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IOM Covid removing restrictions


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6 minutes ago, Cambon said:

You really don't know what is going on in jersey, do you? 

I have never said the local economy is booming. However, I suggest it will be worse if we go to test on arrival, mainly because of the local spend that will go off Island.

also, in a month or twos time, it would not surprise me if Jersey went to seven days and test so they can become Covid free. It would allow them to drop social distancing and gathering limits, and get cinemas, nightclubs open, and get restaurants and pubs up to speed. It would also allow them to open air corridores to Guernsey and Iom. 

Jersey will never do that, think you will find Guernsey will change their policy to allow Jersey in.

Jersey are not interested in airbridge with Isle of Man , they have links to Gatwick , Heathrow , Edinburgh, Manchester etc etc why the hell would they lose those by changing isolation to have air bridges with Isle of Man? 
 

absolute shit as normal 

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Can you guys start a separate thread titled "Jersey is ace - oh no it isn't" and leave this one to a discussion on IOM and the coronavirus?

...and I so wanted a long illustrious career at the DHSC   I run my own company so my involvement with the DHSC to set up and keep the COVID19 lab running wasn't exactly in the professional caree

I'll put a big disclaimer here that I'm not the person who decides who gets tested and when.  Saying that, I am a scientist who understands that if you test someone on the day they arrive and the

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13 minutes ago, Banker said:

Jersey will never do that, think you will find Guernsey will change their policy to allow Jersey in.

Jersey are not interested in airbridge with Isle of Man , they have links to Gatwick , Heathrow , Edinburgh, Manchester etc etc why the hell would they lose those by changing isolation to have air bridges with Isle of Man? 
 

absolute shit as normal 

Because, like the Isle of Man, they get bugger all tourists from October to March. It is likely the uk areas you mention will be red soon in the traffic lights system, meaning 14 days isolation anyway. 

 

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13 minutes ago, Cambon said:

Because, like the Isle of Man, they get bugger all tourists from October to March. It is likely the uk areas you mention will be red soon in the traffic lights system, meaning 14 days isolation anyway. 

 

They are not going stop their residents & business travel to get air bridges with us.Guernsey politicians have already pointed out Jersey success and once infrastructure in place they will likely go to next phase as keen to allow travel to/from Jersey.

also they have no UK regions in red.

when Guernsey go to next phase IOM will be isolated on their own.

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23 hours ago, thesultanofsheight said:

It’s been as lucky as the IOM has been so far. But the IOM is simply winging it worse by simply not testing people. No test = no test results = nobody has covid!! Except when we start testing them and suddenly they have! 

Hmm, well, the lack of symptomatic people calling 111 and the lack of people in respiratory distress in Nobles would be the data that says you're wide of the mark here. There is no scenario with COVID19 where 100% of cases are asymptomatic so if we had a on-Island COVID19 epidemic on our hands then testing wouldn't be the only way it was detected. In the March-May epidemic on-Island around 10% cases were hospitalised (similar to other countries around the world). Every patient admitted to Nobles is tested so we'd be picking it up. 

22 hours ago, Banker said:

I’ve already said I disagree and we should have testing on arrival similar to other countries but you obviously agree with Boris & Matt .

Testing on arrival will cost a lot of money. You seem the kind that would also complain loudly if the IoM Government was wasting a few million a month on arrival testing if it was picking up no cases or didn't pick up "patient zero" in a new wave of the virus infections on-Island. 

22 hours ago, dilligaf said:

Only on Manx forums could a highly qualified biochemist have her knowledge belittled by simple folk who may think they are clever in their own back yard. FFS. Take a step back and think about what you are trying to say.

Yeah, I'm not a biochemist. Close, but not quite. 

20 hours ago, Southfork said:

I don’t believe she is a biochemist. Her online biography states that she trained as a molecular microbiologist, developing diagnostic assays for use in a commercial/statutory testing lab and then moved into bioinformatics with the emergence of next-generation sequencing. Her research interests are said to involve genomic epidemiology, biodiversity informatics and improving metagenomic and metabarcoding methods for species detection. As I understand it biochemistry has more to do with the chemical reactions that happen within the body. Whereas Molecular Biology focuses more on the structure and the relationships between four molecules (proteins, lipids, carbohydrates and nucleic acids) in the body.

