cheeky boy
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Posts posted by cheeky boy
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Which social media site did the screenshots of the allegedly incriminating texts appear on ?
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17 hours ago, Tempus Fugit said:
did anyone mention that their new pier crossed the power interconnector cable coming ashore at Port Skillion and so couldn't dredge it any deeper for their boats ?
I watched them put that cable in whilst keeping an eye on my lobster pots, it runs right through the proposed site for the deep water berth
Dredging without moving the cable is an impossibility, moving the cable would add a massive cost to the project
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1 hour ago, 2bees said:
I'd move to the Isle of Man from France, yes. It's lovely here.
There's a boat in the morning if you don't like it here, well sometimes there's a boat, if they haven't crashed it
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On 11/08/2017 at 2:52 PM, mojomonkey said:
Have you got the application number handy? I'd like to look through the application.
I went through the file in the planning office, I don't have copies or numbers for it.
Planning has been granted though
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I went through the planning application, public submissions etc. today
A condition of planning is that the right of way across the sea frontage be maintained
Looking at the location of the gates, just ahead of the steps to the beach and the fact that only that end house is gated, the only possible reason for that is to block off the right of way
If you were going to gate the development the gate would be at the other end, but that would allow people to walk across the beach and up the steps
We all know what will happen once the gates are up, the pedestrian gate will remain locked and there will be some excuse about not being able to locate the key
I propose a concerted effort to do away with the gates all together
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13 minutes ago, the stinking enigma said:
It is. Just some of them stayed 20 years.
Wow ! it must be really nice
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Wasn't Mount Murray meant to be tourist accommodation ?
Just saying................
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Steve was the man who spotted the opportunity in the VAT agreement to Manx register films on the Island, shoot some of the production here then claim the whole VAT content back from the UK treasury
It was estimated that he generated over 200 million for the Manx exchequer in the first 10 years, not counting the amount that was spent locally by the film companies on hotels, transport etc.
On a personal level he was a genuinely nice guy who never affected any of the bullshit that goes with showbiz, he gave the impression of being slightly surprised at his success
One of the good guys, sadly missed
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http://www.fdn-engineering.nl/floating-breakwater-in-monaco
This is the sort of thing they have in mind I believe.
That came in at 75,000 euro a metre for the breakwater, which is about 26,000,000 for the Douglas one
Then it has to be secured and a linkspan attached
Not sure about the draught clearance being sufficient either, 10 m at a low spring is going to leave the bow of the liner resting on the bottom according to the drawings
So if dredging has to be factored in there's another significant cost
Even if the engineering stacks up and the breakwater is sufficient to hold back the swell while a ship docks, I still can't see a cost/benefit ratio that would attract outside investement
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This is the proposed location for the terminal
The swell in this shot is around 3 metres, It can comfortably double that even in summer
Offshore gas platforms are constructed to deal with swells 4 times that, so construction is not the issue. It's the impossibility of safely bringing alongside a vessel without damaging it or the pontoon
Even if this were possible the strains on the mooring lines as the vessel rises and falls out of sync with the pontoon would be too much
Some of you must have seen the motion of the seacat alongside the berth on the Mersey, bear in mind that is several miles from open sea and with a swell of around one metre on a bad day
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The Isle of Man saw 5,400 visitors on 17 cruise ships last year, generating £3 a head in harbour dues
any on island spend is guesswork, most spend nothing
Ok actual quantifiable fact's 16k harbour dues and accepting hboy's tenner a head spend on island making a total of 70 grand for the year!
So how does any sane person square that with Mr Ugland's statement that "potentially" (I love that word!) 60000 passengers per year spending 60 quid each " could" add 36million a year to the Manx economy!
By the way the 2010 TT brought 19 million into the Manx economy in the fortnight according to IOM Govs figures, yet people complain that it's loss making!!
So setting aside the fact that the proposed location looks to have been chosen purely for the fact that the water is deep enough and no account taken of tidal conditions and added to the lack of any credible business case being put forward you have to say that this saga äppears" to have the "potential to exceed the Bendybus and Choo Choo fiascos fiasco by a very long margin !!
