Andy Onchan Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 7 minutes ago, Derek Flint said: - which is all based on a TAM threat and risk assessment. Only Belfast has a dedicated force and that was for largely political reasons from the 1970s. I researched this in depth about 10 years ago. In terms of core role, much of what is done at Ronaldsway is guarding and security. They call the Constabulary to deal with more complex issues. It’s not that they don’t do a good job, it’s just the scope of the job doesn’t really necessitate a full warrant. Similar at Sea Terminal. The world has moved on. But only in the Isle of Man...Where You Can (think that you're owed a living regardless that someone else is paying for it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Wiser Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Derek Flint said: - which is all based on a TAM threat and risk assessment. Only Belfast has a dedicated force and that was for largely political reasons from the 1970s. I researched this in depth about 10 years ago. In terms of core role, much of what is done at Ronaldsway is guarding and security. They call the Constabulary to deal with more complex issues. It’s not that they don’t do a good job, it’s just the scope of the job doesn’t really necessitate a full warrant. Similar at Sea Terminal. The world has moved on. Are you still involved in the threat assessment at the airport? Do you not think things may have changed or moved on since your report 10 years ago? Have the number of 'bobbies on the beat' remained the same over the last 10 years? I'm reasonably sure that numbers have diminished - you only have to look around at the empty police stations to see that. What's the police response time going to be for example on a race day in TT Week or a busy Bank Holiday when there's someone 'kicking off' at the airport? Yes, the local police deal with matters off site, or where investigations are carried out off site, as airport staff warrants are limited to the airport property and surrounding roads, so they already don't have full warrants as you put it. But isn't that the same as fisheries officers, or harbour officers (not referring to Port Security). There's a role being fulfilled on behalf of the IOM Constabulary and if and when it goes, what message is that going to send in reassuring the travelling public, or to the chancer who is perhaps willing to take the risk. You of all people should know that the early steps in conflict management is to have a uniformed presence, not necessarily engaging, but just to be there. How many times have the local police been called to deal with an angry group of passengers who are told they can't travel (probably none) - sometimes planes don't go and when they don't, people get hacked off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lxxx Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Bud Wiser said: Are you still involved in the threat assessment at the airport? Do you not think things may have changed or moved on since your report 10 years ago? Have the number of 'bobbies on the beat' remained the same over the last 10 years? I'm reasonably sure that numbers have diminished - you only have to look around at the empty police stations to see that. What's the police response time going to be for example on a race day in TT Week or a busy Bank Holiday when there's someone 'kicking off' at the airport? Yes, the local police deal with matters off site, or where investigations are carried out off site, as airport staff warrants are limited to the airport property and surrounding roads, so they already don't have full warrants as you put it. But isn't that the same as fisheries officers, or harbour officers (not referring to Port Security). There's a role being fulfilled on behalf of the IOM Constabulary and if and when it goes, what message is that going to send in reassuring the travelling public, or to the chancer who is perhaps willing to take the risk. You of all people should know that the early steps in conflict management is to have a uniformed presence, not necessarily engaging, but just to be there. How many times have the local police been called to deal with an angry group of passengers who are told they can't travel (probably none) - sometimes planes don't go and when they don't, people get hacked off! I think you're missing the point. In times of high passenger numbers or a specific situation which might warrant extra security then you can move resources as and where they are needed. Like what happens in all lines of work in the real world. We don't need a bobby scratching his arse and chatting to what few passengers there are on a quiet Monday night in November until 9pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Wiser Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 13 minutes ago, Lxxx said: I think you're missing the point. In times of high passenger numbers or a specific situation which might warrant extra security then you can move resources as and where they are needed. Where will these resources come from on a daily basis? For example, the road at the front of the airport is no waiting without permission. Who is going to move vehicles on? All a contracted parking controller can do is issue a fine, so the driver sits in his or her vehicle and becomes a potential security threat and is then in contravention of a different bit of legislation that needs someone with a warrant to deal with. Is the local beat bobbie going to be available for every flight arrival? A traffic warden gets paid the same as the airport staff so no saving there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lxxx Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 26 minutes ago, Bud Wiser said: Where will these resources come from on a daily basis? For example, the road at the front of the airport is no waiting without permission. Who is going to move vehicles on? All a contracted parking controller can do is issue a fine, so the driver sits in his or her vehicle and becomes a potential security threat and is then in contravention of a different bit of legislation that needs someone with a warrant to deal with. Is the local beat bobbie going to be available for every flight arrival? A traffic warden gets paid the same as the airport staff so no saving there. We all get touchy when our job is under threat or faced with the potential for redeployment. You have my sympathy. However let's not overuse the words 'security threat' to justify your position though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Wiser Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 33 minutes ago, Lxxx said: We all get touchy when our job is under threat or faced with the potential for redeployment. You have my sympathy. However let's not overuse the words 'security threat' to justify your position though. Not getting touchy, just querying a statement about available resources, but I'm sure that those affected will appreciate your sympathy. I'm sure it's a crappy time for all involved! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paswt Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Bud Wiser said: Where will these resources come from on a daily basis? For example, the road at the front of the airport is no waiting without permission. Who is going to move vehicles on? All a contracted parking controller can do is issue a fine, so the driver sits in his or her vehicle and becomes a potential security threat and is then in contravention of a different bit of legislation that needs someone with a warrant to deal with. Is the local beat bobbie going to be available for every flight arrival? A traffic warden gets paid the same as the airport staff so no saving there. I would venture to suggest that the powers that be are more interested in creating a cash flow at the car park than anything else under the guise of 'security/"saving money" which was , at best, an interesting hypothesis That said the application of the decision to encourage drivers to use the car park does not seem to be universally applied . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asitis Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Bud Wiser said: Where will these resources come from on a daily basis? For example, the road at the front of the airport is no waiting without permission. Who is going to move vehicles on? All a contracted parking controller can do is issue a fine, so the driver sits in his or her vehicle and becomes a potential security threat and is then in contravention of a different bit of legislation that needs someone with a warrant to deal with. Is the local beat bobbie going to be available for every flight arrival? A traffic warden gets paid the same as the airport staff so no saving there. its a funny old no waiting order which says does not apply if you pay ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Wiser Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 23 minutes ago, asitis said: its a funny old no waiting order which says does not apply if you pay ! Oooh interesting - who pays and how do you arrange it? Might be useful when I'm picking family up !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 46 minutes ago, Bud Wiser said: Oooh interesting - who pays and how do you arrange it? Might be useful when I'm picking family up !! One more time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTF Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 5 hours ago, Bud Wiser said: Where will these resources come from on a daily basis? For example, the road at the front of the airport is no waiting without permission. Who is going to move vehicles on? All a contracted parking controller can do is issue a fine, so the driver sits in his or her vehicle and becomes a potential security threat and is then in contravention of a different bit of legislation that needs someone with a warrant to deal with. Is the local beat bobbie going to be available for every flight arrival? A traffic warden gets paid the same as the airport staff so no saving there. how does sitting a vehicle constitute a potential security threat? the car parks at the sea terminal are very close to the building and you can sit in them all day there?? so if you are on foot with a rucksack full of C4 and no vehicle you can stand in front of the airport all day and not be deemed to be a potential security threat and you get left alone ?? i'm guessing your middle names are 'non the' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Wiser Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, WTF said: i'm guessing your middle names are 'non the' Ha ha. I see what you did there ! Good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Helmut Fromage Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 5 hours ago, Lxxx said: We all get touchy when our job is under threat or faced with the potential for redeployment. You have my sympathy. However let's not overuse the words 'security threat' to justify your position though. The Airport has long been staffed by those from Port Erin that were too thick to get a job at the shoe factory or Strix but just smart enough to stay off the smack - it's more community care than Airport.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asitis Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 1 hour ago, WTF said: how does sitting a vehicle constitute a potential security threat? the car parks at the sea terminal are very close to the building and you can sit in them all day there?? so if you are on foot with a rucksack full of C4 and no vehicle you can stand in front of the airport all day and not be deemed to be a potential security threat and you get left alone ?? i'm guessing your middle names are 'non the' Not to mention the row of taxis parked next to the building, security measure my arse !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTeapot Posted April 5, 2019 Share Posted April 5, 2019 7 minutes ago, asitis said: Not to mention the row of taxis parked next to the building, security measure my arse !! If there is anyone unhinged enough to try to blow up the airport you'd put good money on a taxi driver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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