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IOM Covid removing restrictions


Filippo

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To be honest I can't blame people now for selling. The impact of Covid was grossly underestimated and arrogantly, in the beginning, there was a sense that it would not be as serious as it has turned out to be. And there is still some way to go as we keep hearing.

It has been drummed into people that "we can not go back", that there will be "a new normal" , this "changes everything" etc. The political rhetoric has turned the world on it's head and the total disruption to our lives has created a sense Oh Well, what's the point of staying as we are anymore. 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Apple said:

To be honest I can't blame people now for selling. The impact of Covid was grossly underestimated and arrogantly, in the beginning, there was a sense that it would not be as serious as it has turned out to be. And there is still some way to go as we keep hearing.

It has been drummed into people that "we can not go back", that there will be "a new normal" , this "changes everything" etc. The political rhetoric has turned the world on it's head and the total disruption to our lives has created a sense Oh Well, what's the point of staying as we are anymore. 

 

 

Unless they need to sell, now is a poor time to put your hotel on the market, especially as a going concern. No buyer is going to second guess the future direction of the island’s hospitality industry, let alone make such a large investment in it. There will always be interest, but by investors looking at the locality and they will not be interested in paying for the ‘goodwill’ and will want a good deal. If I owned one of these hotels I would be sitting it out if possible to see how all of this pans out. I really feel for them.

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1 hour ago, thesultanofsheight said:

I’m not confused by anything at all. Currently 0:0037 of UK residents (under 900 people) are in hospital due to covid-19 and nearly 10,000,000 people (15% of the UK population and currently over 30% of the UKs working population) are unemployed or on state income support because of covid-19. The cure is by far worse than the disease and will last a lot longer for the 10,000,000 now affected by a totally flawed covid response. 

Unlike most of Europe Sweden did not lock down.

The result was way more excess deaths than their Scandawegian neighbours for little if any economic gain.

In other words reality trashes your "argument".

Sweden’s grim Covid-19 result: More death and nearly equal economic damage

 

Ever since the coronavirus emerged in Europe, Sweden has captured international attention by conducting an unorthodox, open-air experiment. It has allowed the world to examine what happens in a pandemic when a government allows life to carry on largely unhindered.

This is what has happened: Not only have thousands more people died than in neighbouring countries that imposed lockdowns, but Sweden’s economy has fared little better. “They literally gained nothing,” said Jacob F. Kirkegaard, a senior fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics in Washington.

“It’s a self-inflicted wound, and they have no economic gains.” 

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/sweden-s-grim-covid-19-result-more-death-and-nearly-equal-economic-damage-1.4300102

I never thought I'd say this but I'm glad Mr Quayle is in charge and not some misguided, ill-informed zealot like you...

 

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58 minutes ago, Out of the blue said:

Unless they need to sell, now is a poor time to put your hotel on the market, especially as a going concern. No buyer is going to second guess the future direction of the island’s hospitality industry, let alone make such a large investment in it. There will always be interest, but by investors looking at the locality and they will not be interested in paying for the ‘goodwill’ and will want a good deal. If I owned one of these hotels I would be sitting it out if possible to see how all of this pans out. I really feel for them.

It will be a true test of the value of guest houses of largely Victorian construction with a currently very dubious market for guest numbers. Any takers?

Edited by Non-Believer
Typo
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18 minutes ago, P.K. said:

Unlike most of Europe Sweden did not lock down.

The result was way more excess deaths than their Scandawegian neighbours for little if any economic gain.

In other words reality trashes your "argument".

Sweden’s grim Covid-19 result: More death and nearly equal economic damage

 

Ever since the coronavirus emerged in Europe, Sweden has captured international attention by conducting an unorthodox, open-air experiment. It has allowed the world to examine what happens in a pandemic when a government allows life to carry on largely unhindered.

This is what has happened: Not only have thousands more people died than in neighbouring countries that imposed lockdowns, but Sweden’s economy has fared little better. “They literally gained nothing,” said Jacob F. Kirkegaard, a senior fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics in Washington.

“It’s a self-inflicted wound, and they have no economic gains.” 

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/sweden-s-grim-covid-19-result-more-death-and-nearly-equal-economic-damage-1.4300102

I never thought I'd say this but I'm glad Mr Quayle is in charge and not some misguided, ill-informed zealot like you...

I think the press got a bit excited about Sweden and I don't really think it is fair. Doing my public health training there, and having lived there I don't really think it is comparable to other counties. 

The swedes generally have a lot more trust in their government and their public agencies have a lot more freedom from political intervention. At the start of covid, they issued recommendations that weren't too dissimilar from the UK, self isolate, don't go out other than for essentials, work from home if you can and try to avoid public transport. The difference was they didn't make it law/compulsory, instead leaving it to the judgement of the people. The result seems to be that they ended up with more of a slow burn with the authorities seemingly accepting they aren't going to beat it rather than the peaks and troughs the UK has seen.