F*cking great entertainment though!!
How do you know that IOMSA haven't taken account of the tidal conditions?
If the IOMSA have taken account of tidal conditions and the state of the sea in that area and still tink they could successfully berth a ship there, then they shouldn't really be in a business that concerns anything maritime
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From IOM Today:
Mr Ugland said: ‘We have been talking to some investment companies to see if we can raise private equity. Government and the private sector can work together to raise the finance. But it is important the government is fully supportive.’
"fully supportive", I assume he means that the government will have to show the colour of it's money before the private equity sharks get in the water
Taking this forward the next step would be to present a business case, in order to do that there will have to be a feasibility study done on the proposed location
My guess is that this will involve some highly paid professionals and the charter of a survey vessel. After buggering about round the end of the breakwater for a few weeks the highly paid professionals and their boat will go home to compile a report
The report will emerge six months later and run to five hundred pages
It will conclude that the location is unsuitable
The cost of the report will be paid by us
The report will cost £750,000
Here's my plan for a feasibility study:
Most of the queenie boats have a sonar - GPS interface which can build up a map of the seabed. Due to the quota system plenty of them sit idle for days on end
Such a boat could map the area in a day or two
The seabed substrate was surveyed in that area when the breakwater was built, so the Harbours Division will have that on information file
Admiralty charts will give the tidal range and flow, specific flow rates could be established using a small boat with a GPS and simply drifting through the location at spring & neap tides
The Met Office at Ronaldsway will have all wind speed & direction data needed
There are several retire Master Mariners resident here, one of them could be paid to look at the data and the site and give an opinion as to the suitability of mooring a 60,000 ton vessel there
Cost: less than £20,000
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Orkney got £4 million into the local economy from cruise passengers
With a deepwater ship berth costing in the hundreds of millions I cannot see any way of repaying the cost before the thing wears out
To give you an example of a cheaper tourism investment look at Majorca. They had funds available and were considering building yet another marina, instead they invested in making the islands roads cycle friendly by widening some of the main routes and putting a 1.5 meter wide cycleway on one side
The result was a massive uptake in cycle holidays in the spring & autumn when the weather was cool enough
I was there last April and they had 25,000 cyclists a week going through the place, using hotels, cafes, bike hire shops, the airlines & ferries and spending considerably more than a tea & scone day tripper
A huge and ongoing return for a modest investment
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-30794701
The estimated economic benefit to Orkney was £7m in 2016, the total cost of their berth was £29m (original in 2002 and then extension in 2013)
The deep water berth will not cost "hundreds of millions" and its expected lifespan is 100 years.
The £50m includes an estimate for shore-side infrastructure modifications, and is only an estimate based on feasibility study designs, not the final design.
As stated, the business case detailing ownership/funding/revenues has to stack up, and this is the next step.
If the project gets the go-ahead based on a sound business case, and for whatever reason the assumptions in the business case do not materialise over the longer term, there is still the option to sell the asset, as clearly it is moveable and it has 100 year design life. This also mitigates the financial risk.
Can we just stand back for a second an take in what is being proposed here
A 170 meter linkspan to a floating pontoon anchored on the outside of the current breakwater, this structure will then have ships from 20,000 to 60,000 tons berthed alongside
If you consider the structure in isolation it may make sense, but when you put in in the context of the location it is a ludicrous proposal
Anyone unfamiliar with conditions in that area should take a drive to the breakwater and park above the old coastguard stores
On the surface it holds the biggest swells between here & Langness, the reasons being that there is a large reef which rises up in line with the lighthouse and pushes up the sea being driven toward it by the prevailing wind. These conditions are amplified when the tide ebbs and runs into the oncoming swell
There is a tidal range of up to 10 meters and swells there frequently make 7 metres, The tidal flow exceeds 6 knots on a spring
Oil & gas rig technology could be used to place a structure in this area with no problems, trying to berth a ship alongside it in adverse conditions would be a prospect only the skipper of the Costa Concordia would contemplate.
There is also the scenario of berthing alongside it in calm conditions the morning and discharging the passengers then having to leave the berth when the wind gets up and having the passengers re-embark by ships boat back in the bay
All of must have seen footage of rig support vessels trying to supply oil rigs in open water, a highly dangerous task.