She is clearly a very bright lady nonetheless but does not seem to be a biochemist. 

Gotta love the biomed cluster website. To paraphrase: I know my stuff when it comes to detecting pathogens with nucleic acids (DNA/RNA) having spent much of the last 20 years doing just that and becoming a bit knowledgeable about how you do it. 

17 hours ago, Apple said:

Still knows a damn site more than me. I trust her judgement. 

 

Cheers. 

11 hours ago, Banker said:

Whereas Jersey can do 2000 per day and Guernsey are building infrastructure to do similar for next phase.

whilst we can argue about when easing should start there should be no argument that IOM should be investing in infrastructure to be able to do similar.

also the lack of any real plan to get out of this is concerning to many on both sides of argument 

Yeah, we can do close to that now (probably a few more if I could work the biomedical scientists the way I work commercially, but to be fair, they don't like working 16 hours a day with few breaks, who would?). The published numbers are smaller than that but I have two additional testing machines at my lab in addition to to the one at the hospital and the hospital machine is about to be upgraded to 4x that capacity.

The capacity is there should everything go "pear shaped" but the reality is that most people don't want to be tested. We can't force them to have their brain tickled with a swab at the Grandstand, even if they're given ample opportunity. 

9 hours ago, Cambon said:

Jersey cannot process any in a day. They are processed in the uk. However, I understand they are building their own labs to cut testing time. Guernsey are increasing their ability, but delivery of the equipment has been delayed until end of September, according to your own link last week. 

Isle of Man more than doubled its testing ability during July / August according to Howie last Thursday. Wrighty even mentioned it a while ago on this thread. 

A link to Jersey's other restrictions was posted two pages ago. I suggest you actually look at what else is in place rather than stick you fingers in your ears and say test on arrival. 

You also said earlier that Jersey's pubs and restaurants were very busy. You are correct, in a social distancing, table service only kind of way

You're right. Jersey are currently sending all their tests to a lab in the UK. They have their new shipping container lab provided by a London-based start-up but that's not operational yet. The London-based start-up are zooming me on Tuesday to find out how to do testing. So there's that. I also turned down setting up a private lab in Guernsey when they asked. Because, you know, I'm Manx, and there are only so many hours in the day. I can only run so many labs at a time. 

5 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

Except it isn't really working.  Jersey is still operating under all sorts of restrictions to cope with the possibility that they may still have the virus and that it can be reintroduced at any time.  They may have reduced the risk of those things, but not to a sufficient level that they can open up internally in the way that we have.  And those restrictions have affected their internal economy, which is why they are giving out £100 vouchers in a desperate attempt to get things going.

And it's very expensive:

 

Yup, I can't see many people on the Isle of Man giving up their current "covid-free" lifestyle just so people can travel freely. Most of us have short memories and have easily forgotten 2m social distancing and the restrictions of a few months ago. The UK still have these. Personally, queuing at Tesco for an hour again would seriously disrupt my ability to get stuff done. 

5 hours ago, Nom de plume said:

Yes, understood.

However, I think we could live with 1m social distancing, groups limited to 20 persons, table service in pubs & nightclubs closed if it meant there was a viable alternative or compromise.

Jersey’s restrictions are not draconian, they are very liveable.

I’d even go with the £50 test paid for by the traveller over the state paying.

We will have to come up with an alternative soon, though none are without risk.

 

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I won’t quote all above from rachomics but whilst I appreciate the update and your expertise I must respectfully disagree with parts. 
 

I would not object to the Government spending money on testing arrivals and personally think it’s the way to go. Howies mates Guernsey are planning to follow Jersey and I don’t accept that their medical experts are all wrong.

if a vaccine doesn’t become available are we advocating keeping all non residents including families out indefinitely?

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Oh bugger it , no one gets out of here alive so I’d like to just crack on. If my clogs pop so be it. At my age a year is a long time , not many left. Let’s get on   and have some fun , the young will be fine. Likes of me are are drain on resources so just let the young take over. Fearty oldies can cower in the attic , let the rest take their chances.

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4 minutes ago, Banker said:

I won’t quote all above from rachomics but whilst I appreciate the update and your expertise I must respectfully disagree with parts. 
 

