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IOM government conference


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31 minutes ago, SleepyJoe said:

Idea should be to get online enterprises to domicile their businesses here, but there have to be incentives for them to do so

That way not so many new people will be required

That's the spirit.

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34 minutes ago, Numbnuts said:

Those you went today and are up to speed.. Anything you'd recommend to go to tomorrow please ? And is there a entry fee or do you just walk in ...thanks .

You can just walk in & they give you a lanyard to write your name on!!

Im hoping to go to housing one with Thomas & maybe brownfield regeneration after that

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10 minutes ago, Banker said:

You can just walk in & they give you a lanyard to write your name on!!

Im hoping to go to housing one with Thomas & maybe brownfield regeneration after that

Thanks for that... got time to check my spelling  of Micky Mouse then 🙂  . Might take a walk down , thanks again 

Edited by Numbnuts
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4 hours ago, Banker said:

Just been to health one, Rob had obviously been practicing as delivery was good for his slides.

The pet presenter then asked the panel some questions which they answered ok ish but waffled a lot. Some questions from audience mainly around Staff shortage etc.

92 nurses short & trying to recruit from abroad & 14 new consultants recruited.

Too short & lacking details & lots of waffle 

Agree. Already heard some of it in the stuff Manx Care repeatedly pump out about how good they aim to do ..in future. 

Avoided mention of the recently disclosed (leaked)  A and E CQC report and what they are doing about " feral senior medical staff" though. 

Edited by Apple
just now typo
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20 minutes ago, Apple said:

Agree. Already heard some of it in the stuff Manx Care repeatedly pump out about how good they aim to do ..in future. 

Avoided mention of the recently disclosed (liked)  A and E CQC report and what they are doing about " feral senior medical staff" though. 

Castrating them, hopefully. 

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My overall impression from yesterday’s sessions was that the IOMG have set out a long-term vision but the path forward, between the realities of today and their visions of the future, is muddy and unclear. E.g., it seems to me that attracting companies to the Island with ‘digital presence’ only without (many) people will not be possible under the ‘substantiality’ rules (agreed with OECD) that a company must have certain physical presence on the Island in order to be recognised for tax purposes.

I am hoping that today’s session on ‘Sustainability of Public Finances’ with Dr Alex will be less of a talking shop and will offer some ‘actual’ facts. Speaking of facts, a question was asked about the cost of the Liverpool Dock escalating to £100m. The answer Alf gave was along the lines that through the public consultations the message from the GMP was that Liverpool Dock was what the GMP wanted and therefore Liverpool Dock is what the GMP is going to get. In other words, regardless of the cost, the Liverpool Dock just had to go ahead.

I am also confused by some peoples’ ongoing vilification of Daphne. She is not saying anything different about climate change emergency to what anyone else who understand how critical the situation has already become is also saying (VIPs, like King Charles III and Sir David Attenborough, are saying exactly what Daphne is saying). In her slides she highlighted that although the IOM’s total polluting emissions are low, our GHG emissions per capita are one of the highest in the world. An interesting point that came up a couple of times was that many companies are adopting ESG principles which will prevent them from investing in/ existing in jurisdictions which do not have adequate green credentials. This change makes a clear link between our green agenda and our economic welfare. Although to date, the IOM has hardly suffered at all from the impact of climate change ‘extreme weather events’ - other countries are, and they are demanding action. E.g., Pakistan’s government is unequivocal in their demand for developed countries to repatriate poor countries for the damage that is being caused by climate change catastrophes such the recent devastating floods. In the UN, over next couple of days, member states will be discussing a ‘global windfall’ tax on fossil fuel companies, etc. This is a moral question as much as it is an economic one.

Another take-away from the conference was that the UK mini budget could throw a host of spanners in the financial works of the Island. Top of that list of fears is the possibility of the UK cutting the VAT rate. Because we have the FERSA agreement, that change would have an unavoidable and serious impact on IOMG finances.

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1 hour ago, code99 said:

 E.g., it seems to me that attracting companies to the Island with ‘digital presence’ only without (many) people will not be possible under the ‘substantiality’ rules (agreed with OECD) that a company must have certain physical presence on the Island in order to be recognised for tax purposes.