My background is rooted in the Manx tourist industry, my great grandparents came here and bought a hotel on the prom over 100 years ago, my grandparents, parents and parents in-law all had hotels. My own restaurants derived around 30% of their turnover from visitors
I have a lot of faith in the Island as a tourist destination, but this scheme, in this location is ill advised and will make us a laughing stock
When you say "this location is ill advised", what other location have you in mind?
I don't have another location in mind, I'm just pointing out the unsuitability of the proposed one
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Orkney got £4 million into the local economy from cruise passengers
With a deepwater ship berth costing in the hundreds of millions I cannot see any way of repaying the cost before the thing wears out
To give you an example of a cheaper tourism investment look at Majorca. They had funds available and were considering building yet another marina, instead they invested in making the islands roads cycle friendly by widening some of the main routes and putting a 1.5 meter wide cycleway on one side
The result was a massive uptake in cycle holidays in the spring & autumn when the weather was cool enough
I was there last April and they had 25,000 cyclists a week going through the place, using hotels, cafes, bike hire shops, the airlines & ferries and spending considerably more than a tea & scone day tripper
A huge and ongoing return for a modest investment
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-30794701
The estimated economic benefit to Orkney was £7m in 2016, the total cost of their berth was £29m (original in 2002 and then extension in 2013)
The deep water berth will not cost "hundreds of millions" and its expected lifespan is 100 years.
The £50m includes an estimate for shore-side infrastructure modifications, and is only an estimate based on feasibility study designs, not the final design.
As stated, the business case detailing ownership/funding/revenues has to stack up, and this is the next step.
If the project gets the go-ahead based on a sound business case, and for whatever reason the assumptions in the business case do not materialise over the longer term, there is still the option to sell the asset, as clearly it is moveable and it has 100 year design life. This also mitigates the financial risk.
Can we just stand back for a second an take in what is being proposed here
A 170 meter linkspan to a floating pontoon anchored on the outside of the current breakwater, this structure will then have ships from 20,000 to 60,000 tons berthed alongside
If you consider the structure in isolation it may make sense, but when you put in in the context of the location it is a ludicrous proposal
Anyone unfamiliar with conditions in that area should take a drive to the breakwater and park above the old coastguard stores
On the surface it holds the biggest swells between here & Langness, the reasons being that there is a large reef which rises up in line with the lighthouse and pushes up the sea being driven toward it by the prevailing wind. These conditions are amplified when the tide ebbs and runs into the oncoming swell
There is a tidal range of up to 10 meters and swells there frequently make 7 metres, The tidal flow exceeds 6 knots on a spring
Oil & gas rig technology could be used to place a structure in this area with no problems, trying to berth a ship alongside it in adverse conditions would be a prospect only the skipper of the Costa Concordia would contemplate.
There is also the scenario of berthing alongside it in calm conditions the morning and discharging the passengers then having to leave the berth when the wind gets up and having the passengers re-embark by ships boat back in the bay
All of must have seen footage of rig support vessels trying to supply oil rigs in open water, a highly dangerous task.
My background is rooted in the Manx tourist industry, my great grandparents came here and bought a hotel on the prom over 100 years ago, my grandparents, parents and parents in-law all had hotels. My own restaurants derived around 30% of their turnover from visitors
I have a lot of faith in the Island as a tourist destination, but this scheme, in this location is ill advised and will make us a laughing stock
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What about Conister rock?
ETA Cheekyboy, it's too cold here for cycle lanes and there are too many cars on the road. I have stopped road walking because the car fumes were too much for me and...as an ex-smoker I don't need any more poison in my lungs (lol, did you know I stopped smoking?)
"Too cold for cycle lanes?" I'm failing to understand your point
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I thought at first, who the heck thought of this completely idiotic idea, until I did some digging. Orkney is just a small example. Look at Madeira. Before you say warm and sunny, their cruise season is their winter. However, now spreading into their summer. Like most islands, if you are there for a day, you can either pay a fortune for a tour, or walk about town and have a few pints and lunch. Over the past 20 years, Madeira has grown from being a very minor tourist island to being quite a major one. The Azores are just starting on this transformation. Watch this space. Liverpool, Belfast and Dublin are all jumping on the cruise game. We would be completely. Stupid not to at least look at it!
