Chinahand Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 EG - just one question - if the IOM government didn't support the TT the cost for entry would be higher - and so fewer people would enter. So the number of deaths is important in considering public policy concerning the TT as the IOM Government maintains an acceptable level of death. If they threw more money at competitors no doubt more would come and more would die. Their choice of course, but our Taxes. As a tax payer I have a right to be concerned about the government supporting an event of such size that deaths are guaranteed year in year out. To take things to a ridiculous extreme: if only 4 people were allowed to race each year - you of course couldn't guarantee they'd be no deaths, but over a 20 year period statistically it is highly likely the absolute number of deaths would be alot lower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chief Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 People who are commenting have to realise that all forms motorsport both 2 wheeled and 4 are dangerous, the rush is part of the reason people do it, yes they do not expect to die when they start a race but to a man or woman they know the risks and still willingly participate. I do not believe that any of them are forced against their will to race, they do it because they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnyrotten Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Some sports are dangerous. Mountain climbing is clearly perilous for obvious reasons, but believe it or not, fishing is the most dangerous sport of all thanks to the large numbers of individuals who become inebriated and fall in the water, and also to those who cast their line overhead and snag 100,000 volts up the right arm. But we recognise the right of individuals to express free will and continue to pursue their strange personal quests. In many instances we have organisations in place which provide infrastructure and facilities for people to pursue their interests, but who have an implied legal responsibility (a duty of care) to make it as safe as it can possibly be. Motor racing is a perfect example of a sport which has, over the years, responded to danger by the provision of increased safety measures in circuit design and construction, run-off areas and impact-absorbing barriers. Except on the Isle of Man, where racers compete in conditions which haven't really changed since the fifties, apart from a few yards of token airfence on a course of almost 38 miles. And what you will not find in mountain climbing or fishing, is a state-sponsored and organised competition which ENCOURAGES people to participate in conditions which are known to be more dangerous than those which exist elsewhere, partly for glory and in some cases for money. So comparison between them and the TT is statistically invalid. Apples and oranges. On the Isle of Man you have a unique situation whereby the government which is responsible for enforcing health and safety standards is providing the infrastructure, capital and prize money for an event which is far beyond the normal H & S considerations and is demonstrably and provably far more dangerous than other forms of motorcycle racing. (These statistics have been mulled over countless times on this forum and the mathematics always come down to the same thing - 231 deaths multiplied and divided by laps, riders miles or minutes, it doesn't matter, it's undeniable.) The fact is that the Manx Government supports and promotes the TT because it promotes the name of the Isle of Man on a worldwide basis and because it brings in revenue. It's a profit centre, and the dangers are weighed against income. Tombstone accounting by any other name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 I am pretty sure that more people have died climbing Mount Everest than have died in the MGP/TT. At the end of 2009 216 people have died climbing Everest. At the end of 2008 Everest had been climb 4,102 times. So no. More people have died competeing in the TT. Making the TT more dangerous than climbing Everest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 People who are commenting have to realise that all forms motorsport both 2 wheeled and 4 are dangerous, the rush is part of the reason people do it, yes they do not expect to die when they start a race but to a man or woman they know the risks and still willingly participate. I do not believe that any of them are forced against their will to race, they do it because they want to. Just for comparison: Tour de France 11 deaths since 1910 Formula One 25 deaths since 1954 Summer/Winter Olympics (combined/all events) deaths 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilitantDogOwner Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Base jumping / sky diving / scuba diving. Name one base jumping / sky diving / scuba diving event that is state sponsored/televised/marketed as the base jumping / sky diving / scuba diving capital of the world. Name an event for those sports that has the same number of competitors competing in one event at one time. Apples and oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overdose Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Just for comparison: Paris Dakar 61 deaths since 1979. Also let's not forget the Nürburgring which can have upto 13 fatalities a year, and that's classed as a public highway too..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 I am pretty sure that more people have died climbing Mount Everest than have died in the MGP/TT. At the end of 2009 216 people have died climbing Everest. At the end of 2008 Everest had been climb 4,102 times. So no. More people have died competeing in the TT. Making the TT more dangerous than climbing Everest. Again, how many people have died competing in the TT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Formula One 25 deaths since 1954 43 since 1950 actually - I'll name them all if you like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 but believe it or not, fishing is the most dangerous sport of all thanks to the large numbers of individuals who become inebriated and fall in the water, and also to those who cast their line overhead and snag 100,000 volts up the right arm. Get away with you. How many professional sports fishermen have died in competitions? How many spectators have died copying their heroes? How many people do you know have died catching trout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Again, how many people have died competing in the TT? 231. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 At the Indianapolis 500 54 racers, team and track personnel have been killed since 1911. Plus, there have been 8 spectator deaths, including a 12-year-old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Again, how many people have died competing in the TT? 231. That includes the 99 deaths from the Manx Grand Prix as well though, not just TT. So it's actually 132 for the TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overdose Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Formula One 25 deaths since 1954 43 since 1950 actually - I'll name them all if you like He's probably omitted the Qualifying and Testing fatalities to make his figures sound better though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
censorship Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 He's probably omitted the Qualifying and Testing fatalities to make his figures sound better though.... He has. If the facts don't support your view, change the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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