IOM Passport question

[Manximus Aururaneus]

Genuine question (for compliance reasons);

If an IOM passport office issued passport states on the photograph page 'British Citizen' what would the same 'Nationality' box read for an IOM born person?

Exact wording if possible please.

[John Wright]

British Citizen.

If the holder had all four grand parents and both parents born here, and had never lived in UK for 5 years or more, there’d be an endorsement stating holder not entitled to the EU establishment rights ( up until expiry of the transition period )

[Manximus Aururaneus]

Thank you 

[piebaps]

3 hours ago, John Wright said:

British Citizen.

If the holder had all four grand parents and both parents born here, and had never lived in UK for 5 years or more, there’d be an endorsement stating holder not entitled to the EU establishment rights ( up until expiry of the transition period )

I do indeed.

[The Old Git]

On 5/6/2020 at 5:21 PM, John Wright said:

If the holder had all four grand parents and both parents born here, and had never lived in UK for 5 years or more, there’d be an endorsement stating holder not entitled to the EU establishment rights ( up until expiry of the transition period )

I have the endorsement John, but my mother and her parents weren't born here. They weren't born in the UK either.

Should I complain / appeal?

 

 

[John Wright]

24 minutes ago, The Old Git said:

I have the endorsement John, but my mother and her parents weren't born here. They weren't born in the UK either.

Should I complain / appeal?

 

 

No idea. I gave the basic exception. I’m assuming you, your father and his parents were born on Island. If one of your mother or maternal grandparents was born in UK you qualified. But not if born elsewhere in EU.

Of course you may qualify for  Another EU  passport/right to establish.

[The Old Git]

Male side of family go back a long way. 
 

Mother’s and her side born in Eire. It’s not worth the bother now as the U.K. will presumably be fully out of EU before I can travel again but I hear what you and others say about parents and grandparents born in the IOM and that’s not the case in my passport stamp. 

[Declan]

Maybe you'd need to apply for an Irish passport to establish EU right to establish?

Your right to a British passport being established only by Manx people.

(although presumably if you are an Old Git your Irish Grandparents could have been born British citizens).

Edited May 8, 2020 by Declan

[The Old Git]

I was born here. 

Mother born in Ireland in 1926. No one to ask now but I think her father came over here to work in one of the holiday camps so the family naturally came to. Thinks she naturalised as British as a child. 

It’s all a bit academic now as presumably no British passport holder will have any rights in EU next year. 
 

it’s just what John says doesn’t match my experience. I assume I have the stamp because I wasn’t born in U.K. and neither were my parents or grandparents. Not that a they were all Manx born. 

[prism10]

You could just apply for Irish nationality if EU rights are important to you.

You certainly entitled to your Irish citizenship.

[The Old Git]

It's not.

When a lawyer says -

"If the holder had all four grand parents and both parents born here, and had never lived in UK for 5 years or more, there’d be an endorsement stating holder not entitled to the EU establishment rights ( up until expiry of the transition period )"

- I wonder why my passport has the endorsement when the above doesn't apply to me.

The passport page on the government website makes no mention of "all four grandparents and both parents born here"

https://www.gov.im/categories/travel-traffic-and-motoring/passports/manxman-and-islander-status/

 

 

 

 

[John Wright]

26 minutes ago, The Old Git said:

It's not.

When a lawyer says -

"If the holder had all four grand parents and both parents born here, and had never lived in UK for 5 years or more, there’d be an endorsement stating holder not entitled to the EU establishment rights ( up until expiry of the transition period )"

- I wonder why my passport has the endorsement when the above doesn't apply to me.

The passport page on the government website makes no mention of "all four grandparents and both parents born here"

https://www.gov.im/categories/travel-traffic-and-motoring/passports/manxman-and-islander-status/

 

 

 

 

What I said is correct and doesn’t contradict, and is not contradicted by, your situation or the government web site. It’s one, the main one, of the exceptions and is the one used for Manxman status. A full analysis would require pages and pages analysing the variations.

you only have to have one person out of the preceding two generations born in UK to lose the endorsement. 
 

But if there are 5 Manx forbears and one EU forbear it doesn’t work, because it’s the link with UK that counts for the EU connection.

Your Irish forbears would, at one time, have been UK citizens but that’s been stripped away by legislative changes in Nationalty legislation since 1947. You would probably be entitled to an Irish passport and be entitled to residence and establishment.

i suppose it’s a reflection of how far we’ve moved and how much more mobile we’ve become in the 50 years since Protocol 3 was drafted. In 1973 almost the only people affected would have those with 6 Manx parents and grandparents. Clearly not you. But now there are people with several non Manx forebears and not UK either. It’ll continue to remain as an ever increasingly anachronistic hold over for Manx passport holders who have residency status in EU countries post 31/12/2020 whenever they have to renew their ID or residential status.

[LetHimCook]

Thanks for sharing it! I'm applying for a British passport now too, and I had no clue that it can be so stressful.

[Bombay Bad Boy]

I was told that when you've lived on the Island for 5 years, and became a 'Manx Worker' (no longer in need of a work permit), that was the point where you lost EU residency and work rights. Course, that's a bit academic now.

[John Wright]

1 hour ago, Bombay Bad Boy said:

I was told that when you've lived on the Island for 5 years, and became a 'Manx Worker' (no longer in need of a work permit), that was the point where you lost EU residency and work rights. Course, that's a bit academic now.

That was never true