Orkney got £4 million into the local economy from cruise passengers
With a deepwater ship berth costing in the hundreds of millions I cannot see any way of repaying the cost before the thing wears out
To give you an example of a cheaper tourism investment look at Majorca. They had funds available and were considering building yet another marina, instead they invested in making the islands roads cycle friendly by widening some of the main routes and putting a 1.5 meter wide cycleway on one side
The result was a massive uptake in cycle holidays in the spring & autumn when the weather was cool enough
I was there last April and they had 25,000 cyclists a week going through the place, using hotels, cafes, bike hire shops, the airlines & ferries and spending considerably more than a tea & scone day tripper
A huge and ongoing return for a modest investment
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-30794701
Put a presentation together and invite Tynwald members get an expert in from Majorca and they'll lap it up.
apart from cyclists never spend money hence why the cycle week stopped
Easy Jet fare150.00 Euro
Hotel rate 60.00 Euro per night
Bike hire 19.00 Euro per day
Food, lunch 12 euro, Dinner 22 Euro per day
T shirts, bike clothing etc another 50 Euro
It is not 1965 any more
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Very few of us are qualified to comment on the technical aspects of the proposal. I do however agree that on the face of it, a floating pontoon on the seaward side of the breakwater seems a bit daft, it's called a breakwater for a reason, so the proposal calling it 'Alexander Pier' would appear to be an attempt to mislead or dupe people that it is safe!
There were very few of us qualified to comment on the technical aspects of the first linkspan, this was effectively a steel bridge with a float on the end. It was installed in 1977 before the breakwater extension and many of us who knew the harbour questioned how it would stand up to the swells produced by an easterly gale
Reassurances were given that it had been designed by engineers to cope with swell of up to 1.5 meters. We pointed out that swells of 5 meters were not uncommon. We were told not to worry.
The linkspan opened in August facilitating our first ro-ro vessel operated by Manxline
I was living above the harbour and in September of that year with the first of the easterlies blowing hard I woke to the massive sound of tearing and crashing metal.
Dawn broke to reveal the linkspan wrenched from its hinges and lay half submerged across the middle of the harbour
When the seacat was first brought here on a promotional visit, many of us locals went on it for a 1 hr jolly. At the end of the trip some bloke in a suit with a flipchart gave us a talk extolling the virtues of the fastcraft. We were quite impressed, the first question from the audience was " what are you going to replace it with in the winter ?"
Suity bloke then tell the audience that they have looked at the weather patterns for the Irish sea and that there will be only one or two days a year when this boat can't operate
Cue hoots of derision from the crowd and a very puzzled and offended suity bloke packs up his chart and buggers off
Some 18 months later said boat is charging toward the bar lightship in a blow when it ploughs into a wall of water and wrenches the bow visor off it's mountings. Boat limps back to Liverpool to be replaced with the Lady of Man, a small sideloader built to withstand the Irish Sea
You don't always need to be an expert to see when something isn't going to work, local knowledge is worth a lot
Ignoring all that for a moment, the whole point of this absurd project is an exercise in parting the Manx government from it's money. The practicalities will of building it and the non-existent business case will be glossed over until the various parties involved have been paid millions in consulting fees.
They will then conclude that it's a non-starter and bugger off to spend the money on a new car and a house extension
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I thought at first, who the heck thought of this completely idiotic idea, until I did some digging. Orkney is just a small example. Look at Madeira. Before you say warm and sunny, their cruise season is their winter. However, now spreading into their summer. Like most islands, if you are there for a day, you can either pay a fortune for a tour, or walk about town and have a few pints and lunch. Over the past 20 years, Madeira has grown from being a very minor tourist island to being quite a major one. The Azores are just starting on this transformation. Watch this space. Liverpool, Belfast and Dublin are all jumping on the cruise game. We would be completely. Stupid not to at least look at it!
