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Manx Gas MEGA Price Rise


James Blonde
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On 9/4/2022 at 9:41 PM, 0bserver said:

If only we had a local source of natural gas. 

If only too that it didn’t come out on the original gas debate that as Manx Gas’ biggest single user IOMG benefits from a special tariff with Manx Gas - the lowest possible gas tariff which nobody but IOMG gets and which is subsidized by all other Manx Gas users on domestic or commercial tariffs. There is a lot that IOMG could do to lower the price of gas here for everyone else but won’t. 

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12 hours ago, offshoremanxman said:

If only too that it didn’t come out on the original gas debate that as Manx Gas’ biggest single user IOMG benefits from a special tariff with Manx Gas - the lowest possible gas tariff which nobody but IOMG gets and which is subsidized by all other Manx Gas users on domestic or commercial tariffs. There is a lot that IOMG could do to lower the price of gas here for everyone else but won’t. 

Gas users massively subsidising government buildings including Nobles seems to be conveniently left out of the conversation.  Why are gas users solely responsible for paying the government gas bill?

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2 minutes ago, cissolt said:

Gas users massively subsidising government buildings including Nobles seems to be conveniently left out of the conversation.  Why are gas users solely responsible for paying the government gas bill?

I don’t know. Some MHK needs to raise the issue as it seems to have been forgotten about in the anger that the MUA seems to have nicely helped direct at Manx Gas. The whole of IOMG is getting a free ride paid for by us - and still is. They get a tariff that is below the cost of MG actually supplying the gas and we make up the difference. 

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26 minutes ago, cissolt said:

Gas users massively subsidising government buildings including Nobles seems to be conveniently left out of the conversation.  Why are gas users solely responsible for paying the government gas bill?

Yes, but remember the government gas bill includes the gas used for generating the vast majority of electricity. So we are all paying, not just gas users.

on that subject, since oil has plummeted in price, are there plans to fire up Peel power station, capable of generating 1/3 plus of our electricity? Would reduce the overall bill. Also, use diesel to push the generating power of the incinerator to full capacity. 

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1 hour ago, Cambon said:

Yes, but remember the government gas bill includes the gas used for generating the vast majority of electricity. So we are all paying, not just gas users.

This isn't true.  It's the MUA that buys the gas and then sells the gas it doesn't use for electricity generation on the Manx Gas.  Who then sell it on to us.  It also sells it to the government at a very preferential rate for other purposes, but not for electricity generation.

1 hour ago, Cambon said:

on that subject, since oil has plummeted in price, are there plans to fire up Peel power station, capable of generating 1/3 plus of our electricity? Would reduce the overall bill. Also, use diesel to push the generating power of the incinerator to full capacity. 

I pointed out on here that the generating capacity of the oil-fired plants at Peel and Pulrose together is roughly the same as the gas plant.  As to the incinerator I'm not sure that it is producing any 'Energy from Waste' at all at the moment, or ever will again.

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2 hours ago, cissolt said:

Gas users massively subsidising government buildings including Nobles seems to be conveniently left out of the conversation.  Why are gas users solely responsible for paying the government gas bill?

Isn't it swings and roundabouts, the taxpayer is paying in the end anyway? If Govt started paying a higher rate for its gas used then those higher charges would ultimately fall on the taxpayer anyway, surely, possibly leading to increased taxation? Everything Govt forks out comes from the taxpayer ultimately.

What pisses me off is heating and lighting left on in Govt and LA buildings overnight, there are savings to be made there in no uncertain circumstances.

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19 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

This isn't true.  It's the MUA that buys the gas and then sells the gas it doesn't use for electricity generation on the Manx Gas.  Who then sell it on to us.  It also sells it to the government at a very preferential rate for other purposes, but not for electricity generation.

I pointed out on here that the generating capacity of the oil-fired plants at Peel and Pulrose together is roughly the same as the gas plant.  As to the incinerator I'm not sure that it is producing any 'Energy from Waste' at all at the moment, or ever will again.

MU procure virtually all the gas, and sell what is required on to Manx gas. MU also use gas they have procured to generate electricity. 

The incinerator does not burn enough rubbish to generate electricity. They used to burn additional diesel in order to produce electricity but it was not cost effective. It almost certainly is now. 

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4 hours ago, Cambon said:

MU procure virtually all the gas, and sell what is required on to Manx gas. MU also use gas they have procured to generate electricity. 

The incinerator does not burn enough rubbish to generate electricity. They used to burn additional diesel in order to produce electricity but it was not cost effective. It almost certainly is now. 

Are you sure about this. I know these energy from waste plants need diesel to start up from cold, but not once they are running. It would be pointless. I went for a trip round last year and it was generating 4MW per day. I'm sure it has its issues but if its privately run and makes money by taking waste and generating electricity I wouldn't think it would be viable if it cost more to fuel it than it generated. 

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5 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

  As to the incinerator I'm not sure that it is producing any 'Energy from Waste' at all at the moment, or ever will again.

Not sure infers you are, well......not sure!

What makes you think this? What's happening to all the rubbish that gets sent up there? 

Is there a tasty rumour you can share?

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7 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Are you sure about this. I know these energy from waste plants need diesel to start up from cold, but not once they are running. It would be pointless. I went for a trip round last year and it was generating 4MW per day. I'm sure it has its issues but if its privately run and makes money by taking waste and generating electricity I wouldn't think it would be viable if it cost more to fuel it than it generated. 

The problem is there is simply not enough rubbish to keep the generator going. Too much recycling, perhaps? But, yes, they used to put diesel in to keep it going. 

I think it was said when the incinerator was built that it was too big for our use at the time, and required waste from well in excess of 100,000 people to work efficiently. 

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4 hours ago, Doctor Kenneth Noisewater said:

Can you tell us more please?

16 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Not sure infers you are, well......not sure!

What makes you think this? What's happening to all the rubbish that gets sent up there? 

Is there a tasty rumour you can share?

I wasn't sure and was relying on some old gossip, but I had been struck by how little it seemed to be mentioned recently whenever renewables were being mentioned - only the tiny amount of hydro seemed to be featured.  I knew that there was no generation about a year ago because according to their site:

In September 2021, our turbine was sent away for its major service. This essential piece of maintenance, which takes place every seven years, requires the turbine to be sent off Island for several weeks to specialists in the UK.

And I got the distinct impression that the gap was longer than just several weeks.

Looking at that link it does seem to be back in operation and producing electricity.  However if you look at the detailed data, you can see that no electricity was generated between 17 June and 19 July, which suggests that there may still be problems.  There's no data older than 90 days ago available, so it's impossible tell if this is a recurring problem.

Of course there's also the issue of how renewable all this is, in other words how much oil is required to produce that amount of electricity from burning rubbish when in operation.  It's certainly true that it was certainly over-spec'd as Cambon says - back when a previous administration believed that all you needed to do was say you wanted 100,000 residents and it would magically happen without effort or pain.

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