NHS Consultant Contract / Private Practice.

[buncha wankas]

What kind of  weak management  closes a private ward just to use it as a way of managing contracts,  seems they got rid of  a bad hospital manager a few years back and put more bad management in her place or are most of them part of the old regime with different roles in disguise and a few new front men or women?

To many senior manager in DHSC all dancing around each other as in ‘the proverbial handbag’ instead of finding some backbone and standing up for the patients.  

Never mind the consultants, get rid of the people getting paid to NOT manage. 

[craggy_steve]

12 hours ago, finlo said:

Do you not think such long waiting lists are deliberately so? I think there are two things at play here, 1 if you croak before treatment = saving for the hospital 2 forcing more people into the consultants lucrative private practices.

1) False economy: If she goes into care for even as little as 3 months sooner than she need to the DHSS will lose financially, cataract ops are very cheap. 

[ballaughbiker]

Quote

The biggest problem faced by the Manx NHS is recruitment; a problem caused (as I’ve bleated on about before on this forum) by IOMG’s insistence on moving away from the UK NHS pension to the Manx GUS about 10 years ago.

Correct

Quote

Personally I would ban private medicine

Wot? Completely or just at Nobles?

[The Lurker]

1 hour ago, ballaughbiker said:

Correct

Wot? Completely or just at Nobles?

Completely; it’s immoral that individuals can buy better health than those less fortunate. 

[ballaughbiker]

Quote

Completely; it’s immoral that individuals can buy better health than those less fortunate. 

Do you limit that opinion to health? 

 

[The Lurker]

1 hour ago, MrPB said:

That’s total nonsense. People are not nipping off to Harley Street for elective procedures. My relative would probably be dead now if they had to rely on the long waiting lists and shitty scheduling of the Manx NHS. Statements like you have just made make me furious to be honest as they assume the baseline service provided by the NHS is anywhere near acceptable when it isn’t. When people have to go to a private consultant as they can’t get heart tests and heart treatment quick enough on the NHS so I’m sorry but the system stinks and the person in question would probably now be dead if he had not get his cheque book out and flew away to get what he could not get within an acceptable timeframe by the Manx NHS. That is not nipping off to Harley Street, that is deciding to keep yourself alive by purchasing services the Manx NHS cannot provide to you with. I am also talking about someone with a 50 year plus Manx NI contribution history who has paid for those services over their lifetime to find them sadly lacking when actually needed. 

I think you misunderstood my point; I fully understand why your relative went private but it boils my piss that they had to and I appreciate that the NHS is no longer fully fit for purpose in some areas. 

There is no incentive for political leaders who in the main are wealthy individuals who only have their own interests and the interests of their equally wealthy friends at heart to ensure that the NHS is fit for purpose when they have the option to queue jump because they can afford private health care. 

If the Etonian cabal that run the UK were forced to rely only upon the NHS I am certain that they would increase the budgets to ensure that they received the health care that they want. 

Private healthcare should not be required. The NHS should be funded and managed in a fashion so that your relative shouldn’t have to go private to get life saving treatment; that is frankly a disgrace but it won’t change while NHS is a political tool controlled by an elite that couldn’t care less about normal folk. They think of us like cattle whose sole purpose is to prop up a system that supports their privileged lifestyles. 

Ban private healthcare and force the politicians to actually give a shit about public services. 

I feel the same about education but that isn’t really the subject of this thread.

 

[dilligaf]

This might be a silly question, but doesn’t private healthcare shorten the waiting time for Joe Bloggs on the NHS list ?

Surey if you stopped private altogether we would not be able to keep good medics here as they would clear off to where the pickings were better

[finlo]

19 minutes ago, dilligaf said:

This might be a silly question, but doesn’t private healthcare shorten the waiting time for Joe Bloggs on the NHS list ?

Surey if you stopped private altogether we would not be able to keep good medics here as they would clear off to where the pickings were better

Theoretically yes in practice no.

[buncha wankas]

5 minutes ago, The Lurker said:

I think you misunderstood my point; I fully understand why your relative went private but it boils my piss that they had to and I appreciate that the NHS is no longer fully fit for purpose in some areas. 

There is no incentive for political leaders who in the main are wealthy individuals who only have their own interests and the interests of their equally wealthy friends at heart to ensure that the NHS is fit for purpose when they have the option to queue jump because they can afford private health care. 

If the Etonian cabal that run the UK were forced to rely only upon the NHS I am certain that they would increase the budgets to ensure that they received the health care that they want. 

Private healthcare should not be required. The NHS should be funded and managed in a fashion so that your relative shouldn’t have to go private to get life saving treatment; that is frankly a disgrace but it won’t change while NHS is a political tool controlled by an elite that couldn’t care less about normal folk. They think of us like cattle whose sole purpose is to prop up a system that supports their privileged lifestyles. 

Ban private healthcare and force the politicians to actually give a shit about public services. 

I feel the same about education but that isn’t really the subject of this thread.

 

Private healthcare should not be required?

  Most of the healthcare provided by Hospital is private, either paid for via off island hospital treatment and a cheque via the DHSC or consultant brought in from other hospitals via other U.K. hospitals for set amount of visits or telemedicine.  Effectively IOM DHSC are paying direct private healthcare fees to U.K. trusts and wonder why costs can not be controlled.   Bad management throughout the last 10 years or so got us here and anyone inheriting it is ‘pissing in the wind’

A  U.K. Trust could manage our Hospitals more efficiently.  The current severe top heavy expensive DHSC management structure is unsustainable and not productive, unless you are a senior manager copy pasting U.K. concepts to validate your pretend role, then at 80k a year your salary and that of your other 30 odd colleagues on the same gravy train, then it is a very productive system.  

