Chief Constables Report 19/20. Latest distribution of Tripe

[Scotty 495]

2 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

Well it is one way of getting away from crab-like pricks such as yourself Kipper.

if you happen to grow a pair before I go, more than happy to buy the brews. I’d be fascinated to find out how I single-handedly held the force back to the extent you seem to think. 

!!

[Derek Flint 4,052]

1 hour ago, finlo said:

Didn't we end up having the highest murder rate in Britain that year?

I think per capita we did! There was a terrible run of violent deaths and I do recall someone trotting out such a statistic.

 

[Whatnonsence 268]

According to the state of the nation speech reported today on Manx Radio delivered by the Chief Minister both the police and fire service will be exposed to an independent inspection by their UK inspectorate.

 

 

[John Wright 7,992]

11 minutes ago, Whatnonsence said:

According to the state of the nation speech reported today on Manx Radio delivered by the Chief Minister both the police and fire service will be exposed to an independent inspection by their UK inspectorate.

 

 

And Juan Watterson SHK is against that. Wasn’t he Home Affairs before he got his wig? Tells you all you need to know about ehh we’ve not had regular inspections..

[Derek Flint 4,052]

41 minutes ago, John Wright said:

And Juan Watterson SHK is against that. Wasn’t he Home Affairs before he got his wig? Tells you all you need to know about ehh we’ve not had regular inspections..

Didn’t know about that. Very interesting....

[Non-Believer 12,461]

1 hour ago, John Wright said:

And Juan Watterson SHK is against that. Wasn’t he Home Affairs before he got his wig? Tells you all you need to know about ehh we’ve not had regular inspections..

Where did you pick this up from please John, I checked iomtoday which covers it but the only reporting of concerns was Jane Poole-Wilson's comments, as per these boards, over DHA and Justice coming under the same umbrella?

[Boo Gay'n 583]

21 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

Where did you pick this up from please John, I checked iomtoday which covers it but the only reporting of concerns was Jane Poole-Wilson's comments, as per these boards, over DHA and Justice coming under the same umbrella?

BBC linky

[Apple 656]

1 hour ago, John Wright said:

Tells you all you need to know about ehh we’ve not had regular inspections..

I am not sure we have regular inspections for health and education and any other services at this same level. Doing it in this last year of this administration smacks of someone trying to draw a line under where we are now. We know the results before it takes place anyway as the terms of reference will determine the best possible outcome can be developed. 

 

[Non-Believer 12,461]

1 hour ago, Boo Gay'n said:

BBC linky

Ah. The Manx solution for Manx problems. Don't look for any problems.

Receive award and pension for service. Retire.

The best form of critique is external and impartial. You can't critique your own work. It's pointless. Especially here.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Non-Believer
Typo

[Derek Flint 4,052]

10 hours ago, Apple said:

I am not sure we have regular inspections for health and education and any other services at this same level. Doing it in this last year of this administration smacks of someone trying to draw a line under where we are now. We know the results before it takes place anyway as the terms of reference will determine the best possible outcome can be developed. 

 

HMIC use the PEEL inspection framework and I can’t see any reason why this wouldn’t be used for our force. 

https://www.justiceinspectorates.gov.uk/hmicfrs/peel-assessments/peel-2017/

There was an attempt to do this internally a few years ago, but the results were never published for some reason. A real pity because the small team that did it worked really hard.

[Apple 656]

5 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

HMIC use the PEEL inspection framework and I can’t see any reason why this wouldn’t be used for our force. 

https://www.justiceinspectorates.gov.uk/hmicfrs/peel-assessments/peel-2017/

 

Thank you for the link. It's not the tools for assessment it is about who does it, and who they are answerable to. As you know our own Monitoring  Board and health service committees are paid for and reported to Comin / Tynwald but precious little comes back in a timely manner to the public. The responses to those annual reports are also not shared. Bad practice in my view.

Lots of information that those two groups for example may help provide with background information to peoples complaints citing any organisational problems / governance failures. But the most they do is an annual report, often too late in the year to be any specific use to the public.

Scrutiny and audit need to be built in to the fabric of any organisation and be continuous to be as effective as possible, and should undertaken by a totally independent public group. Not ex or serving officers. 

