theirs. Surface units and aircraft would put in mock attacks if one our subs was detected. Often our subs were undetected as they lay off Murmansk. Another purpose was to gather the sonar signals of their ships and record them for feeding into guided weapons ie homing on the sounds. It was regular trade for the RN submarine service. The opposition were known to have fired live ammunition if subs got too close . Even now Russian subs are probing the UK which is why the RAF is hastily buying in nine American sub-buster aircraft. I was told that Polaris subs got close in to Murmansk etc but I did not believe that as I thought they would be too big and too slow They go in deep water and bob around at 4 knots so as not generate detection. But RN subs and theirs creeping around hunting each other was very real for a long time.  

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15 hours ago, RIchard Britten said:

Anyone would think by the way the "Right aligned" print media, the BBC, the Chief Rabbi and certain posters on here go on about anti-semitism in the Labour party, it doesn't exist in other parties.

Oh wait...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50491208

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/19/tory-candidate-suspended-alleged-anti-semitic-islamophobic-homophobic/

While this bordering on "whataboutism", I am not raising this to "defend" anything anyone says (unless it is criticism of the Israel Government's actions - which is not anti-semitism), but to point out that the so-called Labour anti-semitism "problem" is being massively over played in an orchestrated attempt by the Tories and some members of Corbyns own party (the Blairite faithful) to prevent not only a Labour Government but also a Corbyn Government,

 

 

Do you mean in the same way that Corbyn is massively overplaying his "evidence" of the Tories putting the NHS up for sale? Face it. The performance of the leadership of every party is woeful, and the debate between them is banal, repetitive and barely rising above primary school comprehension level. What a shower!

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12 hours ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

I am a Brexiteer - You are a remainer - but you make me out to be pro Russia, anti NATO, and you to be the opposite.

Please explain your anti Russia / Pro NATO credentials - do you have any?

What a load of old cobblers.

As far as I'm aware at no time have I ever intimated that brexiteers are either pro-russian or anti-nato. Care to point out where I have?

Not been at the Jamesons a tad early have you?

12 hours ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

What, specifically, have you done to defeat the attempt to weaken the influence of the Soviet Union on the EU/UK?.

For the sake of brevity, I'll make an opening statement, you have done nothing, zero, zilch to stop the influence of Russia. You enjoy free speech but have done nothing tangible to defend it. You are, in basic terms 'All mouth and no trousers'.

Prove me wrong. What actions are on your credibility sheet?

Perhaps you should have spent the 260 days a year at sea (underwater) that I did away from my family during the 70/80's that I did off Murmansk - then you would have a clue what you are talking about. (P.K.?). On this subject, you know nothing.

What a load of nonsense. More likely posted up to blow your own trumpet than anything else. As I have seen before.

So what have YOU done to to stop the influence of Russia?

So you were in a submarine off Murmansk. Big deal. Nice and warm and air-conditioned. On watches so plenty of chariot time. No compo for you heated over a hexi burner. Oh no, instead a nice servery with on demand hot scoff with plates and knives and forks and a mess table to eat from with mugs of tea and all very civilised. No rain or cold or 58 pattern slugs under a poncho tied to a tree. You got a bed. Luxury.

Edited by P.K.
Embarrassing

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11 hours ago, RIchard Britten said:

So Green or Lib Dems...or Brexit Party or UKIP?

 

Not really. I'll take an a la carte choice of individual policies from across them though:

Brexit Party:

Clean break Brexit immediately.

Cut annual immigration to less than 50,000 net.

Replace foreign aid with trade incentives to developing countries. (Hand up, not hand out.)

Scrap BBC Licence fee. (I have been a supporter of it, but it becomes less justifiable by the year due to changing habits.)

Green Party:

Plant 700 million trees by 2030. (Great for habitat and the environment even if it won't make a scrap of difference to "climate change".)

Network of cycling infrastructure. (Great for health).

Ban single use plastic.

Lib Dems:

Freeze train fares. (UK train fares are extortionate).

Conservative Party:

No income tax, NI or VAT rises on individuals.

Labour Party:

Stop pension age rises.

Cap pay to executives at 20 times the lowest salary in the organisation. (I would exclude self-made entrepreneurs and artists/performers, but not fat cat boardroom directors of quoted companies and their you-scratch-my-back remuneration committees.)

Abolish private schools charitable status. (Charity is for the needy, not the privileged.)

Build 100,000 council homes a year and introduce MOTs for private landlords properties (but not cap rent rises to inflation as this will discourage improvements).

Introduce a national care service to correct the scandal of "care in the community" - surely the greatest misnomer of all time. (And partly to end bed blocking in hospitals).

Make multi-national companies pay their fair share of tax on UK profits as if they were UK domiciled. (This will yield huge amounts of money currently leaking from the system).

Woolley Party.

Reinstate capital punishment for murder and rape where proven beyond shadow of doubt.

Life sentences to mean life with no prospect of release to re-offend. Protect the public rather than the criminals.

No tolerance crackdown on anti-social behaviour.

Prison regime to be harsh, not a holiday camp.

Armed forces strength returned to cold war levels.

Cut bureaucratic waste with the aim of running a balanced budget within two parliaments.

That should put it on the right track to be going on with.

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5 hours ago, P.K. said:

I think a weakening of the EU would very much be in their interests.

It would be in everybody's interests. Abolition even more so.

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As I remember, PK was also dodging both live Nato armalite rounds and Warsaw Pact Kalashnikov rounds and Semtex in the six counties back when MA was looking for the golden rivet. 

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