Public Service Pensions - Does This Affect You?

[Joe Public]

Well, I've spoken to several doctors who've said if the original proposal's went through, they would have to move across or have five years wiped off their pension.

 

This would also mean the Island would simply be unable to recruit any but the very worst doctors.

 

 

No change there then

[Twitch]

Well, I've spoken to several doctors who've said if the original proposal's went through, they would have to move across or have five years wiped off their pension.

 

This would also mean the Island would simply be unable to recruit any but the very worst doctors.

 

 

No change there then

 

I feel that's a bit harsh. Evidence?

[Tugger]

Fucking easy. Pay doctors more to make up for the worse pension, and screw over the rest of the civil service. They will milk us and milk us and milk us for doing half the work they would have to in the private sector.

[WilDDog]

It's starting to sound like someones got a large chip on their shoulder for some reason or other.

[vikingdoom]

i think the MHKs who voted for this pension shake up are going to regret their decision. all of the people affected are now considering their future on the island. these MHKs have squandered the pension fund on stupid capital projects and now expect the government workers to pay for their stupidity. we have a hospital that cost the tax payer double the origional estimate, a sewrage system that will never work, and the MEA is a bottomless pit that will haunt us into the next decade. the new prison will also be well over budget but it does'nt matter the tax payer will foot the bill. whats next? the airport extension lets see who gets the contract for that gravy train. ( sorry capital project ). i think its about time the uk government took control of this rock and stopped these people messing with the future of hard working people. cutting of the pension link with the uk is going to kill the health service on this island. no health care proffessional will come here to work when the island is being run by the cast of sesame street.

[Higgy]

i think the MHKs who voted for this pension shake up are going to regret their decision. all of the people affected are now considering their future on the island. these MHKs have squandered the pension fund on stupid capital projects and now expect the government workers to pay for their stupidity. we have a hospital that cost the tax payer double the origional estimate, a sewrage system that will never work, and the MEA is a bottomless pit that will haunt us into the next decade. the new prison will also be well over budget but it does'nt matter the tax payer will foot the bill. whats next? the airport extension lets see who gets the contract for that gravy train. ( sorry capital project ). i think its about time the uk government took control of this rock and stopped these people messing with the future of hard working people. cutting of the pension link with the uk is going to kill the health service on this island. no health care proffessional will come here to work when the island is being run by the cast of sesame street.

 

 

 

Good point

[Twitch]

Having worked in both public and private sector in the past, there's as much dead wood in the private sector sitting on their useless, incompetent arses waiting for their final salary pensions as there is in the civil service. Usually with added perks and annual bonuses though.

[Albert Tatlock]

i think the MHKs who voted for this pension shake up are going to regret their decision. all of the people affected are now considering their future on the island. these MHKs have squandered the pension fund on stupid capital projects and now expect the government workers to pay for their stupidity. we have a hospital that cost the tax payer double the origional estimate, a sewrage system that will never work, and the MEA is a bottomless pit that will haunt us into the next decade. the new prison will also be well over budget but it does'nt matter the tax payer will foot the bill. whats next? the airport extension lets see who gets the contract for that gravy train. ( sorry capital project ). i think its about time the uk government took control of this rock and stopped these people messing with the future of hard working people. cutting of the pension link with the uk is going to kill the health service on this island. no health care proffessional will come here to work when the island is being run by the cast of sesame street.

 

 

 

Good point

Balfour Beatty are doing the airport extension.

[manshimajin]

Having worked in both public and private sector in the past, there's as much dead wood in the private sector sitting on their useless, incompetent arses waiting for their final salary pensions as there is in the civil service. Usually with added perks and annual bonuses though.

But isn't the real point here that the present arrangements are unaffordable - quite probably because of the mess up the pollies have made of things - but unaffordable none the less. So what do forum members suggest should be done? Let things go on further into the black hole, increase taxes to pay for the increased costs, cut down the future projected pension costs, review the size of the PS, sell off the airport, docks, Ramsay Pier etc to get a bit of money?

 

Complaining is free but fixing requires some sort of actions that have unfortunately reached a stage at which the medicine is pretty harsh. Voters kept on electing the MHKs so we have only ourselves to blame. Even if they are all given the chop at the next election the problem still must be solved one way or another.

 

If nothing is done the only option is to increase taxes so that all taxpayers will contribute more to the PS pension scheme to bail it out. Is that what we want? What are the PS Unions suggesting???

[Hermes]

There is a very imminent danger that the hospital is going to lose its workforce of junior doctors unless it passes an upcoming inspection by the authority that allocates them from the pool in the UK. The pension scheme proposal is putting this inspection in grave jeopardy as it makes becoming a doctor in the Isle of Man a 'second rate option' compared to employment in the UK, and is very likely to be highlighted to the inspectors, along with other problems that currently exist.

