ballaughbiker Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I think it is very ill-advised to go to the papers with an apprently stupid allegation like this. If an employee has a significant case regarding an employer then surely due process leading to a tribunal of some sort would make it all public in a more factual sort of way. I'd say she has done her case no favours at all by this tactic although it is clear that there is a lot more to this than has been reported. Without all the facts, nobody who isn't immediately involved can come to any conclusion either way but I bet there's fault on both sides. The texts were stupid and illustrate the calibre of the manager and I regret to say that I think there are one or two managers here who really haven't got what it takes and wouldn't have such responsibility across. No matter what they do, they never get seriously disciplined and may even go on to serially mismanage over decades until they retire. It almost seems that some have protection from a 'guardian angel'. It also seems this has similarities to another recent case I've heard about that cost the taxpayer dearly in so many ways. One wonders when it appears to be the same Dept. too over a similar period. In that case the union were f.ing useless and justice was only achieved by not giving in to the apparent (imo and all that) various manipulating tactics of the managers involved. One then wonders how many other similar cases there might have been and why some of the management hierarchy all retired early on the same day a year or so back. Yeah, pure coincidence! I am guessing when I say both sides have probably been stupid but the management hierarchy (if not the line manager) really should know better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul_Peel Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 A text gives some degree of proof in this sort of situation where no other witness is present. We don't know for example if the text was sent to 'follow up' on a verbal discussion ... maybe something along the lines of "you can't work" / "I'm coming in anyway" sort of thing. In that kind of situation I'd send a text so as to be certain there was no misunderstanding or indeed that the other person could not claim to have misunderstood. From the implied time-frame ie. tomorrow there were no other communication options open to the manger. It would suggest that the manager highlighted the potential issue to the duty manager in on the Saturday as the situation was resolved quickly when Inglis arrived at work. Overall and without any other evidence I think its unfair to aim too much criticism at the manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 A text gives some degree of proof in this sort of situation where no other witness is present. We don't know for example if the text was sent to 'follow up' on a verbal discussion ... maybe something along the lines of "you can't work" / "I'm coming in anyway" sort of thing. In that kind of situation I'd send a text so as to be certain there was no misunderstanding or indeed that the other person could not claim to have misunderstood. Good point - there could have been a phone call prior to that text which put a context into the wording/tone of the message that is subsequently lost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Overall and without any other evidence I think its unfair to aim too much criticism at the manager. And the use of the words 'final warning' apparently used? This manager might just have been trying their best to communicate but sending a text using such words is imo entirely inappropriate if sent by either party. In fact I think texts are inappropriate in the context in any case. It is more understandable from the employee but the manager should know better and the onus is on them to act in a professional way. That said, we only have the report to go on in this particular case and many have said they hardly think it is the full story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addie Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 This is a mess. Mishandles by all concerned by the brief details available. But this is only the start of people splattering their personal problems online and to the media. Privacy and discretion seem lost to so many these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul_Peel Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 sending a text using such words is imo entirely inappropriate Why .... I'm not being contentious for the sake of it I just don't see why its a problem in this context. For sure there are messages that need to be given face to face (redundancy etc) but in this case, probably late at night, what other options did the manager have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Written warnings usually come with explanations of how and why an improvement in performance and/or behaviour is expected. I would imagine that a final written warning will require specific wording and have to be approved by HR etc. before being sent. Maybe all the HR procedures had been followed in this case, but the quoted message doesn't give that impression as it is pretty short and blunt. I don't see a problem with communicating via text (when you have a good working relationship) but disciplinary procedures via text is not healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I think that a manager communicating in this way, very likely 'out of hours' is asking for it especially if inappropriate words are used in haste. I should have ensured the employee knew the management requirements by using a more formal method and then done nothing until the employee made the next move. When they turned up for work when formally asked not to, there would then be ways to confirm exactly what was said, by whom, and in what manner to resolve that non-compliance. It's hardly a huge issue in the whole scheme of things but knee jerk responses by texts are imo unprofessional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 There is obviously more to this, and two sides to every story, but I don't see anything to justify the statement she was sacked because she had cancer. There was a returning to work plan after she'd had treatment, so it wasn't a case of 'sorry about the diagnosis, now off to the job centre with you'. Surely the newspaper would have been more accurate to say sacked after having cancer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillshepherd Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 i get the impression that though this person was deemed fit for light duties and a phased return to duty,she wanted the overtime option and enhanced pay to be included in this agreement,to me it looks like she has run up credit/bank debt and is looking for the manx tax payer to bail her out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebees Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 The poor lady has had cancer, a hysterectomy and personality clashes with people at work. That's really bad, I wouldn't like to think where her head is at, phffft! Hillshepherd, FFS man, how can you comment on her financial position? Thats a horrible thing to say (even if its true) & it's none of yours (or anybody else's) business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 it looks like she has run up credit/bank debt and is looking for the manx tax payer to bail her out. Has somebody dared you to post the most idiotic comment you can think of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dilligaf Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 The poor lady has had cancer, a hysterectomy and personality clashes with people at work. That's really bad, I wouldn't like to think where her head is at, phffft! Hillshepherd, FFS man, how can you comment on her financial position? Thats a horrible thing to say (even if its true) & it's none of yours (or anybody else's) business. T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebees Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 T? I do like tea, before I got sucked into MF I was about to make myself a cup of tea and work out which numbers were most likely to win the lottery this coming Saturday. I've an idea... Wrighty, can you have a little look at the previous winning numbers, do some statistical things and then PM me your predictions for the draw on Saturday? I'll pay you if I win Hey, we could make a Manx Forums syndicate, anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 T? I do like tea, before I got sucked into MF I was about to make myself a cup of tea and work out which numbers were most likely to win the lottery this coming Saturday. I've an idea... Wrighty, can you have a little look at the previous winning numbers, do some statistical things and then PM me your predictions for the draw on Saturday? I'll pay you if I win Hey, we could make a Manx Forums syndicate, anyone? Previous numbers have no impact on likely next numbers. If you want a statisticians response the answer is to pick unpopular numbers so that in the event you do win you don't share it with as many people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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