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IOM Covid removing restrictions


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30 minutes ago, The Dog's Dangly Bits said:

So basically what you originally said was embellished nonsense?

Nope.

I quoted what the lady said and followed it up with the eminently sensible "It's subjective".

Unfortunately people on here seem to think not considered old must be someone in the flower of youth.

Someone I know from the island, not considered "old", caught the virus, came through it and is now suffering badly. It's out there and it's real.

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Can you guys start a separate thread titled "Jersey is ace - oh no it isn't" and leave this one to a discussion on IOM and the coronavirus?

It's a safe place right now because of the Manx people, not the Manx politicians. None of us want to be "the person who brought it back" so we isolate and make sure we don't transmit the virus by bein

Ratio of admissions to deaths is not that different, testing is obviously out due to the massive capacity increase like just about everywhere in the world.    The current UK situation is impact

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1 hour ago, P.K. said:

Nope.

I quoted what the lady said and followed it up with the eminently sensible "It's subjective".

Unfortunately people on here seem to think not considered old must be someone in the flower of youth.

Someone I know from the island, not considered "old", caught the virus, came through it and is now suffering badly. It's out there and it's real.

Facts vast majority of deaths are over 70 and rarely anyone who doesn’t have underlying health issues dies.

strange not one else has heard of this younger person from the island who is suffering badly from effects of Covid-19 

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7 minutes ago, Banker said:

Facts vast majority of deaths are over 70 and rarely anyone who doesn’t have underlying health issues dies.

strange not one else has heard of this younger person from the island who is suffering badly from effects of Covid-19 

To be fair there was the woman who was in a coma in ITU and on a ventilator, who has 'recovered' ie discharged from hospital but who is still suffering the after effects.  It was quite widely publicised. 

I don't think anyone is denying covid exists or that it can be very serious in some people, just disputing how it is managed with the least impact on society as a whole. 

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32 minutes ago, Banker said:

Facts vast majority of deaths are over 70 and rarely anyone who doesn’t have underlying health issues dies

Banker, you seem to be saying that the over 70s are to be dismissed from our health care system. Your Mum and Dad, grannies, Aunts and Uncles without regard for 'our' moral obligation for these groups.?

At your Grannies funeral, if it were pointed out to those present that you would right them off, would it surprise you that you were ostrasised by the rest of your family, possibly your siblings, for your views?

Medical advancement and intervention has added years to our lifespan, in turn it will add even more years to yours!!!

Or would you prefer to curtail it now to save money and shorten your longevity?

My guess is that you would want any intervention to be used to elongate 'YOUR' life!!!

So don't dismiss these advancements to others older than your self!!!

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54 minutes ago, Banker said:

 

strange not one else has heard of this younger person from the island who is suffering badly from effects of Covid-19 

I've heard of a youngster suffering badly with after effects of covid, although to be fair it's a condition that could happen after any number of viral infections.

There will always be rare cases of youngsters getting really ill and even dying, when the majority will be fine.  It happens with measles, mumps, chickenpox, flu...

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So, at what point do you (medics) withdraw medical support to those with co-morbitity?

Surely it is encumbent on you support the ' right to life' for all age sectors, at least, until it becomes a losing battle???

It could be said that you should be countering the younger generations argument that 'Only Young Lives Matter' ?

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Likewise - When an Australian Government stop an alleged highly successful drug that medical professionals claim counteracted covid, then whose decision is it for the right to life for those who may require this claimed successful treatment? Politician or Doctor?

 

 

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2 hours ago, Banker said:

Facts vast majority of deaths are over 70 and rarely anyone who doesn’t have underlying health issues dies.

strange not one else has heard of this younger person from the island who is suffering badly from effects of Covid-19 

Maybe there's a reason for your lack of friends and acquaintances?

There is a very real gap opening up between those who want open borders and everyone takes their chances compared to those who want a normal life minus non-residents. Sure without the profiteering from the TT and MGP the tourist sector are suffering. But their contribution to GDP has been put as low as a few paltry percent.

While the current policy is protecting the residents from Covid-19 there seems little reason to risk it just for what's essentially very little gain...

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5 hours ago, P.K. said:

Just prior to Bozo's briefing on the BBC a very nice lady said half of those hospitalised would not be considered "old".

Sure it's subjective but she did actually say it.

It may well be true., though of course it depends what you mean by old.  What I do know is that half of those who have so far been admitted to ICUs are under 60.  We know this from the latest ICNARC figures[1] that give a median age of 60 for those admitted and the interquartile range was 51-68[2], ie a quarter were under 51.