 

The results of a failed inspection will be as follows:

1. The hospital's accreditation as a training location for junior doctors will be withdrawn.

2. The junior doctors (responsible for the basic day to day medical care of ward patients and the smooth running of the hospital) will have no reason to continue their employment (it will not count towards accreditation for further training), and will leave.

3. The hospital will be unable to obtain any more junior doctors in the next intake.

4. Collapse in delivery of healthcare services at the hospital.

 

Nobles relies on recruitment from the UK, and a large proportion of nurses, radiographers, physiotherapists and doctors etc that come to work there only do so for a period of less than 5 years (often leaving because of a lack of opportunities offered them by our Health Service). Why would anyone wish to come and work here when the traditional NHS pension scheme that they can expect in the UK has been abandoned, making it a net non-incentive to relocate and/or stay here. That scheme is supposed to balance up the relatively poor pay the majority of health professionals get for the high level of diligence and effort they put in.

 

What is wrong with our government at the moment?

[Joe Public]

If nothing is done the only option is to increase taxes so that all taxpayers will contribute more to the PS pension scheme to bail it out. Is that what we want? What are the PS Unions suggesting???

 

The schemes on the Isle of Man have always reflected the ones in the UK. This enables the migration of essential workforces and their pensions (in both directions).

The UK have recently identified that the superannuation scheme is unaffordable and so have altered it for all new entrants.

 

This island is/was/should be (I'm not sure anymore) richer than the adjacent one, and so therefore could once again mirror what happens across.

 

I think one of the arguments against this in the Hyman's report was the well known phenomena of 'pension envy'.

 

Legally, I think the government is on dodgy ground in trying to alter terms and conditions of staff that may have been paying into their pension scheme for thirty years or more.

[Twitch]

Perhaps close existing schemes to new members of Civil Service would be a start & streamline the (far too) many schemes out there; review structure of civil service to ensure it's the optimum size to do what needs doing efficiently and effectively; special arrangements for medical staff to ensure their pension stays as key selling point?

 

Dunno, it's a tricky situation to be honest but it needs sorting as we're all going to be paying for this.

[Joe Public]

Dunno, it's a tricky situation to be honest but it needs sorting as we're all going to be paying for this.

 

'tis very true. Let's hope they don't try and sort it with another quango.

[WTF]

i think the MHKs who voted for this pension shake up are going to regret their decision. all of the people affected are now considering their future on the island. these MHKs have squandered the pension fund on stupid capital projects and now expect the government workers to pay for their stupidity. we have a hospital that cost the tax payer double the origional estimate, a sewrage system that will never work, and the MEA is a bottomless pit that will haunt us into the next decade. the new prison will also be well over budget but it does'nt matter the tax payer will foot the bill. whats next? the airport extension lets see who gets the contract for that gravy train. ( sorry capital project ). i think its about time the uk government took control of this rock and stopped these people messing with the future of hard working people. cutting of the pension link with the uk is going to kill the health service on this island. no health care proffessional will come here to work when the island is being run by the cast of sesame street.

 

 

i think that those in now will keep what they have, and any new people entering will get different terms, just like the police force did when they lost the housing allowance. those that were in kept it, the newbies didn't get it. we are now ( should have been done years ago ) just taking into account the fact that more people are living longer and many of the medical procedures and costs too are far more expensive than they used to be on a keeping granny going till she's ninety level. not only does she get her pension for 15 years longer than expected, the health service pay through the nose to keep her there claiming it with pills potions and operations ( though nobles do a fair job of 'losing' folk on the table ) but its all money out the publics taxes. the beauty of private pensions for the government is that a percentage will vanish due to companies going bust due to greed, fraud or incompetence ( a bit like the lehmanns bank ), and then it is tough on the investors. IF the government had to do all the pensions they couldn't really go bust, just charge more taxes. when i started work the i.t.i.p payments were supposed to cover medical and pensions and dentists. nowadays its all about sort your own out, first thing a dentist wants to know is if you have insurance cover, a bit like hospitals in the states. i seem to recall when the new hospital was getting built that some of its funding came from the pensions fund being raped because it was deemed to have a huge excess that could be removed without detriment?? ( bollox eh?? ) and now the very item that the excess was used for is keeping the coffin dodgers going to claim more from the fund. ironic if ever there was.

[Joe Public]

just taking into account the fact that more people are living longer and many of the medical procedures and costs too are far more expensive than they used to be on a keeping granny going till she's ninety level. not only does she get her pension for 15 years longer than expected, the health service pay through the nose to keep her there claiming it with pills potions and operations

 

See? If smoking was compulsory we'd be fine.

 

More taxes, no old people leeching the system and everyone just that little bit more chilled out.