Society in Sweden is much more socially distant, very few multi-generational households, and a different attitude to working when unwell; you're essentially treated as a danger if you go to work even with a cold and told to go home. 

Their public health surveillance is incredible, every test, prescription, medical records, school records and essentially any interaction with the state is recorded and linked to your national insurance number. They even use bots to monitor twitter, newspapers and facebook to look for clusters of people who report not feeling well. The result is data you can trust and usually free from political interference. 

The swedish economy has been hit by exports and other impacts, and they openly accept they failed to protect nursing homes (as happened in the UK). I don't think it's fair to slam them, neither do I think it is fair to hallow their actions. It's just different and proof not one size fits all. 

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7 minutes ago, benl said:

I think the press got a bit excited about Sweden and I don't really think it is fair. Doing my public health training there, and having lived there I don't really think it is comparable to other counties. 

The swedes generally have a lot more trust in their government and their public agencies have a lot more freedom from political intervention. At the start of covid, they issued recommendations that weren't too dissimilar from the UK, self isolate, don't go out other than for essentials, work from home if you can and try to avoid public transport. The difference was they didn't make it law/compulsory, instead leaving it to the judgement of the people. The result seems to be that they ended up with more of a slow burn with the authorities seemingly accepting they aren't going to beat it rather than the peaks and troughs the UK has seen.

Society in Sweden is much more socially distant, very few multi-generational households, and a different attitude to working when unwell; you're essentially treated as a danger if you go to work even with a cold and told to go home. 

Their public health surveillance is incredible, every test, prescription, medical records, school records and essentially any interaction with the state is recorded and linked to your national insurance number. They even use bots to monitor twitter, newspapers and facebook to look for clusters of people who report not feeling well. The result is data you can trust and usually free from political interference. 

The swedish economy has been hit by exports and other impacts, and they openly accept they failed to protect nursing homes (as happened in the UK). I don't think it's fair to slam them, neither do I think it is fair to hallow their actions. It's just different and proof not one size fits all. 

Quite.

Yes the population density is a factor but so is the density of the population!

However the fact remains their excess deaths were way and above those of their neighbours. For little or no economic gain it would seem.

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17 minutes ago, benl said:

Society in Sweden is much more socially distant, very few multi-generational households, and a different attitude to working when unwell; you're essentially treated as a danger if you go to work even with a cold and told to go home. 

Compare that with Italy where it is often the case that the whole extended family socialise, and dance in the square and all that palaver. 

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2 hours ago, benl said:

I think the press got a bit excited about Sweden and I don't really think it is fair. Doing my public health training there, and having lived there I don't really think it is comparable to other counties. 

The swedes generally have a lot more trust in their government and their public agencies have a lot more freedom from political intervention. At the start of covid, they issued recommendations that weren't too dissimilar from the UK, self isolate, don't go out other than for essentials, work from home if you can and try to avoid public transport. The difference was they didn't make it law/compulsory, instead leaving it to the judgement of the people. The result seems to be that they ended up with more of a slow burn with the authorities seemingly accepting they aren't going to beat it rather than the peaks and troughs the UK has seen.

Society in Sweden is much more socially distant, very few multi-generational households, and a different attitude to working when unwell; you're essentially treated as a danger if you go to work even with a cold and told to go home. 

Their public health surveillance is incredible, every test, prescription, medical records, school records and essentially any interaction with the state is recorded and linked to your national insurance number. They even use bots to monitor twitter, newspapers and facebook to look for clusters of people who report not feeling well. The result is data you can trust and usually free from political interference. 

The swedish economy has been hit by exports and other impacts, and they openly accept they failed to protect nursing homes (as happened in the UK). I don't think it's fair to slam them, neither do I think it is fair to hallow their actions. It's just different and proof not one size fits all. 

Excellent, well-informed, post.

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All countries handling it differently , the Dutch don’t seem bothered either 

Infection rates have hit a new daily peak in the Netherlands - the country was recently added to the UK's red alert list, and its neighbours are following suit. 

And yet on the streets of Dutch cities people are behaving as if the virus has vanished. 

There's a burgeoning movement which subscribes to the "it's a government hoax to control us" conspiracy, Dutch Facebook and Twitter are resplendent with images mocking those who take the risk of infection seriously. Police were called to a friends picnic the other day after a stranger began coughing and wishing coronavirus on them after they tried to create some social distance. 

Why aren't the Dutch panicking? My (Dutch) Twitter followers offered some insights. 

  • This is a deliberate and successful gaslighting campaign by the government
  • A message that Covid only affects the elderly and sick
  • Iedereen moet het voor zichzelf beslissen" - everybody has to decide for themselves
  • A toxic mix of Dutch exceptionalism governed by technocratic leaders.
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11 minutes ago, Banker said:

Looks like the police overstepped mark again, how many successful appeals now against these sentences for borders breaches?

http://www.iomtoday.co.im/article.cfm?id=57821&headline=Magistrates did not have the right to ban you&sectionIs=NEWS&searchyear=2020

Have you read that article? 

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