Mr News Rent Rises Next Year Council Houses

[ballaughbiker]

It may be jealousy Kopek or it may just be that the rent is subsidised. If it wasn't to such a degree, I think most of the SH bashers on here would have no case at all.

 

I think SH is a good thing and that there should be more of it. However it should be at a more realistic (but not necessarily market) rent. Those that genuinely cannot afford it can be addressed by the benefits system.

[Boo Gay'n]

Evening guys,

 

I have looked through Mr. Robertshaws press release.

 

Taking Onchan as an example, housing rents are set to rise by a further 5% in April on top of the 27% (approx) applied since 2010. The increases would be fine, but surely means testing should be applied as a matter of urgency.

 

Who has had a 32% wage increase since 2010 over the last three years?

 

The Minister also states that the average rise for general housing will be around £4 per week, with a 3-bed household paying £85 per week and that a similar property in the private sector on average would be about £250 a week.

 

The figure of £85 does not include rates - again take Onchan, an average three house is around £85 per week or £4,420 per annum, plus £663 in rates = £5,083.00

 

Where did Mr. Robertshaw get the private rent of £250 per week = £13,000 annum and who says it's a fair value for a three bedroom house?

 

From looking at a number property websites tonight you can rent a three bedroom house for £650 - £800 per month or £8,000 (approx) per annum.

 

The real gap is a lot less than Mr. Robertshaw is stating.

 

Most people in local authority housing are struggling just like the private sector and the Department of Social Care and Mr. Robertshaw need to give local authorities the powers to address the 3% to 5% of tenants that should no longer be in local authority housing.

 

Mr. Singer would be a good starting point.

Rob (if it really is you)

 

Even on your figures, the difference between £85 per week and £200 is pretty bloody enormous. The taxpayer (like me) is subsidising public sector housing big style, and all of us know that there are 'vulnerable' households where the state ought to help and households with four or more working adults in them where help (subsidy) should not be given. Do you support the early introduction of means testing then?

[Rob Callister]

Rob (if it really is you)

 

Even on your figures, the difference between £85 per week and £200 is pretty bloody enormous. The taxpayer (like me) is subsidising public sector housing big style, and all of us know that there are 'vulnerable' households where the state ought to help and households with four or more working adults in them where help (subsidy) should not be given. Do you support the early introduction of means testing then?

 

 

 

Yes, it is Rob Callister (Onchan Commissioner)

 

Mr. Robertshaws figures of £85 per for social housing (three bedroom unit) and £250 for private sector housing per week is not totally correct.

 

I highlighted that the £85 per week mentioned in his press release for public sector housing didn't include the rates. So the actual figure should be around £97.75 per week or £423.58 per month approx. You could still pay the same price for a two-bedroom house, but I acknowledge that it is still excellent value if your on a reasonable salary or have multiple salaries coming in.

 

I fully support the introduction of means testing, in my personal opinion means testing should have been brought in before applying the new points system introduced last year.

 

Taxpayers are not subsidising public sector housing directly but the Isle of Man Government does make deficiency payments to local authorities of around £6 million each year, in order support Capital Projects such as building additional local authority housing around the Island.

[manxie44]

The vulnerable will have the rise covered by their Income Support. It's only those flash bastards with Ferraris and holiday homes in Marbella that will get hit with an extra expense.

Do you really know of Council House tenants with Ferraris?. This needs to be stopped right away, or there will be no-one to buy last years 4x4 models from the upgrading 'middle classes'. Please tell me the difference between renting a house from the Council, and getting a Government loan from the Government. Does the money on Government Loan schemes come from somewhere else other than the Tax Payer ? The only difference I can see is that one rents a house [ for all their lives in some cases] and has nothing at the end. The other pays back the money to Government [ plus interest] and has a house of their own at the end. Some of us are simply not lucky enough to own our own property, and never will be, Many many of the people I know were handed down their houses by their parents. Good luck to them, they are very lucky. Many others don't have that benefit. To those in their own houses, please stop bad-mouthing those who are not as lucky as you, and count your blessings. [while you are counting your money]

[EORH]

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

 

[doc.fixit]

 

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

 

we are below the poverty level and own our own house and DON'T have anyone to do or pay for repairs and maintenance AND are not moaning, As we approach 70 we are just glad of good health, full bellies and a roof over our heads.........so there !!