I would not object to the Government spending money on testing arrivals and personally think it’s the way to go. Howies mates Guernsey are planning to follow Jersey and I don’t accept that their medical experts are all wrong.

if a vaccine doesn’t become available are we advocating keeping all non residents including families out indefinitely?

So why are Guernseys' experts right, and our experts are wrong? Are you qualified to assess that? I've already explained why arrival testing is a risk, not a benefit. 

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4 minutes ago, Anyone said:

Oh bugger it , no one gets out of here alive so I’d like to just crack on. If my clogs pop so be it. At my age a year is a long time , not many left. Let’s get on   and have some fun , the young will be fine. Likes of me are are drain on resources so just let the young take over. Fearty oldies can cower in the attic , let the rest take their chances.

Best post yet!

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1 minute ago, rachomics said:

So why are Guernseys' experts right, and our experts are wrong? Are you qualified to assess that? I've already explained why arrival testing is a risk, not a benefit. 

We live in a world of risks. Those who seek to eliminate them simply by removing peoples freedoms are little more than dictators. 

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9 minutes ago, Banker said:

I won’t quote all above from rachomics but whilst I appreciate the update and your expertise I must respectfully disagree with parts. 
 

I would not object to the Government spending money on testing arrivals and personally think it’s the way to go. Howies mates Guernsey are planning to follow Jersey and I don’t accept that their medical experts are all wrong.

if a vaccine doesn’t become available are we advocating keeping all non residents including families out indefinitely?

Then why are you complaining about it on here? Get your MHK on the case. If you strongly believe that this is the best way to use tax payers money then tell the Treasury so and put your name to it publically. Don't hide behind a username on an internet forum. 

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5 minutes ago, rachomics said:

 

Then why are you complaining about it on here? Get your MHK on the case. If you strongly believe that this is the best way to use tax payers money then tell the Treasury so and put your name to it publically. Don't hide behind a username on an internet forum. 

I have spoken to my MHKS but as most know the island is being run as little more than the Howie & Ashy show and they are having difficulty getting any joy.And with Tynwald still on holidays when all other parliament are back they can’t be closely questioned!!

however see there are some questions next week For written answer .

e Hon. Member for Douglas Central (Mr Thomas) to ask the Chief Minister –
If he will publish the UK Office of National Statistics i) national and ii) North West regional estimates of Covid-19 case community prevalence, and any other UK Covid-19 profile data and Isle of Man Covid-19 data, which have been or will be used to move between the Isle of Man Borders Framework 2020 levels 5 to 0; and if he will make a statement with respect to this publication and the five principles laid out in the Isle of Man Government Medium Term Response to Covid-19 document which guide the phased approach?
14. The Hon. Member for Douglas Central (Mr Thomas) to ask the Chief Minister –
If he will provide an estimate of the monthly increase in the number of people who could arrive in the Isle of Man if a decision is taken to move to levels 3 to 0 in the Isle of Man Borders Framework 2020; and if he will make a statement about the methodology and assumptions used in this estimation?
 

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58 minutes ago, Anyone said:

Oh bugger it , no one gets out of here alive so I’d like to just crack on. If my clogs pop so be it. At my age a year is a long time , not many left. Let’s get on   and have some fun , the young will be fine. Likes of me are are drain on resources so just let the young take over. Fearty oldies can cower in the attic , let the rest take their chances.

Stunned that somebody as ignorant as you actually achieved old age. Well done.

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58 minutes ago, Southfork said:

We live in a world of risks. Those who seek to eliminate them simply by removing peoples freedoms are little more than dictators. 

Testing on arrival isn't a removal of people's freedoms. Not allowing you to return if you decide to go off-Island would be a removal of your freedom.

Testing on arrival would just give people false confidence that they're "negative" when they could still develop COVID19 within 14 days of arriving back on-Island. 

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5 minutes ago, rachomics said:

Testing on arrival would just give people false confidence that they're "negative" when they could still develop COVID19 within 14 days of arriving back on-Island. 

So you’re saying it’s better to assume 100% of returnees have it and lock them up mostly for no reason at all as they won’t be positive than actually test people to see whether they’re at risk? We are most certainly removing peoples freedoms. 

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