The weeks most incompatible news headlines?

[notwell]

Coppers with outside interests - isn't one allegedly involved in bringing over high end sports car tourists?

[BossHogg]

Coppers with outside interests - isn't one allegedly involved in bringing over high end sports car tourists?

Not allegedly he had a LinkedIn page advertising it up until recently.

[ManxTaxPayer]

high end sports car tourists?

 

 

Bell end.

[notwell]

Yeh, some of them are I agree.

[thommo2010]

While I appreciate there is a debate to be had about cannabis, it is a shame that every thread about policing seems to come back to that same point when there are other issues of great importance.

Personally, I think Isle of Man Constabulary is in dire and urgent need of external, independent review, much the same as Noble's Hospital is undergoing. A distinct lack of leadership in recent years has created organisation-wide issues which are worsened by a lack of talent, skill, commitment and sensible resource use (more drones anyone?).

It often appears there are longer-serving officers who are counting down the days to retirement, or preparing for their post-police career, rather than ensuring they keep training current, demonstrate a commitment to their work which reflects the level of pay and pass on their experience to more junior officers. It also appears the organisation struggles to attract good enough candidates to join its ranks and this, coupled with the lack of leadership and support from senior officers, results in some frankly awful frontline policing and decision making.

The chocolate orange is case in point. A member of the public reported the discovery of some confectionary to the police. No problem there. But does it not reflect a lack of common sense and judgment that someone decided this warranted the time and effort of issuing a media release? just hold onto the property until the owner comes looking. This is hardly an isolated incident and it is not only worrying that so little common sense is apparent across the Constabulary given the importance of the job being done, but also of concern that junior officers appear to have no guidance from senior officers on matters such as media relations and there is no process in place to offer oversight of decision making.

This incident is only a small thing but is symptomatic of failings across the organisation which have extremely serious consequences. How many times are we going to see charges withdrawn at the 11th hour in court, or charges changed during the process, or people sent to prison wrongly, due to clear failings? If you think this isn't happening, and going to happen more and more, just pick up the newspaper and read some court reports. I'm sure many of you can link to reports reflecting this.

Leadership, oversight, training, recruitment, motivation of long-serving officers and, most importantly, simply getting the basics of this vital job right, all need to be the subject of a thorough, independent and urgent external review before Isle of Man Constabulary does any more damage to our nation.

The starting pay for a police officer is around 20 grand. I doubt there are many experienced people out there who possibly with families would take a pay cut to deal with drunks and constant criticism.

[thommo2010]

Coppers with outside interests - isn't one allegedly involved in bringing over high end sports car tourists?

police officers have to declare any outside work whether it's paid or not that includes things like volunteering to coach kids at sports etc. they are allowed to pursue other jobs as long as it doesn't affect their work or conflict.

[notwell]

 

Coppers with outside interests - isn't one allegedly involved in bringing over high end sports car tourists?

police officers have to declare any outside work whether it's paid or not that includes things like volunteering to coach kids at sports etc. they are allowed to pursue other jobs as long as it doesn't affect their work or conflict.

 

The bringing over of high powered sports car owners/enthusiasts (which is going to end very badly at some point) must be a conflict of interest?

They regularly break the law when here too. Some of their driving is dangerous - just a question of time before it goes tits up.

Whilst we have plenty of idiots on the road already it is hard to see how this type of "business" isn't a conflict.

[Inspector Derek Flint]

 

 

Coppers with outside interests - isn't one allegedly involved in bringing over high end sports car tourists?

police officers have to declare any outside work whether it's paid or not that includes things like volunteering to coach kids at sports etc. they are allowed to pursue other jobs as long as it doesn't affect their work or conflict.

 

The bringing over of high powered sports car owners/enthusiasts (which is going to end very badly at some point) must be a conflict of interest?

They regularly break the law when here too. Some of their driving is dangerous - just a question of time before it goes tits up.

Whilst we have plenty of idiots on the road already it is hard to see how this type of "business" isn't a conflict.

 

That'll be me then.

 

This has been mentioned a couple of times, so probably worth putting the record straight. I was - up until the point I took on the Roads Policing Portfolio, director of a company, and the company model was indeed to organise supercar visits to the Isle of Man, but with an emphasis on closed road, and track driving - therefore addressing the criticism that is levelled at some visitors. With my new position in the Constabulary there was a risk that a conflict would arise with regard to road closures, en route transgressions of road traffic law being allegedly overlooked etc. Outside interests are continually reviewed by the Job, and this was one that could not continue. That's hopefully provided a bit of clarity.

 

'Censorship' writes about officers preparing for retirement. I think most of us hope that when we go, we will continue to contribute to the Island, either in business, charity or public service in a different role. This can't be to the detriment of the Job however; maintaining CPD and accreditation is becoming a bigger and bigger part of policing, as throughout the British Isles moves are made to further professionalise the service. Just last year I sat extensive re-accreditation in respect of my armed policing responsibilities. So none of us take our foot off the gas.

 

Finally, a comment about the 'Chocolate Orange'. As most of you know, I'm responsible for overseeing the PR/media output of the Constabulary. The more serious stuff tends to come through me, but every officer is empowered to deal with the press. Part of the joy of the Isle of Man is that sometimes we are still able to publish the 'shaggy dog' type of release, where someone has called us with something that would just get lost in the fog in pretty much any other jurisdiction. There are times when releases like this are just 'the right thing to do'. They take a minute, and really keep the place in proper perspective. Meanwhile, officers are out there at all hours, ensuring that people can sleep peaceably in their beds, keeping it so that the majority of the public have little to worry about. And where the most vulnerable need our help, we are there to do our best for them.

[thebees]

You could save lots of money on clothes, those uniforms are starting to get a bit silly. A bit more Hollywood drama than local bobby, y'know?

