Israeli interference in UK Governement

[rmanx]

Wow. I'm going to have to dig out some old threads where this has already been pointlessly discussed at length with lots of facts being cited.

 

Your homework is late...

[llap]

I have a life. I'll do it tomorrow. Or you could familiarise yourself with the search utility yourself.

[rmanx]

I have a life. I'll do it tomorrow. Or you could familiarise yourself with the search utility yourself.

 

Still late.

 

Your claim, your responsibility to back it up.

 

Or you could just admit you were wrong.

[Skeletor]

A poster named Thomas Jefferson (haven't seen him post anything recently?) seems to have already debunked much of what has been posted in this thread, so I will quote him and mark particularly relevant points in red font:

Jews are the indigenous population, Gladys, and they have every right, as any nation does, to set their own immigration policies and decide other descendants of the indigenous population, violently expelled from the land, can return to it. A majority of Israel is of Sephardic and Mizrahi origin. That means they're not, as some brain-dead morons on here would have you believe, European. They are Middle Eastern. Arabs are indigenous to Arabia.

 

Orthodox Jews still use that name format, Gladys, in addition to using the now standard first name and surname format. On religious documents, wedding certificates, etc, they still use that.

It was around the late middle ages when people began to take on surnames. It wasn't specifically targeted at Jews. That's why you find many Jews and non-Jews sharing the same surname. One notable example would be the name Frank -- the etymology is fairly obvious, but then you have Hans Frank (the butcher of Poland) and Anne Frank. It's the same with surnames with Gold in them. These surnames depended entirely on the trade or location of your ancestors at that point in time.

There is already a Jewish homeland. It has always been their homeland. The only thing missing was Jewish self-determination in that homeland. For two thousand years they had no self-determination and were subject to violent and oppressive invaders, like the Romans, then the Byzantines, and then the Islamics -- the latter being the very Arabs who are now being paraded by ignorant people as the "indigenous" inhabitants. It's nonsense. Jews are the indigenous inhabitants and they have every right as a sovereign nation to offer a right of return to other Jews.

 

 

 

I am not a sick, nor twisted racist. I have many friends who are Jewish. I have been many times to Israel, worked 12 months on a Kibbutz, in my youth, in the Negev. I have a right to express an opinion. Your mental health problems on Anti Semitism add nothing to this post. The basic tenets of Zionism, along with Biblical nonsense do not legitimise the theft, by a Cult, of an entire land and the expulsion of it's people. Read some real history you fucking moron.

Your entire post is filled with antisemitic venom.

Zionism is the belief that Jews should have national self-determination in the land of Israel. Zionism is an essential part of Judaism, which you refer to as "a cult" (no, that's not antisemitic at all, is it?). The Jews did not steal an "entire land" (disinformation). For starters, it is their land, their homeland, where they have lived for 4,000 years, and the only reason Jews ended up in other countries is because they were violently expelled and subjected to genocide by the Romans. It was the Romans, trying to erase the Jewish connection with the land in the 2nd Century CE, who renamed it "Palaestina" and renamed their capital city, Jerusalem, to "Aelia Capitolina". However, there has been a continuous Jewish presence in the area, and yes, at various times in history they were a minority, but I fail to see how that has any relevance. Their minority status was due to them being forced out and because of repeated attempts to ethnically cleanse them from the area. The Arabs were just another group of conquerors who stole Jewish land. The Israelis have every right to build new settlements in their own land. You talk as if they just arbitrarily steal land, but they're building on land which was not in use and was either legally purchased from Arab landowners or on land acquisitioned during wars which Israel did not start. How did the Arabs come to own the land in the first place? By violently conquering the area and subjugating the Jews as "dhimmis". It's necessary for Israel to have a buffer zone, because if you remove the West Bank from the map then their country becomes very thin and open to invasion.

 

 

20% of Israelis are Arabs and at least 50% of the Jews there are Sephardic or Mizrahi Jews from the Middle East. That's a a majority of Israel and specifically its Jewish population who were never even in Europe to begin with. And even those who were in Europe were only there because they had been violently expelled from their homeland in 150 CE by the Romans, although there was always a Jewish presence and migrations back there. The Crusaders murdered most of the Jews in Jerusalem, which was a bit of a setback, but they still kept returning, especially after the 1492 expulsion from Spain. It's their homeland and they have every right to live there.

