spook Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Has anyone yet mentioned the welfare of the horses? Is it still necessary to have a single horse pull a heavy tram with a varying load of passengers just for the novelty of being pulled by an animal? I'm aware that once running the effort required to keep them running isn't that great, but starting them going is horrible to watch. Is there nothing you can't find to moan about that is related to the Island? The Shire is a working animal, with an enormous capacity for weight pulling. There is no welfare issue at all. There are a number of heavy horse breeds that are classed as an endangered species - The Suffolk Punch for one Would you prefer the breed to die out because there is no job for it? These types of breeds are not pets and they are rarely ridden animals The breed would be maintained in the same way that other rare breeds of animals are maintained, there is no need to exploit them. As for harping on about things on the Island, it is only because there are now so very many things that ARE wrong that it is both simple to do and necessary to do because the majority of the population are ignoring them. Possibly because the majority of the population can't even see them. But they're there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Has anyone yet mentioned the welfare of the horses? Is it still necessary to have a single horse pull a heavy tram with a varying load of passengers just for the novelty of being pulled by an animal? I'm aware that once running the effort required to keep them running isn't that great, but starting them going is horrible to watch. Is there nothing you can't find to moan about that is related to the Island? The Shire is a working animal, with an enormous capacity for weight pulling. There is no welfare issue at all. There are a number of heavy horse breeds that are classed as an endangered species - The Suffolk Punch for one Would you prefer the breed to die out because there is no job for it? These types of breeds are not pets and they are rarely ridden animals The breed would be maintained in the same way that other rare breeds of animals are maintained, there is no need to exploit them. As for harping on about things on the Island, it is only because there are now so very many things that ARE wrong that it is both simple to do and necessary to do because the majority of the population are ignoring them. Possibly because the majority of the population can't even see them. But they're there. Why are the Horse Trams "now" wrong? They've been going for just a little while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessTickle Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Has anyone yet mentioned the welfare of the horses? Is it still necessary to have a single horse pull a heavy tram with a varying load of passengers just for the novelty of being pulled by an animal? I'm aware that once running the effort required to keep them running isn't that great, but starting them going is horrible to watch. Is there nothing you can't find to moan about that is related to the Island? The Shire is a working animal, with an enormous capacity for weight pulling. There is no welfare issue at all. There are a number of heavy horse breeds that are classed as an endangered species - The Suffolk Punch for one The breed would be maintained in the same way that other rare breeds of animals are maintained, there is no need to exploit them. You are talking crap. Rare breeds of horse are certainly not being maintained, particularly those whose original use was related to farming and forestry. All of the British heavy horse breeds are endangered. The Suffolk Punch and the Clydesdale are classed as critical. There are less than 400 Suffolk Punch horses in the UK, and not all of those will be breeding stock. Once you take out the geldings, the aged and the ones that due to conformation are unsuitable, you are probably left with 50, if you are lucky, that could be used to breed The Shire is classed as "at risk". These are big animals, they are not pets. Its probably around £150 for a set of shoes every 6 weeks, if not more, they need to earn their keep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Power Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I can remember Jimmy Savile pulling a horse tram along the Promenade to show that it wasn't a huge strain on the horses. What a nice man he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Has anyone yet mentioned the welfare of the horses? Is it still necessary to have a single horse pull a heavy tram with a varying load of passengers just for the novelty of being pulled by an animal? I'm aware that once running the effort required to keep them running isn't that great, but starting them going is horrible to watch. Is there nothing you can't find to moan about that is related to the Island? The Shire is a working animal, with an enormous capacity for weight pulling. There is no welfare issue at all. There are a number of heavy horse breeds that are classed as an endangered species - The Suffolk Punch for one Would you prefer the breed to die out because there is no job for it? These types of breeds are not pets and they are rarely ridden animals The breed would be maintained in the same way that other rare breeds of animals are maintained, there is no need to exploit them. As for harping on about things on the Island, it is only because there are now so very many things that ARE wrong that it is both simple to do and necessary to do because the majority of the population are ignoring them. Possibly because the majority of the population can't even see them. But they're there. Why are the Horse Trams "now" wrong? They've been going for just a little while. Bear baiting, cock fighting, hare coursing, and a lot of exploitation of animals went on for hundreds of years but civilised behaviour put an end to them. Just because exploitation of animals has been going on for a long time does not excuse it's continuance. If a horse drawn feature is wanted then there are far less ways to achieve this, not least landau carriages which have three added advantages, first there is no need for