Does that mean simply having a company address in Athol Street is no longer enough to benefit from the Manx "tax haven"?

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FWIW I think Daphne has a fairly good handle on the reality and she is very keen to get started. I doubt that anyone who has given the subject proper consideration would disagree. I do think she made an error yesterday in spending the first 5-10 minutes showing scary graphs and quoting stuff we are all aware of. She should merely have said 'We have an emergency, proposals have been made and Tynwald is expected to approve those'. Now lets discuss how we can "green" our economy. Unfortunately we effectively got nowhere as time ran out.

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1 hour ago, code99 said:

it seems to me that attracting companies to the Island with ‘digital presence’ only without (many) people will not be possible under the ‘substantiality’ rules (agreed with OECD) that a company must have certain physical presence on the Island in order to be recognised for tax purposes.

It's 'Substance'.  Certain types of business need to have a real substance and presence here and demonstrate that key decisions are made and real activity goes on here, generally through some staff and directors.  You now have to make a declaration as part of your company tax return.  Same with most jurisdictions internationally to be honest.  

https://assets.kpmg/content/dam/kpmg/im/pdf/kpmg-isle-of-man-substance-requirements.pdf

BVI has lost a lot of business due to this.  They were traditionally literally just a company factory.  They have limited real fiduciary offerings for experienced directors and managers to run companies from there.  I've seen a lot of companies therefore transfer from BVI to here, as we can offer these bona fide services, experience and knowledge. 

26 minutes ago, Zarley said:

Does that mean simply having a company address in Athol Street is no longer enough to benefit from the Manx "tax haven"?

To be honest, it's always been the way if any companies are actually looked into by another jurisdiction's tax investigators.  Most countries have what is known as 'Management & Control' rules that state if you undertake all of these activities and key decisions are made from jurisdiction X but the company is registered in jurisdiction Y, then they will just ignore the fact it is in jurisdiction Y and tax it as per jurisdiction X.  However if the company doesn't have any taxable income or say you live in Dubai or something then it becomes a bit of a moot point. 

Long gone are the days that you could just set up a brass plate business on the IOM and run it from somewhere completely different. 

Edited by The Phantom
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1 hour ago, code99 said:

I am hoping that today’s session on ‘Sustainability of Public Finances’ with Dr Alex will be less of a talking shop and will offer some ‘actual’ facts. Speaking of facts, a question was asked about the cost of the Liverpool Dock escalating to £100m. The answer Alf gave was along the lines that through the public consultations the message from the GMP was that Liverpool Dock was what the GMP wanted and therefore Liverpool Dock is what the GMP is going to get. In other words, regardless of the cost, the Liverpool Dock just had to go ahead.

Did he happen to mention anything about how they propose to recoup the still rising costs or is that another Great Unmentionable amongst the pigs on the wing?

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10 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

It's 'Substance'.  Certain types of business need to have a real substance and presence here and demonstrate that key decisions are made and real activity goes on here, generally through some staff and directors.  You now have to make a declaration as part of your company tax return.  Same with most jurisdictions internationally to be honest.  

https://assets.kpmg/content/dam/kpmg/im/pdf/kpmg-isle-of-man-substance-requirements.pdf

BVI has lost a lot of business due to this.  They were traditionally literally just a company factory.  They have limited real fiduciary offerings for experienced directors and managers to run companies from there.  I've seen a lot of companies therefore transfer from BVI to here, as we can offer these bona fide services, experience and knowledge. 

To be honest, it's always been the way if any companies are actually looked into by another jurisdiction's tax investigators.  Most countries have what is known as 'Management & Control' rules that state if you undertake all of these activities and key decisions are made from jurisdiction X but the company is registered in jurisdiction Y, then they will just ignore the fact it is in jurisdiction Y and tax it as per jurisdiction X.  However if the company doesn't have any taxable income or say you live in Dubai or something then it becomes a bit of a moot point. 

Long gone are the days that you could just set up a brass plate business on the IOM and run it from somewhere completely different. 

I've run out of "reactions" this morning so I'll say it here; thank you for your detailed explanation. 

ETA also thank you for using the phrase "brass plate". I was trying to remember how such companies were referred to but... brainfog!

Edited by Zarley
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