P.K.

Frankly after the first strike it was bloody stupid to continue until the situation had been made clear! Harsh but fair... It's not exactly "news" either: John Simpson: journalists 'taking a hammering' https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/apr/09/broadcasting.bbc So the reality is it always happens and no doubt will continue to do so...

You can't dismiss something that has happened. But you can explain it. The vehicles were deliberately targetted because the IDF acted on faulty intelligence. That should be obvious even to the likes of @HeliX and @TheTeapot The comms are a mess. The reason they are a mess is simple. The IDF say they have proof that aid agencies are infiltrated by Hamas and/or their supporters i.e. pretty much any Palestinian you care to mention. Therefore not only will the IDF not give them any direct access to their communication systems, which would be sheer folly, but everything that does come through "other means" as It's called will have to be verified before they will act upon it. Obviously this not only adds a delay but it also increases the chances of a misunderstanding. In other words things get lost in translation. Also military comms VP is structured in such a way that it avoids any room for confusion and consequently takes a lot of training and practice. So It's not something civilians will have. After all, how much VP training does a TT Marshall get? So it is, unfortunately, pretty much inevitable over time...

Hamas deliberately put civilians in harms way. The IDF drop leaflets telling them to evacuate the target area and despite being perfectly mobile they still stay put. Explain why that is...? The terrible press this episode is receiving tells me It's a "fog of war" fuckup. To expect none to happen is naive in the extreme. But then that's you all over... Incidentally I hate cats...

Sure, as Netanyahu has admitted, it's a fuckup. I mean, if it was deliberate what could Israel possibly gain from it? All Israel will get for it is grief that they don't need. You're so blinded by your prejudices you just don't think these things through, do you...?

@Sheldon I don't tell lies. I have no need to. From your link: "Footage shows burned buildings at al-Shifa hospital in Gaza City, two weeks after it came under siege by Israeli troops. "The Hamas-run health ministry and witnesses who spoke to the BBC said the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) have pulled out of the territory's biggest hospital. "The raid happened after Israel said it had intelligence indicating Hamas was using the hospital as a base to launch attacks. "Hamas has denied using medical sites to carry out military operations." Is that the same hospital where footage showed hostages being taken through? Just watched the Beeb reporting some aid workers have been killed in a strike on a convoy. Netanyahu has admitted it was in error. The problem is that wars are fought by people and people fuck up. Apparently comms are a mess.

The only rocket that hit a hospital that I'm aware of was fired by Islamic Jihad.

I suppose it does say something about my sense of humour... In this case the civilian population are being used as "human shields". Of course, the reason this is done by Hamas is simply because they hope it might give the IDF pause. Because they know that all the IDF actions will be played out and judged in the UN and the court of western public opinion and so do the Knesset. As Hamas are totally amoral they just view it as a useful tactic to use despite any civilian casualties that their actions may cause. Because they simply view civilians as expendable. Therefore I'm not sure that “the incidental and involuntary harm caused to the civilian population during a military attack must not be excessive in relation to the direct military advantage gained” is relevant in a conflict against a terrorist insurgency who by their very nature are civilians! Also there are no formal declarations of war by the states involved, no territory to be gained or lost, no conventional military advantage to be gained and only one party can possibly be sanctioned. It seems subjective as well.

@TheTeapot I trust that first sentence wasn't directed at me? After all, I don't feel old at all... At least you're finally starting to grasp the basics that war is a very nasty, dirty, miserable business. We should never allow ourselves to go to war. Unfortunately if attacked you have no other choice but to get out there and kill the enemy.

Sticks and stones etc... Well apologist, I take it you do realise that your reactions to all of this are exactly what the Mad Mullahs in Tehran want? Forgetting all about their appallingly brutal assault on the 7th October and concentrating on bitching and moaning about the IDF carrying out their orders to wipe out a bunch of terrorist vermin. Who don't care at all about their fellow Palestinians except to be able to hide behind them. If you had your way the IDF would be brought up short which Hamas would claim as a victory. They would then regroup and reform all the while firing bigger and more accurate rockets into Israeli civilian areas. Then when they're ready rinse and repeat. Is another brutal assault on Israeli civilians really what you want? Because that's what you're asking for... Of course the bit folks forget is where Hamas, Islamic Jihad etc all give up their weapons and surrender. That would immediately stop the fighting. So why aren't you railing at them...?

What thing?

So is a swastika tattoo arrestable? Frankly I think a shouty yank laying down the law in a foreign country should be highly arrestable...!

How dreadfully naive...

I don't like getting up early!

@TheTeapot Religious fundamentalists of the worst kind ARE in power in Tehran and from there they feed Palestinians weapons and hatred. So instead of dripping and moaning about how terrible it all is, and it really is terrible, how would you solve this seemingly intractable problem...? Incidentally it was really really stupid to assault Israel on the 9th October. Because Netanyahu is a very hard right leader. After all his brother was killed by terrorist vermin freeing Israeli hostages at Entebbe. So his response was bound to be exceptionally harsh shall we say. Tehran must be delighted. Especially by the way people like you respond to what they've done...

@wrighty @TheTeapot @John Wright @HeliX So where else do you worthies think the terrorist vermin like Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad etc etc get their recruits from...? A stall in an Aldi car park or something...? We're all (hopefully) aware of the realities of the situation and it's not helpful to ignore the facts of the matter. Of course the situation is dreadful. Pretending it's not what it is won't lead to a solution in a gazillion years...

Voluntary donations to Israel are estimated at over $2bn with half coming from the US diaspora. Of course, the murderous Palestinians have no rights to a share in what the Israelis have achieved...

After the sheer brutality of the assault on the 9th Oct and with the inevitable storm of fire and metal that followed it I can assure you that a one state solution is no longer an option...

Finally you're actually forming a pragmatic view of the situation. Well done!

Useful info, thank you for doing that. Now I have to figure out why I've got the figure I have...? Oh gerfuck...!

Last time we flew back on Sleazy it was £25.99. The taxi airport to gaff was £40 made up of £31 fare, £5 airport pickup (Peel Ports wizard rip-off wheeze) and tip ie more than the air fare! Obviously IOMG need to milk the Racket to help paper over the cracks in their finances but fares like that are just not competitive and piss people off. Especially as we all know the boats IOM -> UK will be quite empty. If you don't believe it try booking a sailing 2 days before TT and return 3 days after. Obviously some Brain of Britain thinks they can charge TT rates for folks who want nothing whatever to do with it. Idiots...

So folks think that government should be building houses? Probably fair as they're the ones whose policies have been so poor they need around 10k more economically active folks just to balance the books. But if I had been asked if I was OK with more and more people coming over I would have said NO.

Have they? What are the numbers?

I think the lack of rentals is being viewed the wrong way. A shortage of supply drives the price up and therefore the profits.

Just planning our TT Escape. Car + 2 an eye-watering £587 return...

The BTL brigade are driving a lot of it and IOMG need to get a grip of them It's true that "control" by IOMG is inevitably the kiss of death to most things they touch because the place is essentially driven by self-interest. But housing is such a fundamental aspect of life it should concentrate what passes for their collective thinking. Hmmmm.......