rails, secondly the work expected from the horse is less, thirdly they could be provided entirely by the private sector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Has anyone yet mentioned the welfare of the horses? Is it still necessary to have a single horse pull a heavy tram with a varying load of passengers just for the novelty of being pulled by an animal? I'm aware that once running the effort required to keep them running isn't that great, but starting them going is horrible to watch. Is there nothing you can't find to moan about that is related to the Island? The Shire is a working animal, with an enormous capacity for weight pulling. There is no welfare issue at all. There are a number of heavy horse breeds that are classed as an endangered species - The Suffolk Punch for one Would you prefer the breed to die out because there is no job for it? These types of breeds are not pets and they are rarely ridden animals The breed would be maintained in the same way that other rare breeds of animals are maintained, there is no need to exploit them. As for harping on about things on the Island, it is only because there are now so very many things that ARE wrong that it is both simple to do and necessary to do because the majority of the population are ignoring them. Possibly because the majority of the population can't even see them. But they're there. Why are the Horse Trams "now" wrong? They've been going for just a little while. Bear baiting, cock fighting, hare coursing, and a lot of exploitation of animals went on for hundreds of years but civilised behaviour put an end to them. Just because exploitation of animals has been going on for a long time does not excuse it's continuance. If a horse drawn feature is wanted then there are far less ways to achieve this, not least landau carriages which have three added advantages, first there is no need for rails, secondly the work expected from the horse is less, thirdly they could be provided entirely by the private sector. I'm not the one who said it was "now" a problem, that was you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessTickle Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Spook There is a bloody big difference between cock fighting and a shire horse, which is bred to pull heavy weights, actually pulling a tram A pair of shires can pull over 40 ton Its not exploitation at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Git Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Let's ban horse ploughing matches, show jumping, horse racing, horse riding in general and seaside donkey rides while we're at it (it being pointless complaining) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sick Moon Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I can remember Jimmy Savile pulling a horse tram along the Promenade to show that it wasn't a huge strain on the horses. Is that all you saw him pulling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sick Moon Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Is it Shire horses on the trams? I thought not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTF Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Perhaps we should swap the horses for elephants and get bendy trams?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessTickle Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Is it Shire horses on the trams? I thought not. Possibly they are not pure bred, maybe 3/4. There also used to be one with a slash of white on its belly, which would have Clydesdale in it if it wasn't pure I'm fairly certain they had pure shires and Clydesdales - possibly as breeding stock, as there were a couple that used to be kept over the field from mine, that were connected to the trams. My point is that these are working horses, the vast majority are not leisure/ridden animals (though you used to be able to borrow some to ride over the winter). You need the pure bred shire/Clydesdale to cross. No one is going to keep a pure bred stallion if it doesn't have a job. They are not popular as a cross as a ridden horse - most people would go for a Irish Draught. The Suffolk can be a bit arsy, so again it wouldn't be your first choice to cross to ride, though you do get them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc.fixit Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 just curious why anyone bothers to read spooky.........I had him on ignore almost from the start of his ravings............really helps the blood pressure.lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paswt Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Dunno Doc ,I find his ravings comical, he pontificates ,for example about how employers should treat ( exploit ) their workforce to get the best return on capital employed despite the fact that during his working life he's not been an employer and is so intent on getting the most return on his property portfolio and then complains when tenants react badly. I may have it all wrong but I've always tried not to be too greedy and treated folk as I would like to be treated and most respond well , there is always the odd one who will see this as a sign of weakness and take the rise and then a robust response is entirely appropriate. David didn't create "david" every time , sometimes he ended up with a pile of rubble , when I've "cocked up" I don't mind admitting it , as long as you've had more 'winners' than losers you're ' in front' . Seems to me that Spookie may have what is known as "cognitive dissonance " and constantly has to justify his decision to move from the island and needs the island to fail and Norfolk succeed so he can tell anyone who will listen what a clever chap he is , and being a "man of the cloth" an ideal role model for us "lesser beings". As a 'leader' I could only envisage anyone following Spookie out of idle curiosity but I could be wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolina Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I thought this thread was about Horse trams being relocated on the walkway?? Not about horses-maybe I'm wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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