Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Pointless thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkydevil Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Because I can't see what the point of this thread is. But then you lot don't need a reason to gang up on LDV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Do you really think Keith is ganging up on LDV? I see a genuine attempt to get a realistic idea of what his ideas actually mean. [and LDV - cutting and pasting links doesn't cut the mustard - go on, try and give an overview of what you think a society run on anarchist lines would look like - and don't forget to include the sewage workers, the inventors and the born-leaders in your attempt!] There is little doubt in my mind that LDV supplies one of the strongest alternative points of view on the forums. I genuinely respect his willingness to put this point of view, almost always politely, in the face of pretty strong criticism. I fully acknowedge I've strongly attacked his beliefs - I see them as utopian and far too likely to end in violence and repression. But I am still very interested in them. From each according to their abilities to each according to their needs. I personally think that is close to a recipy for enslavement - but acknowledge that many many people across time have seen it as a human ideal. LDV seems to be one of the few people on the forums to strongly espouse such an ideal and I am genuinely interested in seeing if he can make any sense out of it. So far I'm unimpressed, but you never know - is there anything more to anarchism than fine, impractical words? I've no idea, but LDV seems to think so. I don't think it is so terrible of Keith to ask for a bit more of an explanation. There have been many more far worse thread topics on here, and no doubt it'll drop away in a few days, so where's the harm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Pointless thread. Because I can't see what the point of this thread is. That doesn't make it pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 No, it doesn't. But it does answer the question I was replying to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 The question was "Why?" Do you think he was asking: a) "Why [do you think it's pointless]?", or b) "Why [did you post that]?" I'm guessing it was a, and that you didn't answer the question at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevster Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I think that most people were idealistic and left wing when young - I know I was. One day LDV will have to face the real world and come to terms with the fact that however wonderful his ideals may seem, human society isn't like that. One thing that does always get me about people like LDV - why do they always want to drag the 'upper' and 'middle' classes (to use the words of the lefties) down to the level of the workers. Wouldn't the lot of the toiling class be better served if all the effort was directed at improving their lot and bringing them upto the level of the rest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I thought I was answering a. ie If I can't see a point in something, I think it's pointless, at least until I'm shown the error of my ways. I thought that was self evident and replied sarcastically to Slinky's daft question. There's no other way to answer his question, it would be like asking an atheist to prove the non-existence of God. Surley, the onus is on the people who believe in something - God, UFOs, the point of this thread - to provide the answers, and not those who don't get it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Surley, the onus is on the people who believe in something - God, UFOs, the point of this thread - to provide the answers, and not those who don't get it? But slinky didn't "get" why you believe it's pointless, so, by your own logic, isn't the onus on you do provide the answer to that? Is the best you can come up with really "it's pointless because that's what I think"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Is the best you can come up with really "it's pointless because that's what I think"? No, that not what I said. I think it is pointless, because I can't see a point. Rather than arguing semantics wouldn't it be better, if you're that bothered, to show me a point to this thread, and thereby making my post invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Rather than hi-jack another thread, to either ask why shouldn't drug dealers be in prison in the 'smoke free prison' thread or generally in the 'under 16's voting' one, I thought I'd ask generally in a new message... If MLCs were electable it would only make the government marginally more democratic and in respect of the fact that they are all electors and represent the people. But it's still a far cry from a people's government - which is what democracy is. If democracy was taught, then the young people will then not only question the lack of democracy in government but also in society as well, in terms of liberal democracy does not impinge on the private power in the workplace - where most are government by other bodies. In general, I don't understand what LDV is suggesting as an alternative structure (if any structure at all?) I'm also confused as to how change would take place by not taking part in the existing system? What should LDV's society look like? How would society get there? What are the advantages? How does 'crime & punishment' (or crime and non-punishment) work? If this is laid out somewhere else in straight forward chunks, then please just direct me there. I've got the gist of what you don't like, I just don't understand what you'd replace it with or why that would be better and how you propose to get there. Quote ....... “If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkydevil Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 ...and replied sarcastically to Slinky's daft question. I don't think it was a daft question, I just wondered why you thought it was pointless, because IMO it isn't. I guess I could have held your hand and pointed to the original poster and his questions to LDV - that was the point of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Is the best you can come up with really "it's pointless because that's what I think"? No, that not what I said. I think it is pointless, because I can't see a point. Rather than arguing semantics wouldn't it be better, if you're that bothered, to show me a point to this thread, and thereby making my post invalid. Your initial post was pointless, and your answer was pointless. I don't know the point of the thread (I can't see the first post), I just wanted to tell you that your contributions have been pointless. And you are pointless. Because I can't see the point. Show me the error of my ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Show me the error of my ways. Ahh, but what would be the point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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