Trevor Baines

[jimbms]

Jim. You've been a bit rude there to sibby. A new poster an all that - cut her a bit of slack maybe. I found her posts really interesting - I'd forgotten most of the SIB debacle, and it is kind of related to the subject in hand in that the courts were rather more lenient to the directors compared with Mr Baines.

Nah not me, I never used a swear word or called her one name. Just pointing out we can't really compare his nick time to a group that slithered off the charges, we need to look at other financial cases that made it to court to compare. It could have been worse, Spook, P.K. or even LDV could have chirped in.

Edited October 8, 2010 by jimbms

[cheeky boy]

Here's one of those seven degrees of separation thingys:

 

SIB Bank loaned money to it's directors and directors mates, one of whom used SIB money to buy the old Regent hotel and spent a fortune (of the same money) doing it up and turning it into the Admiral's Rest where Trevor Baines enjoyed many a good meal. The hotel was later bought by Jaimie Boncompte ran it brilliantly for several years before selling it to Mike Proffit. Who was director of a bank which loaned money.....................

[sibby]

Good post cheeky boy.

 

What many people don't realise is that the SIB collapsed through sheer and utter greed and underhand dealings. All the money they were taking in, enabled them to chuck it round as if there was no tomorrow. The Admiral's Rest was but one example.

 

It was all reminiscent of Viv Nicholson, the pools winner, in "Spend, Spend Spend". Except of course, Viv Nicholson obtained her huge windfall by honest means. She was not educated like the directors and their associates in the Savings and Investment Bank, who knew exactly what they were doing to obtain money, money, money.

 

Rather than Viv Nicholson, a more accurate analogy might be the man that said he had won the lottery and managed to get his bank to advance the amount whilst he pretended that the money was on its way. And then meantime 'lived the life' with huge parties etc.

 

It had to end sometime though didn't it.

 

When you consider (and I apologise for any repetition in the thread but it is important) that a director of the bank, an Advocate, charged the equivalent of the average annual salary for a day's work, and another bank associate forged an investor's will to get his hands on more cash, then we can start to realise what the SIB was really all about. It did not collapse because of some unfortunate investment that failed perhaps due to an act of God or whatever.

 

People in the Isle of Man - including some on these forums - accuse bank investors of being "greedy" for investing their hard earned savings for an extra 1% or whatever. They even go on to further vilify them for their protestations and speaking up about it.

 

That really sickens me.

 

.

Edited October 10, 2010 by sibby

[P.K.]

It could have been worse, Spook, P.K. or even LDV could have chirped in.

 

Not touched a little nerve have I?

 

Oh good...

[sibby]

It's quite a serious thread. Maybe no place for petty forum squabbles?

[Max Power]

 

People in the Isle of Man - including some on these forums - accuse bank investors of being "greedy" for investing their hard earned savings for an extra 1% or whatever. They even go on to further vilify them for their protestations and speaking up about it.

 

That really sickens me.

 

.

 

And me, a lot of ordinary people lost a huge amount of cash in that SIB scandal. Luckily I wasn't one of them but I know people who did.

To say that these people are greedy is a bit of an envious attitude, they just want their savings to work for them. That is part of our capitalist system, people work hard, put their savings in a bank to earn interest for the future (presumably so that they don't need to rely on benefits in retirement!), the bank invests their cash in other businesses which creates jobs and wealth all round. The 'greedy' brigade should look at how their own jobs are funded, without the 'system' we wouldn't enjoy our current lifestyle, human progress would grind to a halt.

They have every right to expect bank and government official to look after their interests and not be corrupt! If a bank fails due to criminal negligence they als have every right to expect reparation!

What the IoM allowed the SIB scum to get away with was criminal in the extreme, I would like to see a retrospective enquiry and subsequent prosecutions to all the scum involved, including the corrupt government officials who covered their own asses and negligence!

It's amazingly corrupt to have gone so far with Baines and allowed the SIB affair to have died a death!!

My dad once told me that Al Capone would have struggled to make a living on this Island as it was too corrupt even for him!

[localyokel]

And me, a lot of ordinary people lost a huge amount of cash in that SIB scandal. Luckily I wasn't one of them but I know people who did.

To say that these people are greedy is a bit of an envious attitude, they just want their savings to work for them. That is part of our capitalist system, people work hard, put their savings in a bank to earn interest for the future (presumably so that they don't need to rely on benefits in retirement!), the bank invests their cash in other businesses which creates jobs and wealth all round. The 'greedy' brigade should look at how their own jobs are funded, without the 'system' we wouldn't enjoy our current lifestyle, human progress would grind to a halt.

They have every right to expect bank and government official to look after their interests and not be corrupt! If a bank fails due to criminal negligence they als have every right to expect reparation!

What the IoM allowed the SIB scum to get away with was criminal in the extreme, I would like to see a retrospective enquiry and subsequent prosecutions to all the scum involved, including the corrupt government officials who covered their own asses and negligence!

It's amazingly corrupt to have gone so far with Baines and allowed the SIB affair to have died a death!!