Orkney got £4 million into the local economy from cruise passengers
With a deepwater ship berth costing in the hundreds of millions I cannot see any way of repaying the cost before the thing wears out
To give you an example of a cheaper tourism investment look at Majorca. They had funds available and were considering building yet another marina, instead they invested in making the islands roads cycle friendly by widening some of the main routes and putting a 1.5 meter wide cycleway on one side
The result was a massive uptake in cycle holidays in the spring & autumn when the weather was cool enough
I was there last April and they had 25,000 cyclists a week going through the place, using hotels, cafes, bike hire shops, the airlines & ferries and spending considerably more than a tea & scone day tripper
A huge and ongoing return for a modest investment
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-30794701
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The Isle of Man saw 5,400 visitors on 17 cruise ships last year, generating £3 a head in harbour dues. Ports director Ann Reynolds said: ‘It’s an interesting concept but the business case has to stack up.’
Read more at: http://www.iomtoday.co.im/news/isle-of-man-news/floating-idea-of-cruise-ship-berth-in-isle-of-man-1-8342417
I nearly choked on my cornflakes when I read this, Jesus, the concept must be flawed for Reynolds to say the business case has to add up, this is the woman who went for the business case at the airport where we now should be drowning in 1.75 million passengers ! heading for 2.5 !
So the harbour dues from the cruise liner industry generated a massive £16, 200 last year. That should cover the cost of one harbour policeman for 6 months
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To understand what is really going on here, cast your minds back to the heady days of fifteen or so years ago when we were told that the lights would go out unless we go a new power station
We got a new power station to go with the three we already had plus an undersea cable and some nonsense generation from the oversized incinerator ( which was also crucial to our needs)
One result was an electricity supply some five times greater than the Island was likely to need
Another result was that dozens of contractors, consultants, assorted crooks politicians & hangers-on got a very nice earner out of the fiasco. Which we all pay for every month through our water & electric bills
The deepwater cruise terminal project is simply another money spinner for this generation's aformentioned contractors, crooks etc.
Coachloads of ship-borne pensioners spending £5 on tea & a bun are not going to payback the investment needed for this project, which is why no private interests will put any money up without bucketloads of government cash thrown in
The dwindling reserves are burning a hole in the pocket of the new administration, like a ten year old rushing down the shops with his birthday money
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I was 13 that year, a group of us were playing football in the square of garages behind Windsor road; where Windsor Court now stands. We noticed a great, black plume of smoke and rushed down Crellins Hill to the 'Rendezvous' and saw the blaze, at this time about half-way up one side of the building. A couple of us ran the whole way over to the site to watch. By the time we got there the building was completely ablaze and there were hundreds of people standing around, awestruck at what was unfolding. We stood at the bottom of the foot-bridge which straddled the road. One of my most abiding memories was of a guy wandering around calling out for (i can only presume) family members. His jacket was smoking and had shrunk about his torso, his hair burnt away and in a state of complete shock. All around people were screaming and crying, some sat silent, their heads in their hands. Others wandered aimlessly, the whites of their eyes made starker because of their blackened-faces; adults and children alike.
I can only suppose the fire and ambulance crews did their very best, the sight of one fireman, with tears streaming down his also blackened face, brought home the seriousness of what was happening. They were just over-whelmed, completely. Tragic and very sad, harking back as i write this.
A picture appeared on the front of (i think) the Daily Mirror which showed a figure standing on one of the staircases, apparently welded or melted in an upright position, holding on to the bannister-rail. Included in the report accompanying the photo's, a description was given of three boys seen running away from the scene. The implication was that these boys had something to do with the fire and were wanted by the local police. The description of one of these boys was ''blonde, with a 'German-Helmet' type haircut'', a fashionable style at the time, rather like a 'mullet'.
Two nights later, myself and a friend were walking down Mount Havelock (he with much the same type of haircut and us both fitting the descriptions given) when two Mini's screeched to a halt beside us, the doors flung open and suddenly we were surrounded by CID men, one of whom, without warning or explanation, slapped me hard around the face and head a couple of times, grabbed me by the hair and bundled me into the back of one car, my mate thrown into the back of the other. We were then driven, at speed, the short distance into Hill Street, and came to a halt outside what is now 'Bar George'. Once again, i was grabbed by the hair and dragged out of the car and in through the first set of doors, all the while being shouted-at and generally roughed-up.
