Minnie Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 I'll try and keep this as brief as possible.... To my horror I received a letter from a debt collection agency the other day saying that I owed £24.42 to PayPal and the debt had to be cleared within 7 days. I contacted them to ask what the story was and they told me to contact PayPal. I emailed PayPal to ask what the amount was for and they said ebay fees, contact ebay to get the details. Emailed ebay, they had no idea what the amount was for and my ebay account was actually in credit by £5.23. I've now sent about 10 emails to PayPal and seem to be getting nowhere fast. I told them what ebay had said and PayPal now say the amount is £24.80 for items purchased on 24-01-2007. I told them that surely if I'd purchased items and the payment hadn't gone through then I wouldn't have received any goods and there wouldn't be a problem nor any money owed. They won't tell me any details about the items I've allegedly purchased nor the company I'm supposed to have purchased them from because they say the address I'm emailing them from isn't the address attached to my PayPal account....it is the address I normally use to login to my account and it's the address to which I receive any correspondence from PayPal!!!! I've received no correspondence from them, up until the other day when I got the letter from the collection agency, telling me that I've owed them this money since 24-01-07, something which I find very strange. I'm getting really frustrated and angry over this so if anybody has any advice as to what I should do I'd be very grateful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeddan Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 What did the debt collection agency say to that? Write them a letter setting out what you have here, and ask them to detail exactly why they think they have a right to make a claim against you and to please confirm the account details - address etc. of the person who has the Paypal account which is in debt. If they don't give a sensible reply, then write again, point out they have not given anything to show they have a right to claim this so called debt from you, or you have any responsiblity for this, and ask what action they propose taking. At some point I'd also think about sending a letter to the debt collection agency saying they owe you £24.42 for harrassment and wasting your time and the debt has to be cleared within 7 days. It would also be an idea to try and find out more about the debt collection agency - i.e. whether it is a bona fide well known one. If there isn't much that can be found out behind the letterhead and a telephone number, I'd suspect the possibility that it might be a scam - i.e. send out bogus demands like this for various smallish amounts and you may well collect a fair amount of cash for the effort - few will probably report this to the police and some will pay just because of the hassle and fear of bad credit record etc. The Paypal transaction could be either mistaken identity or a part of the scam used against the selected marks or targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minnie Posted February 21, 2008 Author Share Posted February 21, 2008 Thanks for that, Skeddan. Just Googled the debt collection agency (NCO Europe) and some of the results make for very interesting reading. I feel absolutely certain that I don't owe PayPal any amount at all. I have asked PayPal to unlock my account so I can go back through it to try and get to the bottom of this matter....they've refused! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 My Dad had something similar a few months ago and it took ages to sort out. 6 month previously, he had an e-mail saying that a new e-mail address had been added to his paypal account. He then got one a few minutes later to say that a payment for £20 had been made for a o2 PAYG sim card. We immediatly removed this e-mail address from his account and changed his PayPal password. Then made a false claim report on PayPal's website and also e-mailed the buyer's and seller's e-mail addresses explaining what had happened. The seller of the SimCard hadn't sent the item off and so refunded the Paypal payment back into my Dad's account. A month or so later, PayPal also stuck £20 into my Dad's account without him realising. Several months after that he got a few e-mails saying they were from PayPal and he owed them money for "Unspecified reason" and to log into his account. He deleted them thinking they were Spam messages. He then got the notice from the Debt Collection Agency. After going through all the transactions and checking his PayPal account, we discovered that it was all to do with this refund. PayPal hadn't realised that the seller had refunded the money and did it themselves. The Seller then must have realised that she had had 2 lots of £20 out of her account and told PayPal and it all went from there.... So check if you hav ever been refunded any money. Have you ever bought or sold something which has then been cancelled? Check all your PayPal transactions back as far as you can to ensure that you know what each one is and that you have only received the payment once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 PayPal are wankers really. They're operate as a bank but are not under the banking code of practice. They are notoriously difficult to get a straight answer out of and seem to make up rules as they go along. The daft thing is that PayPal are owned by eBay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minnie Posted February 21, 2008 Author Share Posted February 21, 2008 PayPal are wankers really. You ain't kidding! Just spent 52 minutes on the phone to them trying to clear this matter up and I'm still none the wiser. I am however so fucking angry I feel like I'm gonna kill someone! The amount which they claim I owe them has now changed 4 times.....ranging from £22.81 up to £25.67. They say they can't tell me exact details of the alleged transaction and are still refusing to unlock my account. They have admitted that they made a clerical error though and the amount on the debt collection agency letter differs from what they say I actually owe them. I've not even used my PayPal account since May 2007! I've told them that unless they can give me exact details of the amount and that someone who at least knows their arse from their elbow can contact me about it then I'm not prepared to do anything else. Tossers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeddan Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 Thanks for that, Skeddan. Just Googled the debt collection agency (NCO Europe) and some of the results make for very interesting reading. I feel absolutely certain that I don't owe PayPal any amount at all. I have asked PayPal to unlock my account so I can go back through it to try and get to the bottom of this matter....they've refused! Perhaps the best thing to do this in writing - provide Paypal with your account details, ask them nicely to explain exactly why your account has been locked, and to provide details of the relevant transactions, and explain that it seems that the debt in question is owing on another account which is not yours. Is the £5.23 credit in Paypal? If after writing to Paypal they still refuse to release