My dad once told me that Al Capone would have struggled to make a living on this Island as it was too corrupt even for him!

 

We're in different times now MP. But the fact is that many people implicated in the SIB seem to have prospered here despite that and indeed many are still involved with successful regulated businesses over 25 years later. Some odd sort of 'diplomatic immunity' seems to have applied to protect those at the top of the tree. Decades later the difference with the likes of Baines is that we've gone from being a closed shop that could get away with whatever it likes, to being the UK's and US's lapdog desperately needing the recognition of being top quality international finance centre. When that happens we have to be seen to be taking people down hard to prove that we're not the grubby unregulated arsehole of the universe we were in 1982. The problem with high profile people who were around in the 1970s and 80s is perhaps that they still thought that it was a case of who you knew when it comes to sentencing.

Edited October 10, 2010 by localyokel

[Max Power]

I can agree to a point, but what was done by the SIB was still a criminal offence at the time. Someone commiting murder in 1982 would still be tried and convicted today!

[localyokel]

I can agree to a point, but what was done by the SIB was still a criminal offence at the time. Someone commiting murder in 1982 would still be tried and convicted today!

 

I'm agreeing with you. The fact that you see them driving round in very nice cars, living in very fine houses and being directors of regulated or quasi regulated businesses decades later hardly deters the current generation of financial services directors and officers does it?

[manshimajin]

To say that these people are greedy is a bit of an envious attitude, they just want their savings to work for them. That is part of our capitalist system, people work hard, put their savings in a bank to earn interest for the future (presumably so that they don't need to rely on benefits in retirement!), the bank invests their cash in other businesses which creates jobs and wealth all round. The 'greedy' brigade should look at how their own jobs are funded, without the 'system' we wouldn't enjoy our current lifestyle, human progress would grind to a halt.

I would criticise people for putting ALL their savings into one bank, or one anything else, if their savings are substantial. A Professor won the Nobel Economics prize a number of years ago for essentially demonstrating that you should not put all your eggs in one basket. We ought to be able to assume that regulators are competent but the fact is that they have shown themselves over an over again not to be - up to and including the current 'financial crisis'. It is wise to start from the assumption that you should not have faith in their professionalism to protect you and should spread risk.

[WTF]

To say that these people are greedy is a bit of an envious attitude, they just want their savings to work for them. That is part of our capitalist system, people work hard, put their savings in a bank to earn interest for the future (presumably so that they don't need to rely on benefits in retirement!), the bank invests their cash in other businesses which creates jobs and wealth all round. The 'greedy' brigade should look at how their own jobs are funded, without the 'system' we wouldn't enjoy our current lifestyle, human progress would grind to a halt.

I would criticise people for putting ALL their savings into one bank, or one anything else, if their savings are substantial. A Professor won the Nobel Economics prize a number of years ago for essentially demonstrating that you should not put all your eggs in one basket. We ought to be able to assume that regulators are competent but the fact is that they have shown themselves over an over again not to be - up to and including the current 'financial crisis'. It is wise to start from the assumption that you should not have faith in their professionalism to protect you and should spread risk.

 

a great idea in theory, but if you have numerous accounts all over the place you also end up with numerous amounts of admin fees. it may be better to have all your eggs in one very safe bullet proof, fire retardent basket with one lot of admin fees??

[Max Power]

To say that these people are greedy is a bit of an envious attitude, they just want their savings to work for them. That is part of our capitalist system, people work hard, put their savings in a bank to earn interest for the future (presumably so that they don't need to rely on benefits in retirement!), the bank invests their cash in other businesses which creates jobs and wealth all round. The 'greedy' brigade should look at how their own jobs are funded, without the 'system' we wouldn't enjoy our current lifestyle, human progress would grind to a halt.

I would criticise people for putting ALL their savings into one bank, or one anything else, if their savings are substantial. A Professor won the Nobel Economics prize a number of years ago for essentially demonstrating that you should not put all your eggs in one basket. We ought to be able to assume that regulators are competent but the fact is that they have shown themselves over an over again not to be - up to and including the current 'financial crisis'. It is wise to start from the assumption that you should not have faith in their professionalism to protect you and should spread risk.

I'll agree with that, although it is more likely stupidity rather than greed that influenced anyone to do that.

[Kopek]

Proposed rise to 100k euro deposit protection should make it easier to spread that risk without too many accounts for the ordinary investor.

Presume we would have to follow suit or risk losing deposits but our scheme would only cover 'Manx' banks, would that mean that subsiduaries would be covered by foreign DCSs?

[jimbms]

It's quite a serious thread. Maybe no place for petty forum squabbles?

Sorry I don't do serious unless it involves safewords

[Terse]

LINK

 

Baines Admits Huge Theft

 

Douglas man Trevor Baines has admitted stealing £779,000-worth of credit balances from Hermitage Securities Ltd.

 

He's pleaded guilty to five theft offences at his latest appearance at Douglas Courthouse.

 

The offences occurred between July 2008 and June 2009.

 

He's been remanded in custody until January 10.