Saint Georges hall was were some of the bodies were taken because of the overload at Nobles and down each side of that small hall were sheets, laid out on the floor on top of which lay the only partly covered bodies of the victims. The was a pervading smell of disinfectant, which poorly masked what i can only describe as the smell of, well, cooked meat. By this time of course, i was in shock myself, made worse by the detective, still dragging me this way and that by the scruff of my neck, shouting in my face, '' You did this, didn't you...?''. The same treatment being meted-out to my mate. At the end of that hall there used to be a small stage area and on it was a table covered with paper-work. We were man-handled into a seat and questions/accusations fired at us regarding the fire. The violence continued also, until one copper told the other to stop. We were arrested, photographed and finger-printed too.
At this point, my memory fails me as i was by this time in tears/extreme shock and wanted my parents. The rest is just a blur; i don't remember much of what happened after this, not getting home or how. The cops had us there for what was probably a couple of hours then took us home. I remember being put in our backroom whilst the cop explained to my parents, in another room, what had taken place.
After telling my parents what had happened and what had been done to us, my mother and father went into a rage and we took off for the police station, just off Athol Street, as it was then. Frank Weedon was, if i remember correctly, the Chief Constable and knew my mother, (possibly because they were both scousers!) who demanded his presence. Once again, the exact details are a bit of a blur but i remember a lot of shouting and my father saying something like, 'I know when my son is lying and it's not now', my mother in tears (of outrage more than anything, i suspect).
A few days later, when the boy's who were actually responsible for setting the initial, small-fire in an adjoining kiosk, which caused the fatal conflagration, were caught, the Chief Constable called at our house with a large brown envelope containing the photographs and fingerprints taken from me. My mother invited him in and made him tear up the prints in front of us and throw them in the fire.
It was an horrendous episode, and what happened to me is nowt compared to the plight of others. The memory of the whole affair shudders me to this day.
If any memorial is to be made it should be on the site of the fire itself, not stuck away in the place designated.
As far as the Oroglas goes, the manufacturers of this product had designed a sprinkler system to be installed with their product in the event of fire but this advice was completely ignored due to cost and blind ignorance. I can remember seeing on the night, sheets of it shrinking out of the frame and falling into the heart of the fire.
Strangely-enough, there exists on youtube, a video of our currently-suspended Attorney-General, being interviewed by ITN, giving his eye-witness account. My friend and i stand directly behind him.
Years later i befriended the son of one of the architects who told me his father had never gotten over feeling responsible for what happened.
There are others who effectively got away scott-free with what now may be classed as corporate-manslaughter.
A tragedy that should never've happened.
Fuck me Quilp, I remember the atmosphere at the time and didn't realise you had been hauled in and subjected to such an ordeal, old fashioned police work for you eh ?
Some time after the fire, the manager of the Golden Egg Restaurant was murdered. We were camping up at the Braid that night and the following morning two of us hitched into town and were picked up by one of the CID Minis
Our ordeal was confined to the three mile journey and consisted of a Q&A session as to our background and whereabouts the previous night, after which we were let go
Interestingly, someone who was involved in the Quilp incident has been veiwing this forum
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I would greatly appreciate being pointed in the direction of the "prominent people still keeping their heads below the pavement" as I still have questions I require answers to.
The architect was J Phillips Lomas, I don't remember him being held responsible despite him specifying "Oroglas" for the cladding and not designing adequate fire escape routes
The building was owned by Douglas Corporation but was leased to Trust House Forte. Some of the fire doors were padlocked by their staff but the manager, Mr Bertorelli, perished in the blaze
Most of the flack was taken by the chief fire officer who signed the building off as being safe. He got sacked
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Why did it take 40 years to do this ?
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Posted this on the other film industry thread
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Douglas Council to investigate 'corruption' allegations
in Local News
Posted
Which local media ?