In fact . . . Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Let's follow Edinburgh They're spending twice as much (and more probably) and getting half the scheme they were originally promised for their "modern tram" system. It was beset with problems all along the way. And is, of course, years late. We could do the same if didn't mind the tax bill. Or, if we really believe that more public transport will help Douglas's congestion (it's all relative, try going to Barcelona, Monaco, London etc for real congestion), we could try putting a few buses on the suggested tram routes first and see if they make any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempus Fugit Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 maybe we needMercedes trams? we could dig up the North Quay as well and run tram tracks down there (can you imagine the junction at Banks Hill with tram tracks crossing it as well ? talk about nobody wanting to go to work on the trams, I used to get the first tram out of Derby Castle at 7am and was in Ramsey at 8.15, and it cost me £3.15s 0d (3 pounds 15 shillings) for a 3 months apprentice contract (= 29p per week !) the best thing was getting the back seat over the heater ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hboy Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 http://www.manxtube.com/video/3667/Douglas-prom-2 If the promenade roadway is going to be refurbished and the tram track moved then we would be absolutely crazy not to take a once in century opportunity to ensure that if it does prove possible to bring the trams right into town, to the shops, offices and the entertainment facilities, at some point in the future then we should prepare for that eventuality when and where we can. Finishing the tram track where it does, at the edge of town, was always the wrong thing to have done but was, at the time, more related to thousands of visitors promenading down to the exisiting terminus station and being happy to do so. No doubt there will be those who wish to jump right down my throat for what I have said here but before they do so I would ask them to take into account that the trams and the buses from the north are to some extent competing with each other with both losing very considerable sums of money each year whilst doing so. Meanwhile Douglas gets ever more congested and the cost of petrol keeps going up and up and up............. So i take it from your reply Chris that you agree that in the biggest recession since the 30's when we are losing over £75m a year in public finances with further cuts to come that we should still bankroll this sort of grandiose lunacy scheme when we are making school teachers redundant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugger Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I thought this bloke was meant to be one of the few MHKs with a clue. Jesus H Christ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 No one on here seems to be explaining just how running the Trams and Trains along the Prom would relieve traffic congestion. Surely to do that these trams would have to run through Dlas to Pulrose, Willaston Onchan and Farmhill? Is that really viable? Even with modern commuter vehicles, I don't think so. Tescos' home delivery service probably does more to relieve congestion than this would. In our current financial flux, maybe we should even put the Prom regeneration on hold but if we do start this, £20mil, for the whole Prom, maybe we should do away with the loss making Horse Trams and allow a private company to offer horse drawn carriage rides to the Tourists, that would save Dlas and the Govt some money year on year. Come on some one, how would these tram extensions help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tugger Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Douglas doesn't have traffic congestion requiring this sort of drastic action. It's a bit busy for half an hour twice a day. Travel earlier or later if it is causing you that much grief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hboy Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I thought this bloke was meant to be one of the few MHKs with a clue. Jesus H Christ I really don't think they get it do they? The money has run out. The time to do this was 15 years ago and not now. But when we had the money we wasted hundreds of millions of it on pumping shit uphill to Santon and building incinerators that we didn't need and employing another 1000 clipboard users in various government departments who do absolutely jackshit of benefit to anything but their own careers. You have to remember that Chris is in East Douglas and therefore this will be money spent on his turf so it's a good vote puller. I do think Chris is a good MHK and that a lot of what he says makes sense but anyone just looking at this can only conclude that when we are cutting back in other areas we really can't afford this hopeless window dressing exercise. And I agree with Kopek, we should be giving the horse trams and the loss making MER the bullet in order to save more money rather than subscribing to this lunacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkydevil Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 You're all missing a trick here. Every tacky seaside resort has one. Commuters would love it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hboy Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 You're all missing a trick here. Every tacky seaside resort has one. Commuters would love it! Exactly, bin the horsetrams and the MER and slick a fibre glass train top over a 1978 Ford Escort and lash on a couple of trailers on the back and you've saved at least £5m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 What Hboy and Tugger said. Chris Robertshaw is living in La La Land. Jesus...The ships sinking, and meanwhile he's working on how to spend a few dozen extra £millions painting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieK Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 No one on here seems to be explaining just how running the Trams and Trains along the Prom would relieve traffic congestion. Surely to do that these trams would have to run through Dlas to Pulrose, Willaston Onchan and Farmhill? That's what I was wondering as well. Judging by the 2001 census about 65% of those who come from outside Douglas and Onchan to work in Douglas do so from the South and the West. Once you throw in traffic from the South, West, and North of Douglas (none of whom are likely to use the tram) I really don't see what this idea is really supposed to achieve. This sounds an awful lot like people confusing the novelty of an idea with its worth. Chris, is your support for this idea based on anything like analysis of the traffic in Douglas, the concentration of workplaces relative to the residence of the people working there relative to the location of tram stops, and in particular where and in which direction congestion is most frequent and chronic? I ask because I'm having a hell of a time trying to identify a scheme of reasoning underpinning the idea other than: 1. Traffic jams 2. ????????? 3. Trams! 4. ???????? 5. Problem solved. Pats on the back all round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt W E Johns Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I despair about this Island sometimes; our poverty of imagination Mr Robertshaw is quite right to propose such a scheme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Sorry Mr Robertshaw, but this sounds like an answer to those "What will you do for your constituency?" questions. To which the answer always ought to be "Nothing stupid", but usually ends up in a desperate grab for whichever pet project some senior civil servant has taken a fancy to. Of course the voters are really to blame for being so parochial and short-sighted in the first place. Mind you with the cost of electricity as it will be, maybe we should look at converting the MER to horses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hboy Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I despair about this Island sometimes; our poverty of imagination Mr Robertshaw is quite right to propose such a scheme No it's true poverty, as in us having no money to indulge in this sort of lunacy. What would you prefer £20m plus to be spent on (ignoring the inevitable overspend of at least 50% on these sort of schemes)? Health, education and diversifying the economy or on this overblown grandiose rubbish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieK Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I despair about this Island sometimes; our poverty of imagination Mr Robertshaw is quite right to propose such a scheme Someone who defends a proposal with so glib a statement like that has no right to complain about the impoverishment of other people's imagination. In any case, imagination is worthless if the idea is simply not very good. So rather than feign world weary condescension, try defending and justifying the idea to those who'll be paying for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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