[Derek Flint 4,052]

1 hour ago, Apple said:

Thank you for the link. It's not the tools for assessment it is about who does it, and who they are answerable to. As you know our own Monitoring  Board and health service committees are paid for and reported to Comin / Tynwald but precious little comes back in a timely manner to the public. The responses to those annual reports are also not shared. Bad practice in my view.

Lots of information that those two groups for example may help provide with background information to peoples complaints citing any organisational problems / governance failures. But the most they do is an annual report, often too late in the year to be any specific use to the public.

Scrutiny and audit need to be built in to the fabric of any organisation and be continuous to be as effective as possible, and should undertaken by a totally independent public group. Not ex or serving officers. 

HMIC operates independently and has a mix of civilian and police staff. 

They are honest and brutally so where necessary.

[Apple 656]

This from the link:

 

In preparing our reports, we ask the questions that citizens would ask, and publish the answers in accessible form, using our expertise to interpret the evidence and make recommendations for improvement.

We provide authoritative information to allow the public to compare the performance of their police force and fire & rescue service against others. Our evidence is used to drive improvements in the services they provide to the public.

Independence

HMICFRS is independent of government, the police and fire & rescue authorities:

HM Inspectors are appointed by the Crown. They are not employees of the police service, the fire & rescue service or the government.
In the dual role of HM Chief Inspector of Constabulary and HM Chief Inspector of Fire & Rescue Services, the Chief Inspector reports on the efficiency and effectiveness of police services in England and Wales, and on the efficiency and effectiveness of fire & rescue services in England.
HM Inspectors may be called to give evidence before committees of Parliament, and must also account for their actions to the public through the media. As is the case with all public bodies, HM Inspectors are also susceptible to judicial review.
Although HMICFRS’s budget is set by the government, and the inspection programmes require the Home Secretary’s approval, no Minister, police and crime commissioner or fire authority can interfere with the contents of an HMICFRS report or the judgment of HM Inspectors

Not independent enough for me. The police have never welcomed public oversight (I have several in my own family, some at high rank). We have some lively debates. We still haven't seen the minutes from the poice scrutiny committee we are supposed to have on the island that I referred toaster seeing it in the CCs report.

Has anyone seen notes form their meetings, or know anything about their funding arrangements? Or are we not supposed to know.

[Derek Flint 4,052]

3 hours ago, Apple said:

This from the link:

 

In preparing our reports, we ask the questions that citizens would ask, and publish the answers in accessible form, using our expertise to interpret the evidence and make recommendations for improvement.

We provide authoritative information to allow the public to compare the performance of their police force and fire & rescue service against others. Our evidence is used to drive improvements in the services they provide to the public.

Independence

HMICFRS is independent of government, the police and fire & rescue authorities:

HM Inspectors are appointed by the Crown. They are not employees of the police service, the fire & rescue service or the government.
In the dual role of HM Chief Inspector of Constabulary and HM Chief Inspector of Fire & Rescue Services, the Chief Inspector reports on the efficiency and effectiveness of police services in England and Wales, and on the efficiency and effectiveness of fire & rescue services in England.
HM Inspectors may be called to give evidence before committees of Parliament, and must also account for their actions to the public through the media. As is the case with all public bodies, HM Inspectors are also susceptible to judicial review.
Although HMICFRS’s budget is set by the government, and the inspection programmes require the Home Secretary’s approval, no Minister, police and crime commissioner or fire authority can interfere with the contents of an HMICFRS report or the judgment of HM Inspectors

Not independent enough for me. The police have never welcomed public oversight (I have several in my own family, some at high rank). We have some lively debates. We still haven't seen the minutes from the poice scrutiny committee we are supposed to have on the island that I referred toaster seeing it in the CCs report.

Has anyone seen notes form their meetings, or know anything about their funding arrangements? Or are we not supposed to know.

There is something about it in the Annual report. And you can easily contact the Chair.

some cops openly welcome external scrutiny. In the IOMC it is long, long overdue. Personally I think the inspection will find a mixed bag, of excellent and poor performance. But it is then easy to develop. It’s a bit like pissing in the wind otherwise 

[Apple 656]

1 hour ago, Derek Flint said:

There is something about it in the Annual report. And you can easily contact the Chair.

I know -I  pointed it out. I asked if there was a public platform to see the minutes / notes of their meetings.

 

1 hour ago, Derek Flint said:

some cops openly welcome external scrutiny. In the IOMC it is long, long overdue.

Not the right cops then or it would have been inbuilt by now.