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15 hours ago, Josem said:

I have very little interest in politics, but I do, however, have a deep interest in policy. I have very little interest in the personal maneuvering of "who supports who".

That is fine, but in Tynwald you have to be able to take the majority of other MHKS with you in order to further your policies. Wherever there are people there are 'politics', even when trying to engage with the electorate. 

 

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Having said the above, your experiences and comments on them has raised some interesting thoughts, mainly now about the type and attributes of politicians who the public would support at the next GE on a wider scale than currently shown. Profiles, populism, personal policies alongside personal ambitions are all now under the 'public microscope' as Covid has raised some very important issues for the next administration. 

New thread needed maybe but possibly too early for GE 2021?

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8 hours ago, Kopek said:

I'll offer to do the Minister for Pedantism for 4 quid!!!

I think you'll find that it's Pedantry - unless you meant Pederasty? :)

 

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10 hours ago, Josem said:

This is a weird criticism to make in the wake of an election where the Liberal Vannin candidate literally published more about where he stood on policy than literally every other candidate combined.

I'm not sure that that's true, but lets assume that it is. To add my own take to Roger's post about greater volume not implying greater detail, a large part of your offering struck me as being considerably padded out by rhetoric, soundbites and repetition, with little in the way of actual substance that might indicate your general stance on issues. Most importantly in relation to joebean's post, there's nothing there to indicate whether these are purely personal policies or Liberal Vannin's policies that would have applied to any other Lib Van candidate were this a general election.

Take your stance on protecting community safety from crime as an example. Despite there being five paragraphs dedicated to this in your manifesto, there's not actually much there that directly addresses the stated topic apart from a single sentence about monitoring offenders. The bulk of the rest of it is about adjusting sentencing guidelines. Following your campaign, I have no idea where you or, more to the point, Liberal Vannin stand on things such as community policing, staffing levels, etc., that directly relate to community safety. 

As for the economy, your proposal largely boils down to increasing construction with a little bit on increasing local retail spending. That's fine, but those are just two sectors and it doesn't really say much about the wider economy or what your general disposition on it is.  I kinda get the the impression you're a bit of a free marketeer (and haven't spent much time thinking about how free markets actually work, or don't, in a tiny economy like the Isle the Man), but that's a conclusion inferred only from a couple of bits you've written and said about competition. Again, there's no indication whether to vote for another Liberal Vannin candidate would be to vote for a similar platform.

Party politics usually consists of candidates standing on a common and broad ideological platform and then relating that platform to specific local issues in each constituency.  That way the electorate largely knows exactly what they're getting and how it stands to affect their community.  The problem with a limited 'shared ethos' approach is that you end up each constituency being presented with a bitty grab bag of individual policies with little indication of how they interrelate.

 

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, VinnieK said:

Take your stance on protecting community safety from crime as an example. Despite there being five paragraphs dedicated to this in your manifesto, there's not actually much there that directly addresses the stated topic apart from a single sentence about monitoring offenders. The bulk of the rest of it is about adjusting sentencing guidelines.

How does that compare to the other candidates?

 

Here's another way of thinking about it: Out of the 4,729 registered voters, how many thought to themselves, "Jeez, I'm not voting for the Liberal Vannin candidate, Josem, because I don't know where he stands on the issues."  I think the line should be at 0.5.

Edited by Josem

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, Josem said:

How does that compare to the other candidates?

With the exception of Jessopp, the other candidates weren't standing on a party platform, were they? Also, they're not on here making dodgy claims about having published more policy than anyone.

If you'd trundled along as an independent and just blurted out "Hey! I'm Michael Josem, vote for me because I think there should be more houses and less paedos!", then fine.  But you didn't, you stood as a representative of a party that's been around for a sufficient amount of time for it to have figured out a solid political identity and nailed down the details.  

Quote

Here's another way of thinking about it: Out of the 4,729 registered voters, how many thought to themselves, "Jeez, I'm not voting for the Liberal Vannin candidate, Josem, because I don't know where he stands on the issues."  I think the line should be at 0.5.

So, you're coming up with a question that:

  • is only indirectly related to the topic at hand, that being whether you did present a detailed and coherent policy platform and what relation, if any, this bears to Liberal Vannin central policies (should they exist), and
  • is impossible to answer without surveying all of the people who didn't vote for you,

then you pull an estimate out of thin air, and proudly declare it's 'another way of thinking about it'?

A bit of unforgivably condescending advice: ease up on the rhetoric.  As fun as it is, it's off-putting and you're not great at it.

 

 

 

Edited by VinnieK
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1 hour ago, Josem said:

How does that compare to the other candidates?

 

Here's another way of thinking about it: Out of the 4,729 registered voters, how many thought to themselves, "Jeez, I'm not voting for the Liberal Vannin candidate, Josem, because I don't know where he stands on the issues."  I think the line should be at 0.5.

This response entirely fails to address the point Vinnie made.

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14 minutes ago, Uhtred said:

This response entirely fails to address the point Vinnie made.

Of course it didn't. Politicians rarely answer questions.

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6 hours ago, manxman34 said:

I think you'll find that it's Pedantry - unless you meant Pederasty? :)

 

Nope, he's right - it is a word

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2 hours ago, Uhtred said:

This response entirely fails to address the point Vinnie made.

The idea that this election turned on my lack of policy substance is completely bonkers and insane. It's a totally nutty take that has no meaningful relationship to reality. Addressing that point is impossible because it is not grounded in the reality of the universe that we live in.

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14 hours ago, dilligaf said:

Yes I appreciate that Neil, but Hooper is clever, just hasn’t refined his PR yet.

He first stood for Tynwald 9 years ago.... how much longer does he need to refine his PR?

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Josem said:

How does that compare to the other candidates?

 

Here's another way of thinking about it: Out of the 4,729 registered voters, how many thought to themselves, "Jeez, I'm not voting for the Liberal Vannin candidate, Josem, because I don't know where he stands on the issues."  I think the line should be at 0.5.

so if that isn't why you lost, have you worked out the actual reason yet?

Edited by Rhumsaa
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8 minutes ago, Josem said:

The idea that this election turned on my lack of policy substance is completely bonkers and insane. It's a totally nutty take that has no meaningful relationship to reality. Addressing that point is impossible because it is not grounded in the reality of the universe that we live in.

Having stood twice (unsuccessfully) in East Douglas, the lowest turnout of all constituencies, I am convinced that it is purely down to offering more of the same. People who vote don't want change (PS workers and comfortably retired), those who want change can't be bothered voting (generally)! That may be a paradox but I think it reflects the disdain with which a lot of people hold politics on the island. They perceive corruption, in some cases they are right, so why put another no hoper in there. Maintaining the status quo is what the House of Keys is about, our politicians are subliminally tamed into submission very early on. 

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