your £5.23 you could email them - asking for the email to be forwarded to the legal dept - detail your previous correspondence with them and explain that if they don't return your money or give satisfactory reasons for taking this from you, then you will report them to IC3 for 'Wire Fraud' - US Code Title 18, 1343 (you can report the matter to the Internet Crime Center - online - as Wire Fraud by Paypal - i.e. they are taking your money following false pretenses and assurances communicated by wire or Internet. You don't have to be in US - it can be reported in this way if it is Paypal USA). If nothing else it might get them to look into it a bit more seriously and see that there has indeed been a mistake - or at least get to the bottom of it if there has been a problem like the one andrew has suggested. At that point I would expect something like a sensible response from them. If they still don't, then write out your complaint for submission, send it to them and ask whether a resolution can be found to the complaint as detailed - failing which you will submit this to IC3 - then in last resort submit the complaint. I haven't used Paypal for a long time - if it is still linked to a credit card and payment is taken from this, you could also contact the credit card company and ask them to refund the amount in the paypal account that they refuse to return to you. I would still write to NCO Europe as suggested. Keep a log of any phone calls as well and detailed notes on what they say. (They seem to be quite a horrible bunch of people, and there seem to be a lot of people having problems with Paypal and this outfit). What a horrible experience with this kind of menacing letter and arrogant treatment - you have every right to express firm indignation at this , and should do so. BTW - probably their complaints handling process is done in a kind of triage - and they might only respond and take action with the ones they can't fob off with standard response and where the people are firm, serious and determined, and will cause a headache to them. Making the right noises will escalate the way it is handled and can go a long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keyboarder Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 Worth a read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 I've told them that unless they can give me exact details of the amount and that someone who at least knows their arse from their elbow can contact me about it then I'm not prepared to do anything else. Don't leave it at nothing otherwise the Debt Collection Agency will just get a CCJ against you, and then that is your Credit Rating gone. They are a nightware to get reversed. Stick something in writing to PayPal explaing everything that has happened and copy it to the Debt Collection Agency so they too are aware of what is happening. If they hear nothign, then they will pursue it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keyboarder Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 Don't leave it at nothing otherwise the Debt Collection Agency will just get a CCJ against you, and then that is your Credit Rating gone. They are a nightware to get reversed. They can't get a ccj without informing Minnie of any impending hearings. At which Minnie can contest the claim and amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeddan Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 I doubt NCO Europe will actually apply for a CCJ from what I see of the way they carry on. If Minnie is in IoM they might have to make a claim locally, which would be interesting - I very much doubt they'd do that. Instead they seem to threaten to send a Mr Brown round to your house to collect the debt - but that doesn't seem to happen - or maybe he is too busy as he seems to be the only guy who does this for the whole of the UK (any maybe IoM as well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluemonday Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Hope it gets sorted Minnie. I've just closed my paypal as a result of reading this and other negative posts in the past on them. Hope you get a result - and an apology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minnie Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 Hope it gets sorted Minnie. I've just closed my paypal as a result of reading this and other negative posts in the past on them.Hope you get a result - and an apology. Thanks for that and I don't blame you for closing your account. Still banging my head against a very large brick wall at the minute. Getting absolutely no sense whatsoever from PayPal, receiving threats of legal action from NCO and even ebay, who appeared to be very helpful at the start, have done nothing more to help. Gone through my ebay account and my bank statements etc and I still don't see how I owe any money. All I'm asking from PayPal is that they give me an amount (was given another different amount in an email from them today!) and details of the transaction to which the amount relates but they give all sorts of excuses and stories in their responses and still haven't given me the information I require. I'm in the process of printing off all the emails from PayPal so I can get all down in writing to them. Absolute nightmare but thanks to all, especially Skeddan, for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladybug Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 I doubt NCO Europe will actually apply for a CCJ from what I see of the way they carry on. If Minnie is in IoM they might have to make a claim locally, which would be interesting - I very much doubt they'd do that. Instead they seem to threaten to send a Mr Brown round to your house to collect the debt - but that doesn't seem to happen - or maybe he is too busy as he seems to be the only guy who does this for the whole of the UK (any maybe IoM as well). intresting as i have also had cards through the door telling that a Mr Brown will call at such & such a time -and no one has ever shown up. I'd love to know who actually sends them out Minnie Hope you manage to get the PP thing sorted out as well, i closed my PP account a couple of years ago as i had a few hassles with them as well. They are a bloody nightmare to speak too (i was on "hold" for most of the time) and then when i did speak to someone they were a yank who didn't have the foggiest about anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minnie Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 I am gonna tear out my hair over this load of bollocks! PayPal and ebay are refusing to give me the information I need because they say the email address I'm using isn't the one attached to my accounts....I use Google mail and always put down my address as *****@gmail.com but apparently when I send emails they show as *****@googlemail.com. I've tried to explain that they are the same thing but they're refusing to listen to me and just keep telling me to mail them from the registered email address. Does anybody know if there's a way round this? There may be a simple solution but my head is so battered over this I can't see one. If the elusive Mr Brown called at my house I'd probably knock him into next week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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