monasqueen Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Hey, it wasn't his plane full of books that didn't get offloaded on Sunday and had to came back again, was it What's his address, I'll let him have mine back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lao Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 All gets a bit mixed up, but my personal opinion is that any of this stuff should be allowed, but our governments should provide adequate information and education to make sure the people reading it are informed and aware of the source of the document. I'd rather make my own mind up, but I'm also aware there's many vulnerable that can't. i echo this sentiment, better education would make this discussion moot, and i too am aware of those that are vunerable to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Too many drama queens! Get a grip for Pete's sake. I can see no harm in it. If you don't want it, bin it. Simple. It's hardly an invitation to start another type of Waco seige! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulgarian Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 It's interesting that 40% of the people who have voted in the poll so far have chosen "No, it is a cult & should be discouraged". What sort of discouragement, i wonder, do they have in mind? Scientology is regarded as a cult because it is a relatively new religion with a weird belief system, but really it isn't much different in character from more established religions whose beliefs we are accustomed to, and so seem to us less weird. All major religions involve the belief in supernatural beings, along with some kind of afterlife, and when you think about it it's all fucking nonsense. So why should scientology be singled out for derision and, as some have suggested, censorship? It's just that we find their beliefs strange and sinister, but as cults go, Scientology is probably one of the least sinister. At worst they want you to part with some of your cash, but that's the intention of all the bits of glossy paper that we get in the post. And so far the leaflets have been perfectly innocuous in nature, without even a notion of proselytising intentions. We will have to see how it develops, however, as I don't believe this will be the end of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Now up until this afternoon everything I knew about Scientology came from South Park and a film called "Religulous" by Bill Maher. Having looked on Wikipedia i have come to the conclusion this mega Corp (sorry religion) is so far out there even George Lucas couldn't dream it up. And I know thetanfan is a troll, but having read about the hate campaigns that Scientologist have waged against people who have speaken out against the "Religion" it doesn't sound to far off the party line. My view when it comes to religion is... I'll come looking for you, not the other way round. What is next? Snippets of the Qur'an with a smiley face on the front cover? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lao Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 vulgarian you make a vaild point, so i would just like to set the record straight, i dont have some special dislike for scientology, whilst holding a special place in my heart for other religions. I think eventually they will all have to go, and its a last in first out policy. scientology is more dangerous as it can learn from the mistake written into the doctrine of the older scams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 To be honest its not got alot going for it: 1. Written by an ageing Sci-Fi writer. 2. Its all about the money. 3. Did I mention the money? Seems more like a Star Trek convention gone horribly wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieK Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 We can't as a society tell people what they can and can't read. Our only influence we should be allowed to exert is one of education and promotion of our own ideals. Kinda like what the Scientologists are trying to accomplish through a fairly innocuous looking pamphlet. Sure, but I don't really view this as telling people what they can and can't read. I'd prefer it if the mail system were not available as a means of mass proselytizing regardless of the church or organization. This really isn't limiting free speech any more than not allowing crazy preachers to bellow their message from every street corner happens to be, and in my view is in line with the accepted restrictions on the expression of free speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earwacs Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I regret the day that the evangelists came a knocking on my door to offer to discuss God with me, and I didn't try recruit them to my own Satan's New Church of Evil. I would have offered many temptations if they would denounce their god,.. from Judgement Day immunity including an Access-All-Areas pass for Paradise, to special voucher codes for booking Steam Packet sailings at a discount (internet booking only). *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Too many drama queens! Get a grip for Pete's sake. I can see no harm in it. If you don't want it, bin it. Simple. It's hardly an invitation to start another type of Waco seige! I'd rather it was more up front about where it's from and what it's trying to achieve. This has been deliberately made to look like it's not anything to do with religion, it even says on the back that it's definitely nothing to do with religion, and yet it is. It's funded by Scientology, and it forms part of their teachings. This is a thin end of a wedge, fortunately most of us can spot it as that, but many won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 we would be grateful if Lao and thebees would edit their posts, as we are sure they did not intentionally mean to propagate the lies spread about our church. Interesting that your first contribution to a thread in which a sizeble number of posts are saying that your group shouldn't be denied free speech is to try and deny that right to others. (incidently didn't IOM Newspapers used to give out Ron L. Hubburd books in kids competitions?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Roo Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Please don't bin this shit if it comes through your door, do what I did, send it back to them in an envelope without a stamp, hit them in the wallet. I like this idea best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I certainly think it is weirder than the older religions, but not my much. And I think the behaviour of scientologists who want to silence free speech is concerning, but we can't stop scientologists. If people want to immerse themselves in such beliefs then that is up to them. I think it is a bit too easy to see it is as a cult and then think it is wrong for just that fact. It is just a shame that we live in a society where we are bombarded with ideas of a supreme being/s in the first place or even ideas of spirituality, souls, and mysticism whereas there is little education that offers the means to take a logical and rational approach to things. Seems more like a Star Trek convention gone horribly wrong. Star Treks better written though. All hail V'Ger! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparx Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I'm dodging the free speech debate here, just for a moment. Yes, this is only a small booklet through your door, yes you can just ignore it. What about when they start trying to get scientology books into the schools here? I know that is about as likely as elvis getting my niece pregnant but knowing these criminal cultist degenerates that's probably on their list of things to do here. Given even the smallest amount of support for them over here they will undoubtedly try to set up shop, then the preying on the vunerable will start. Just like in the USA they will prey on the most vunerable people, the clinicaly depressed, the old. I've seen numerous tales of scientology fleecing people for just about every penny they have, using the same tired line of "Auditing may help you to lead a happier and more productive life". Then what? How long will it take before we have our very own Lisa McPherson. Free speech is all well and good, but when it starts putting peoples lives at risk and is used soley to help a corrupt and sinister organisation line its silken pockets you really have to ask yourself if it's really worth letting everyone have their say. (Note: I am not putting scientology in the same group as religions because I do not consider it to be a religion, nor will I ever consider it to be a religion. You cannot compare religions that have been around for over a thousand years to a cult formed by a deraged science fiction writer in the early 50s You can call it a "new religion" till the cows call to say they're coming home, but in truth, its a money making scam.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (Note: I am not putting scientology in the same group as religions because I do not consider it to be a religion, nor will I ever consider it to be a religion. You cannot compare religions that have been around for over a thousand years to a cult formed by a deraged science fiction writer in the early 50s You can call it a "new religion" till the cows call to say they're coming home, but in truth, its a money making scam.)You can compare. One is just older and the other is a racket. But they are certainly religion and their beliefs are equally are ridiculous. Mormonism is considered religion, have you read about how that started?Christian beliefs are just as potty as well. Free speech is all well and good, but when it starts putting peoples lives at risk and is used soley to help a corrupt and sinister organisation line its silken pockets you really have to ask yourself if it's really worth letting everyone have their say. I can make so many comparisons with government here, but as with government, I am less concerned about those who use the vulnerable and uneducated to line their pockets than I do about those who use control to increase their power. And yes, free speech must be protected - riducule religion and subject it to the criticism and disdain it deserved using your free speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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