[Blade Runner]

 

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

 

 

Please do not take this the wrong way EORH, I appreciate you are a pensioner and probably unable to clean your own gutters but is the cleaning of gutters something that the housing authority should be doing anyway?

 

I would have thought something like that should be done or organised/ paid for by the tenant? Genuine question, what are the rules or expectations regarding general light maintenance with social housing? Anyone?

 

If for example something like your kitchen sink needed a new washer, who would be expected to do that? This is again not aimed at you EORH, it is just you raised the point of gutters, nothing more.

[thesultanofsheight]

I would have thought something like that should be done or organised/ paid for by the tenant? Genuine question, what are the rules or expectations regarding general light maintenance with social housing? Anyone?

 

If for example something like your kitchen sink needed a new washer, who would be expected to do that? This is again not aimed at you EORH, it is just you raised the point of gutters, nothing more.

In most cases the corpy would get a call to send a corpy plumber out. You're not expecting that most people would pay £100 or their own money to get a plumber are you?

[Blade Runner]

 

I would have thought something like that should be done or organised/ paid for by the tenant? Genuine question, what are the rules or expectations regarding general light maintenance with social housing? Anyone?

 

If for example something like your kitchen sink needed a new washer, who would be expected to do that? This is again not aimed at you EORH, it is just you raised the point of gutters, nothing more.

In most cases the corpy would get a call to send a corpy plumber out. You're not expecting that most people would pay £100 or their own money to get a plumber are you?

 

No, changing a tap washer is very basic DIY and the cost would be pennies

[Rob Callister]

 

 

 

 

 

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

Please do not take this the wrong way EORH, I appreciate you are a pensioner and probably unable to clean your own gutters but is the cleaning of gutters something that the housing authority should be doing anyway?

 

I would have thought something like that should be done or organised/ paid for by the tenant? Genuine question, what are the rules or expectations regarding general light maintenance with social housing? Anyone?

 

If for example something like your kitchen sink needed a new washer, who would be expected to do that? This is again not aimed at you EORH, it is just you raised the point of gutters, nothing more.

 

I agree with Bladerunner, I wouldn't expect for a local authority to be called out to clean gutters, unless the guttering is broken.

 

Maybe the age of the individual is the factor here, but surely there is a kind neighbour that can help out in these cases.

 

In respect of maintenance, I have tried to attach two pages from the Onchan Tenants handbook which can explain the works to be undertaken by the authority and the tenants.

 

Unfortunately, the files are to big but I have posted the details on my Facebook page ( rob Callister - Onchan commissioner)

[Moghrey Mie]

 

 

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

 

 

Please do not take this the wrong way EORH, I appreciate you are a pensioner and probably unable to clean your own gutters but is the cleaning of gutters something that the housing authority should be doing anyway?

 

I would have thought something like that should be done or organised/ paid for by the tenant? Genuine question, what are the rules or expectations regarding general light maintenance with social housing? Anyone?

 

If for example something like your kitchen sink needed a new washer, who would be expected to do that? This is again not aimed at you EORH, it is just you raised the point of gutters, nothing more.

http://www.oxford.gov.uk/Direct/30377bluetenancyagreement.pdf

 

All clearly laid out here but I can't find the equivalent for the IOM council houses.

[NeverAgain]

If there is a problem with SH tenants who earn too much money to really be living in that kind of accomodation, the big problem is this.

 

They are likely to be in their late 40s to 50s to have risen up the career ladder enough to get an income that is now high enough to make SH unnecessary.

 

At that age it is difficult to get a mortgage, i.e. a 25 year one so they would be required to get a 15-20 year type plus a big deposit to keep the payments sensible.

 

It is easy to say kick out high earners from SH but the practicalities are a bit harder. I dont know what solution there may be? New terms that say if by the age of say, 40 if you are on the path to earn more than "x" you will be required to move out of SH by your 45th birthday, giving them time to save for 5 years a deposit? Any other suggestions?