The bottom line is this: in 1948, a majority of the Jews were Sephardic and Mizrahi, which means they were always Middle Eastern and not Ashkenazi immigrants from Europe (who were, a thousand years earlier, an offshoot of Sephardim anyway). Even today, if you look at the Israeli demographics, the majority of Jews are Sephardic and Mizrahi and they continue to have significantly higher birth rates than Ashkenazim. So why should the Jews, who are majority middle eastern, not be allowed to open their doors to their cousins in Europe or North America? Why this selective eugenics demand against this and only this people, if not blatant racism against Jews? I never heard of any other country or its people being told they're not allowed to open their doors to immigrants. They have every right to determine their own immigration policy. This narrative of Jews being some western colonists to the region is pure hogwash. Again, the majority of Jews in Israel are middle eastern, not descended from European Jews (who were ultimately middle eastern themselves anyway).

There are other posts, you can look them up yourself, which go into detail about how there were more middle eastern Jews forcibly thrown out of Arab lands and forced to migrate to Israel in 1948 than there were Arabs who left the area of Israel (and they weren't forced out -- they left because there was expectation of the neighboring Arab countries invading and wiping out the Jews in the area, which they did try to do but Israel kicked their butts despite being completely outnumbered).

[rmanx]

Sigh....

 

Quoting a crackpot on MF does not a case make.

 

How about you try some credible sources rather the ongoing MF joke sock puppet account?

[Skeletor]

A "crackpot" who happens to make more sense than you, who has done proper research, and actually cites real statistics which can be backed up by demographic reports. Maybe you'd like to address the points being made in the quotes (especially the points in red about Sephardim and Mizrahi demographics) instead of resorting to one-liner ad homimem attacks?

[rmanx]

So we are switching from anti-Semitism to anti-Zionism...make up your mind.

 

Rather than copying someone else's homework how about you do your own and provide some references to back them up.

[Skeletor]

I want you to address this point:

 

20% of Israelis are Arabs and at least 50% of the Jews there are Sephardic or Mizrahi Jews from the Middle East. That's a a majority of Israel and specifically its Jewish population who were never even in Europe to begin with.

And explain why Israelis, whose Jewish and general population was in 1948 and still is in 2016 a majority middle eastern, shouldn't be allowed, or should be criticised by people like you, for having an open door immigration policy for Jews around the world.

 

Let's face facts. You need to stop repeating the LIE that Israel is a western colony or that it's Jewish citizens stole the land from some fictional indigenous people. They ARE its indigenous people.

[the stinking enigma]

jefferson was a nutcase. I think they locked him up in the end

[rmanx]

I want you to address this point:

 

20% of Israelis are Arabs and at least 50% of the Jews there are Sephardic or Mizrahi Jews from the Middle East. That's a a majority of Israel and specifically its Jewish population who were never even in Europe to begin with.

And explain why Israelis, whose Jewish and general population was in 1948 and still is in 2016 a majority middle eastern, shouldn't be allowed, or should be criticised by people like you, for having an open door immigration policy for Jews around the world.

 

Let's face facts. You need to stop repeating the LIE that Israel is a western colony or that it's Jewish citizens stole the land from some fictional indigenous people. They ARE its indigenous people.

 

Source?

[llap]

I wouldn't waste my time trying to inform this person. You could tell him to Google "Israel CIA world Fact Book demographics" and he'd still expect you to spoon feed it to you and say you've got no proof if you don't do that for him and even then you'll have to waste your time providing him either definitions of Sephardic and Mizrahi because he's too lazy to consult the Encyclopedia Judaica. Classic argument from ignorance type poster.

[rmanx]

Classic argument from ignorance type poster.

 

Says the person who has failed to post his source for his claims...

[rmanx]

And if you are going to quote a source...at least try one that isn't widely regarded as unreliable at best and at worst utterly inaccurate.

 

"For example, Albania was until recently, described in the Factbook as 70% Muslim, 20% Eastern Orthodox, and 10% Roman Catholic, which was based on a survey conducted in 1939, before World War II;"

 

And closer to the topic at hand:

 

"In June 2009, National Public Radio (NPR), relying on information obtained from the CIA World Factbook, put the number of Israeli Jews living in settlements in the West Bank and Israeli-annexed East Jerusalem at 250,000. However, a better estimate, based on State Department and Israeli sources put the figure at about 500,000. NPR then issued a correction. Chuck Holmes, foreign editor for NPR Digital, said, "I'm surprised and displeased, and it makes me wonder what other information is out-of-date or incorrect in the CIA World Factbook."^[68]"

[llap]

So where are their sources?

[TheTeapot]

The CIAs sources are google and Facebook these days aren't they?