[censorship]

 

While I appreciate there is a debate to be had about cannabis, it is a shame that every thread about policing seems to come back to that same point when there are other issues of great importance.

Personally, I think Isle of Man Constabulary is in dire and urgent need of external, independent review, much the same as Noble's Hospital is undergoing. A distinct lack of leadership in recent years has created organisation-wide issues which are worsened by a lack of talent, skill, commitment and sensible resource use (more drones anyone?).

It often appears there are longer-serving officers who are counting down the days to retirement, or preparing for their post-police career, rather than ensuring they keep training current, demonstrate a commitment to their work which reflects the level of pay and pass on their experience to more junior officers. It also appears the organisation struggles to attract good enough candidates to join its ranks and this, coupled with the lack of leadership and support from senior officers, results in some frankly awful frontline policing and decision making.

The chocolate orange is case in point. A member of the public reported the discovery of some confectionary to the police. No problem there. But does it not reflect a lack of common sense and judgment that someone decided this warranted the time and effort of issuing a media release? just hold onto the property until the owner comes looking. This is hardly an isolated incident and it is not only worrying that so little common sense is apparent across the Constabulary given the importance of the job being done, but also of concern that junior officers appear to have no guidance from senior officers on matters such as media relations and there is no process in place to offer oversight of decision making.

This incident is only a small thing but is symptomatic of failings across the organisation which have extremely serious consequences. How many times are we going to see charges withdrawn at the 11th hour in court, or charges changed during the process, or people sent to prison wrongly, due to clear failings? If you think this isn't happening, and going to happen more and more, just pick up the newspaper and read some court reports. I'm sure many of you can link to reports reflecting this.

Leadership, oversight, training, recruitment, motivation of long-serving officers and, most importantly, simply getting the basics of this vital job right, all need to be the subject of a thorough, independent and urgent external review before Isle of Man Constabulary does any more damage to our nation.

The starting pay for a police officer is around 20 grand. I doubt there are many experienced people out there who possibly with families would take a pay cut to deal with drunks and constant criticism.

 

And if I'd said anything about new recruits needing to be experienced people you might have a point. But I didn't, I said 'good enough candidates' which means people who are up to the job, not necessarily experienced. In a well-managed organisation starters would benefit from the experience of more senior colleagues, but I don't think that happens.

I thnk most people would consider £20k a decent starting salary compared with some professions, but if the 'low' wages are putting 'good' people off applying, then the force needs to be doing much more to explain the career prospects, longer-term financial benefits and positive aspects of the job. Not that there currently are any - what sort of professional would want to be associated with this organisation at the moment?

[censorship]

 

 

Finally, a comment about the 'Chocolate Orange'. As most of you know, I'm responsible for overseeing the PR/media output of the Constabulary. The more serious stuff tends to come through me, but every officer is empowered to deal with the press. Part of the joy of the Isle of Man is that sometimes we are still able to publish the 'shaggy dog' type of release, where someone has called us with something that would just get lost in the fog in pretty much any other jurisdiction. There are times when releases like this are just 'the right thing to do'. They take a minute, and really keep the place in proper perspective. Meanwhile, officers are out there at all hours, ensuring that people can sleep peaceably in their beds, keeping it so that the majority of the public have little to worry about. And where the most vulnerable need our help, we are there to do our best for them.

 

Derek, as someone with the extensive PR experience you have should know, allowing one of your 'comedy' press releases to go out in the same period as your Chief Constable is claiming resources are stretched to breaking point makes you look like a disorgansied, disconnected, poorly managed joke of an organisation, which is at least reflecting some honest self-awareness I suppose. I notice that in your response you are happy to defend Derek Flint Incorporated, officers preparing for retirement and the incredibly poor judgment displayed in your fun-filled media release, but you avoid any comment on the force management, or lack of, the quality of young officers and the standard of evidence-gathering, case management and investigation I mentioned. Is that tacit agreement?

[thebees]

It's not just the police though, I was only saying similar to MrBees this morning, I remember when you had to be good to work for the corpy, the post office/British Telecom etc. now there's a hierarchy of muppets everywhere you look.

[Inspector Derek Flint]

A student officer has an extensive classroom phase, and then spends ten weeks under the tutelage of an experienced constable. During their first two years, they are closely monitored and reviewed, under the guidance of their section sergeant, and the overview of the training staff.

 

I think we had 48 applicants for the most recent recruitment drive, and they are going through the selection process at the moment. Interest in the Job goes in fits and starts. I remember back in 2002-3 we had a huge problem recruiting locally, and then on other occasions we've had 140+ applications for vacancies.

 

Its not a job for everyone, and to the 'millennial' generation, 35 years in the same profession is an alien concept. Its going to be one of the real modern challenges for professions that rely heavily on that experience 'Censorship' so correctly highlights.

[llap]

I'd like to see the IOM Constabulary or a lobby group of police officers call on the politicians to legalise or decriminalise cannabis. I think you'd see a double digit percentage reduction in workload.

[censorship]

Its not a job for everyone, and to the 'millennial' generation, 35 years in the same profession is an alien concept. Its going to be one of the real modern challenges for professions that rely heavily on that experience 'Censorship' so correctly highlights.

I'm sure once they realise that as soon as they get out of uniform and into a 'detective' (defective?) role they can put their feet up, do the absolute minimum, get it wrong more often than right, always without consequence, and coast to a rich retirement you'll have no problem recruiting. As a loyal officer, you'll of course defend your colleagues, but as a human you must roll your eyes and mutter 'not again' when you hear about another botched investigation leading to an embarrassing climbdown in court, or worse a civil case for false imprisonment, for example. It makes the force a joke in society, makes a mockery of the so-called justice system and is bound to put off anyone with even a modicum of self-respect from wanting to work there.