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1 hour ago, lawfulintrigue said:

Anyone know why management of pubs (usally Heron pubs) are constantly changing? Hit and miss with food as well as less variety on the menus?

From what I have heard from people that have been employed by them as Landlords, they are an absolute nightmare to work for. 

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3 hours ago, lawfulintrigue said:

Anyone know why management of pubs (usally Heron pubs) are constantly changing? Hit and miss with food as well as less variety on the menus?

H&B pubs?

As Phantom says, they're not very nice to work for. That and the abundance of jobs in the hospitality sector means people don't need to work where they don't want to.

I don't eat in them but from what I've heard (that word again...), food wise, they all have the same, if not very similar menus and are often not great quality. 

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6 hours ago, lawfulintrigue said:

The Phantom, if they are such bad employers how do they get away with how badly they treat people? Are they too big a company to argue with and ask for respect for their emplyees?

Have you worked for many Manx companies?

I've had a few and can count the number of ones who were good to the employees on a couple of fingers.

Employers generally get away with murder. I think there's even more reluctance to call it out here given it's such a small place.

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16 hours ago, lawfulintrigue said:

The Phantom, if they are such bad employers how do they get away with how badly they treat people? Are they too big a company to argue with and ask for respect for their emplyees?

Purely basing this on what some friends told me about 5 years ago when they working for H&B as Landlords.  Unrealistic targets, no help from them relating to improvements or changes required for the buildings.   Historically I suppose people just lumped it due to lack of other options and bearing in mind they are the biggest operator of pubs on the Island.  Now however there is a huge shortage of hospitality staff everywhere, so they are just moving elsewhere. 

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On 6/16/2022 at 10:19 AM, The Phantom said:

Purely basing this on what some friends told me about 5 years ago when they working for H&B as Landlords.  Unrealistic targets, no help from them relating to improvements or changes required for the buildings.   Historically I suppose people just lumped it due to lack of other options and bearing in mind they are the biggest operator of pubs on the Island.  Now however there is a huge shortage of hospitality staff everywhere, so they are just moving elsewhere. 

I'm in the process of recruiting at the moment.

Whilst it has been advertised through the regular channels we've only received one response. Unfortunately I need someone with some experience and this person didn't have.

However what I've done is actually go to a few H&B pubs, which I wouldn't normally frequent, for a beer and chatted to the staff at the same time. There is serious disharmony between most of them and their employers. Are they 'ideal' for what I need? No. But they've had no formal training and are on absolute minimum wage. Can they be shown what I need them to do and have some experience which could help in other areas? Absolutely. 

It's becoming cut throat out there but if you pay treat people minimum wage and treat them like crap then they'll have no loyalty to you. Look after them they will. There's also the issue of the wage. We pay living wage which helps make staff a bit happier but I don't believe money is quite as important as simply treating people well and making their job interesting. 

Edited by jackwhite
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Thanks jackwhite, fully take your point but feel that if H&B are not training and supporting staff if they siggest changes, it is no wonder there is a quick turnround and then the service suffers but H&B have not taken onboard all the negative feedback but just carry on regardless.

Good luck with your recruiting and I am sure with your training they will be great,

I have worked for many Manx companies ( and government) but not in hospitality.

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17 hours ago, lawfulintrigue said:

Thanks jackwhite, fully take your point but feel that if H&B are not training and supporting staff if they siggest changes, it is no wonder there is a quick turnround and then the service suffers but H&B have not taken onboard all the negative feedback but just carry on regardless.

Good luck with your recruiting and I am sure with your training they will be great,

I have worked for many Manx companies ( and government) but not in hospitality.

Your first line hits the nail on the head mate. They don't care. 

Always work for an independent where possible and make sure the owner/manager is a good guy. You can tell very quickly. 

I've worked in other industries mate and it's not unique to hospitality. Feel as a collective Manx employers have a long way to go. Absolutely some of them are great but there are some others who wouldn't last very long in other jurisdictions. Not that there aren't poor employers everywhere, but I am never surprised by what I hear here. 

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5 hours ago, Roxanne said:

They've had years of a steady stream of people lining up for jobs.  It's not like that now but they don't seem to have caught up with the concept of being nice to their staff and treating them fairly.

The culture goes back to when the Cowley's stopped controlling the Company

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3 hours ago, alpha-acid said:

The culture goes back to when the Cowley's stopped controlling the Company

The Cowley’s treated their staff well. Jobs were “dead man’s shoes” now they treat their staff shoddily and wonder why they are going down the pan quickly. Kind of coincides with turning into a freight hub instead of a brewery

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Just now, Passing Time said:

The Cowley’s treated their staff well. Jobs were “dead man’s shoes” now they treat their staff shoddily and wonder why they are going down the pan quickly. Kind of coincides with turning into a freight hub instead of a brewery

It was never a Brewery, H+B ' s bought Okells which was the brewery but also had pubs of their own

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