"Wake up and smell the coffee!"

[Max Power]

Chris Thomas sounds a warning...

http://www.iomtoday.co.im/article.cfm?id=33313&headline=Population+drop%3A+'Wake+up+and+smell+the+coffee%2C'+says+Minister&sectionIs=NEWS&searchyear=2017

 

[thebees]

There are more than enough people here, the roads are busy, the doctors are busy & the schools are busy. I heard there is already a shortage of useful 20 somethings, now there's a surprise...

[Non-Believer]

Stable doors, bolting horses and late closures might be applicable...?

[JackCarter]

25 minutes ago, thebees said:

There are more than enough people here, the roads are busy, the doctors are busy & the schools are busy. I heard there is already a shortage of useful 20 somethings, now there's a surprise...

There are loads of people here. The roads are congested, nobody can get a doctors appointment etc. it's just that none of them pay any fucking tax. 

 

[TheTeapot]

Everyone pays tax. Its more certain than death.

[JackCarter]

3 minutes ago, TheTeapot said:

Everyone pays tax. Its more certain than death.

Sorry, none of them pay any meaningful tax in proportion to what they take out of the system by way of services. 

 

[Barlow Strada]

all governmént employees pay tax but they äre päid from taxes.

it's like a big ßnake eäting its täil. then being siĉk and eating that too

 

[guzzi]

If your economic well being is predicated on a growing tax base, but that tax base is in fact falling and not growing, then you have a problem.  The last government, and this one as far as I can tell, had a 'plan' to effectively 'farm' immigrants in order to milk them for taxes. Then, there is the variant on that which tries to attract high net worth individuals on the basis of tax-capping. Again, that must surely depend on a constant drip-feed of such HNW individuals coming here.

As others have commented, the infrastructure seems to be creaking trying to cope with the people who are here, so perhaps the government's policies didn't take account of the need to grow infrastructure alongside a rising population, and said rising population got pissed off and departed.

If things continue as they are, servicing the PS pension liability will outstrip tax revenue and there will be sweet FA to do anything else with.

Smelling the coffee might fall short as a metaphor, perhaps recognizing that we are falling from the top floor of a skyscraper muttering 'so far, so good' might be closer to the truth.

[notwell]

It's inevitable that tax rises are coming.

But it needs to be at the lower level . If the population is transitioning to migrant lower paid wage earners draining resource then the only way to change that is to ensure tax bites earlier.

It'll be another year or two but it's coming.

[Shake me up Judy]

Excellent post that Guzzi.

Notwell: How much more tax do you think the lower level can stand and how would you raise it ? Would it increase the overall tax take or would it rob Peter to pay Paul by taking money out of the economy to fund government deficits and to underwrite government inefficiency? Remember that lower earners spend proportionately more of their income and it might just be them that are keeping the economy going. There's just as good an argument for lowering taxes for low earners.

[hboy]

12 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said:

Excellent post that Guzzi.

Notwell: How much more tax do you think the lower level can stand and how would you raise it ? Would it increase the overall tax take or would it rob Peter to pay Paul by taking money out of the economy to fund government deficits and to underwrite government inefficiency? Remember that lower earners spend proportionately more of their income and it might just be them that are keeping the economy going. There's just as good an argument for lowering taxes for low earners.

As survey after survey has shown the highest average earning group in the IOM is the public sector. On average most people in the private sector earn less than the equivalent public sector role. A lot of the people who have come over here in the last 15 years to work in the local private sector aren't high earners at all. If they had been then we would be in a different position. But they aren't. Many are in relatively low paid employment but still using our roads / hospitals / schools / local amenities etc. The response so far has been to try to tax this group disproportionately through stealth taxes which won't work as they can only afford to pay so much. The failure, and it has been a monmental failure, has been in the tax cap and HNWI strategy, and in bringing over higher paid workers who will pay higher levels of tax and start businesses that will employ people etc. People in those categories haven't come here in sufficient numbers at all and now the Island is looking sad and neglected they won't either as there are much nicer places to live in the world when you have a good job and a few quid. The answer can't possibly be - tax the poor more as if we tax the rich they'll all leave as the lower earners can't afford to pay much more. Our whole economy exists just to fund the public sector. That's where you start balancing the books - headcount, pay, pensions all have to be cut. 

[notwell]

It isn't really about proportion spending. It's actual spending that matters.

We won't have much choice.  In four years either we are raising more tax naturally  (I. E tax is broadly the same rates but more people are paying) or we will have to raise taxes.  The pension funding is the issue that isn't disappearing sadly.

Whilst some decent paying jobs are being created I don't think it is at the rate or volume required .

I'm not saying I agree with tax rises by the way. It just seems inevitable to me.

[guzzi]

More tax income required, you say?Well, see the thread 'End the War on Drugs'.

[Donald Trumps]

Our tax base isnt enough to pay for the size of our government

[NoTail]

I suspect that Donald Trumps is right. So the questions that come to me are.

Should Government be "reduced"? The President on the radio the other day seemed quite sanguine about this. Government has to paid for etc. I get the impression that those in power believe they have a right to a given life style which we, the people need to pay for.

Should the taxpayer pay more Tax? The current Government seems to feel that this is the necessary cost, as long as the burden rests on the poor section of society.  This is because our very existence is reliant on the idea that we provide a haven for rich people to live here without having to pay (much) tax. 

Given the questions above, is our society fundamentally flawed?  I think so, some even think it is corrupt.

Are there any easy solutions to our problems? Not that I can see. I  am considering selling up and relocating.