[The Lurker]

14 minutes ago, buncha wankas said:

Private healthcare should not be required?

  Most of the healthcare provided by Hospital is private, either paid for via off island hospital treatment and a cheque via the DHSC or consultant brought in from other hospitals via other U.K. hospitals for set amount of visits or telemedicine.  Effectively IOM DHSC are paying direct private healthcare fees to U.K. trusts and wonder why costs can not be controlled.   Bad management throughout the last 10 years or so got us here and anyone inheriting it is ‘pissing in the wind’

A  U.K. Trust could manage our Hospitals more efficiently.  The current severe top heavy expensive DHSC management structure is unsustainable and not productive, unless you are a senior manager copy pasting U.K. concepts to validate your pretend role, then at 80k a year your salary and that of your other 30 odd colleagues on the same gravy train, then it is a very productive system.  

The Manx NHS is a prisoner of geography and fairly unusual circumstances compared to the UK; the services that we pay for in Liverpool aren’t really ‘private’ though; it’s paying for a service that it would be uneconomical to provide on-island. 

Nobles provides a far better breadth of service than any small town of 85,000 in the UK would have but they have the luxury of having a larger hub hospital a relatively short journey away; usually within the same trust, providing tertiary care will always be expensive as travel will have to be paid for; it makes it costly but it’s still cheaper than having a fully equipped tertiary care hospital with specialists sitting around twiddling their thumbs waiting for the two or three patients a year that require their services. 

Having some experience of UK NHS management I doubt that a UK Trust would improve matters at Nobles even if we could find one that would be willing to take it on and frankly I don’t trust IOMG to negotiate a deal that would see us better off. 

Healthcare is an area that will always see us reliant upon our larger neighbours; there is some merit in the argument that we should be considering moving from Liverpool to Dublin though. 

[buncha wankas]

6 minutes ago, The Lurker said:

The Manx NHS is a prisoner of geography and fairly unusual circumstances compared to the UK; the services that we pay for in Liverpool aren’t really ‘private’ though; it’s paying for a service that it would be uneconomical to provide on-island. 

Nobles provides a far better breadth of service than any small town of 85,000 in the UK would have but they have the luxury of having a larger hub hospital a relatively short journey away; usually within the same trust, providing tertiary care will always be expensive as travel will have to be paid for; it makes it costly but it’s still cheaper than having a fully equipped tertiary care hospital with specialists sitting around twiddling their thumbs waiting for the two or three patients a year that require their services. 

Having some experience of UK NHS management I doubt that a UK Trust would improve matters at Nobles even if we could find one that would be willing to take it on and frankly I don’t trust IOMG to negotiate a deal that would see us better off. 

Healthcare is an area that will always see us reliant upon our larger neighbours; there is some merit in the argument that we should be considering moving from Liverpool to Dublin though. 

I think you are assuming there is only one Trust we have a Tertiary agreement with, or that we have any binding agreements, in reality there are about 15 odd hospitals providing tertiary and none are joined up pathways care for patients or joined up communication and admin pathways.

[The Lurker]

8 minutes ago, buncha wankas said:

I think you are assuming there is only one Trust we have a Tertiary agreement with, or that we have any binding agreements, in reality there are about 15 odd hospitals providing tertiary and none are joined up pathways care for patients or joined up communication and admin pathways.

I appreciate it’s complicated but ultimately we will always be in a weak negotiating position when it comes to specialists care and will have to pay through the nose. 

[Manximus Aururaneus]

1 hour ago, The Lurker said:

I think you misunderstood my point; I fully understand why your relative went private but it boils my piss that they had to and I appreciate that the NHS is no longer fully fit for purpose in some areas. 

There is no incentive for political leaders who in the main are wealthy individuals who only have their own interests and the interests of their equally wealthy friends at heart to ensure that the NHS is fit for purpose when they have the option to queue jump because they can afford private health care. 

If the Etonian cabal that run the UK were forced to rely only upon the NHS I am certain that they would increase the budgets to ensure that they received the health care that they want. 

Private healthcare should not be required. The NHS should be funded and managed in a fashion so that your relative shouldn’t have to go private to get life saving treatment; that is frankly a disgrace but it won’t change while NHS is a political tool controlled by an elite that couldn’t care less about normal folk. They think of us like cattle whose sole purpose is to prop up a system that supports their privileged lifestyles. 

Ban private healthcare and force the politicians to actually give a shit about public services. 

I feel the same about education but that isn’t really the subject of this thread.

 

I would be interested to hear how you would 'ban private healthcare'?

[P.K.]

1 hour ago, dilligaf said:

This might be a silly question, but doesn’t private healthcare shorten the waiting time for Joe Bloggs on the NHS list ?

No. It actually lengthens the queue.

You can move ahead of the queue by going to a private consultation but eg surgery and after care can be on the NHS.

[buncha wankas]

44 minutes ago, The Lurker said:

I appreciate it’s complicated but ultimately we will always be in a weak negotiating position when it comes to specialists care and will have to pay through the nose. 

Not always, rural location is affiliated to  a village in U.K. who in turn  is affiliated to a town who ultimately are affiliated with nearest city hospital facilities or regional, who are ultimately affiliated to a specialist selected facility even if it is 5 hours up the motorway. 

Costs to attend external locations are reimbursed to patient where relevant and treatment between trusts is joined up and financially efficient as they benefit each management teams.  

 

Worth discussing, is it time to get rid of deadwood?