Now ICU (and hospital) admissions will tend to slant younger than all Covid patients because some of the oldest patients will be too vulnerable to move and treatment priority will be given to the younger when services are stretched, but it does indicate that not all of those affected are very old as some seem to be reassuring themselves.

 

[1]  The fact that there are such figures should be a cause of worry as the last ones were produced at the end of July as the number of Covid patients in ICUs had finally fallen to a low level.  A new report means that the numbers have gone up again.

[2]  This based on the 10,871 admitted to ICUs  up to the end of August.

Edited by Roger Mexico
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6 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

It may well be true., though of course it depends what you mean by old.  What I do know is that half of those who have so far been admitted to ICUs are under 60.  We know this from the latest ICNARC figures[1] that give a median age of 60 for those admitted and the interquartile range was 51-68[2], ie a quarter were under 51.

Now ICU (and hospital) admissions will tend to slant younger than all Covid patients because some of the oldest patients will be too vulnerable to move and treatment priority will be given to the younger when services are stretched, but it does indicate that not all of those affected are very old as some seem to be reassuring themselves.

 

[1]  The fact that there are such figures should be a cause of worry as the last ones were produced at the end of July as the number of Covid patients in ICUs had finally fallen to a low level.  A new report means that the numbers have gone up again.

[2]  This based on the 10,871 admitted to ICUs  up to the end of August.

Those 10,871.  How many of them were admitted to ICU because of Covid, and how many of them were admitted to ICU having tested positive for Covid? Because those are two very different statistics which don’t seem to be available anywhere.

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8 hours ago, Kopek said:

So, at what point do you (medics) withdraw medical support to those with co-morbitity?

Surely it is encumbent on you support the ' right to life' for all age sectors, at least, until it becomes a losing battle???

It could be said that you should be countering the younger generations argument that 'Only Young Lives Matter' ?

What makes Covid more important than other diseases then?

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22 minutes ago, Nom de plume said:

It’s contagious ...

Thats the mentalist mantra!

It is quite alarming how many otherwise sane and intelligent people want to see us locked in over here with borders staying as they are now (or in a lot of cases being closed further
 

There are loads of people coming in every week without any issue (as shown by the ones who tested positive on day 8, who without a test would have been out and about again a few days later)

The long term damage of not opening things up a bit, in a controlled and managed way, will be huge.

I honestly don’t think the government plan was to ever make us “Covid free” it’s just not practical in the long term, but now we are there and so many people seem to think that is where we NEED to be it would be a brave person who makes the decision to open up again and inevitably bring the virus back and result in some illness and some deaths.

How long do people propose we live like this? 1 year, 3? 10?

We are already losing residents who can’t cope with the uncertainty and not being able to (practically) see their family or have a holiday and I am speaking to plenty of other long term residents and even local who are debating upping sticks and relocating as a result.

Plus businesses who can’t fill existing roles, and others who are cutting back expansion plans or halting plans to relocate here, yet loads of people are just happy to live in an artificial bubble just because the only reason they travel if for a holiday occasionally and they can’t comprehend that for many others free movement is essential to either their business or personal life.

Edited by trmpton
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26 minutes ago, trmpton said:

It is quite alarming how many otherwise sane and intelligent people want to see us locked in over here with borders staying as they are now (or in a lot of cases being closed further
 

There are loads of people coming in every week without any issue (as shown by the ones who tested positive on day 8, who without a test would have been out and about again a few days later)

The long term damage of not opening things up a bit, in a controlled and managed way, will be huge.

I honestly don’t think the government plan was to ever make us “Covid free” it’s just not practical in the long term, but now we are there and so many people seem to think that is where we NEED to be it would be a brave person who makes the decision to open up again and inevitably bring the virus back and result in some illness and some deaths.

How long do people propose we live like this? 1 year, 3? 10?

We are already losing residents who can’t cope with the uncertainty and not being able to (practically) see their family or have a holiday and I am speaking to plenty of other long term residents and even local who are debating upping sticks and relocating as a result.

Plus businesses who can’t fill existing roles, and others who are cutting back expansion plans or halting plans to relocate here, yet loads of people are just happy to live in an artificial bubble just because the only reason they travel if for a holiday occasionally and they can’t comprehend that for many others free movement is essential to either their business or personal life.

Let’s see what is announced tonight. 3a is my bet (family sponsored)and if that works 3b (others sponsored) in the new year.

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