 

If they are happy enough renting and have climbed the career ladder high enough surely they can afford to rent privately and free up the houses for people who really need them?

[NeverAgain]

 

Rents are still far too low compared to renting privately, I think they realise this and have applied these changes too late. I work with 4 people who live in council houses, all four bitch and moan about how much they have to pay, despite the fact i'm paying twice what they pay every month for a 2 bedroom flat whilst they have a 3 bedroom house! They effectively get £350 extra every pay packet and never seem to realise how lucky and how much better off they really are.

 

Oh and I nearly forgot if anything goes wrong with the property someone is called out at the drop of hat!

 

And there are some of us who are on a state pension which is below the poverty level of £200 a week, and have to pay the full amount, we don't want to go down to Markwell House and beg for extra money to pay the rent, when the rent goes up on April 1st, the pension doesn't go up till about the 17th April, and its lower in percentage terms.

As for the idea of instant repairs, it just doesn't happen, I have been waiting to get the gutters cleaned since March, some LAs don't look after their properties at the drop of a hat, they have lists of priorities, so cleaning gutters must be at the bottom of the list,maybe Chris Robertshaw should make surprise visits to see for himself if some of these LAs should lose their housing status.

 

 

You're talking to someone thats unlikely to ever get a state pension.........

 

However In your situation I'd look at either moving into a smaller property (pay less rent) or ask for more money, perhaps you don't want too but its there for people who genuinely need it and if you're struggling to buy food, heat the house, buy Christmas presents for the grandkids and put clothes on your back then you need the support.

[ballaughbiker]

I agree with Bladerunner, I wouldn't expect for a local authority to be called out to clean gutters, unless the guttering is broken.

I agree, in an ideal world.

 

The following points are general following 30 years of managing rented property and are not aimed at anyone and are definitely not having a go at tenants generally. Most are reasonable and good to deal with but a few (usually single men in my experience) have never discovered which end of a screwdriver to pick up and the thought of one of these unblocking a gutter nearly made me spew my tea onto the keyboard in amusement as I read it.

 

Even the good majority appear to have a mindset. "I'm paying you rent so you do it, it's your property (and by inference, your problem). The call for help is sometimes exaggerated, like "the kitchen light is flickering, I think the wiring is faulty". The landlord or his agent is scrambled with tools to probably drive a 40 mile round trip to find....... a florescent tube so old its black at both ends. When this is pointed out, and suggested that they buy their own from B&Q and fit it themselves, there is genuine (or very well acted) surprise. The total cost of the exercise having gone to B&Q to get and then fit it can easily exceed £100 but the cost would be well less than a tenner if they had only been a bit more independent but remember that mindset.

 

I certainly wouldn't expect a 60 something pensioner to go up a ladder themselves in December when a similarly aged landlord will do it for them whilst they're warm inside watching daytime telly and paying rent well below market.

 

PS If this example (one of thousands you won't want to hear) doesn't apply to you then don't get cross. It's just how it is. If landlords don't like it, they can stop being a landlord but let's not dismiss some of the ludicrous problems they will have been scrambled for over the years.

 

please stop bad-mouthing those who are not as lucky as you, and count your blessings. [while you are counting your money]

 

Indeed, a fair point but everything works in two directions.

[EORH]

No I'm not moaning about paying the rent rise in principle, but the outsides of Council Houses are the responsibility of the Douglas Corporation, inside it's the tenants decorating etc, you see if the gutters are not cleaned, the water runs down the outside of the walls and thereby the damp happens, this could be the case of the Willaston Houses.

I got told in March that they were waiting for special equipment to come from across, as with the Health and Safety aspect, the men don't go up ladders anymore, so any repairs IE Roof slates, ridge tiles, gutters, downspouts, are the responsibility of the Landlord.

As for light fittings IE changing bulbs is the tenants job, but as with toilets and taps, these days they are more complicated than the older types, and I certainly wouldn't attempt to mess with them.

And over the years when we were much younger and working I, as with other tenants who look after their properties, have put in their own bathroom suites, and kitchens, and Central Heating Boilers, at no cost to the Corporation.