Future of sea services up for debate

[woolley]

 

Peel Ports really don't like spending their own money do they?

 

Not if Liverpool's dump of an airport is anything to go by.

[Tempus Fugit]

Tynwald will be a bit sick if SPCo abandon Liverpool

[Non-Believer]

We (IoM) need to be very, very careful here. Those advocating not rushing into the purchase of Half Tide in Liverpool may well be right.

 

We can't be dictated to what or what not we can put through a port terminal essential to the Island that we've BOUGHT and PAID for. I don't think there's a lot of generosity in Peel Holding's make up, somehow. The conditions need to be pulled apart and examined. By people knowledgeable and qualified.

[Donald Trumps]

Some expert on the national broadcaster said there's bog all there where this new docking facility is proposed

[asitis]

The steam packet has very little debt, it was mainly written off in a restructuring exercise some years ago and more has been paid off since.

 

Dont you mean it was hidden in a multitude of structures above the operating company ?

Absolutely correct the debt was moved into another company and I believe a share issue was undertaken, either way in reality, apart from accountants speak the debt has gone nowhere !

[John Wright]

The steam packet has very little debt, it was mainly written off in a restructuring exercise some years ago and more has been paid off since.

Dont you mean it was hidden in a multitude of structures above the operating company ?

Absolutely correct the debt was moved into another company and I believe a share issue was undertaken, either way in reality, apart from accountants speak the debt has gone nowhere !

 

No, what I said was correct. Third party external debt was eliminated by write off almost entirely. Debt owed to the shareholder bank has been substantially repaid. But, hey don't let that ruin a good conspiracy theory.

 

The bank isn't allowed to hide debt like that and given the state of the Portuguese banking industry it's been crawled over and examined and re examined to ensure it meets banking stress tests.

 

If it had all that debt would they be thinking of, or able to, spending on 2 new boats?

[Donald Trumps]

Surely the first question that needs answering is:

 

Can Douglas harbour be enlarged or in some way altered to offer facilities for visiting liners and larger freight carrying ferries?

[TheTeapot]

And the answer is yes.

 

The second question should be how?

 

That's when things get difficult.

[monasqueen]

This is why Peel Ports want to enlarge the cruise terminal. With Liverpool Council encouragement/backing.

 

€10 million can apparently be recovered in 8 years, then it's all profit.

 

Tenerife gets just a few more ships visiting, but that's serious money.

 

With figures like that, no wonder The Packet is getting the old heave ho and being sent down the river.

[notwell]

60 ships a year in to Liverpool.

 

It would be interesting to know the numbers involved for berthing fees etc.

[goddess]

Some expert on the national broadcaster said there's bog all there where this new docking facility is proposed

I'm getting to know the Steam Packet very well.

I am travelling between IOM and Ormskirk 3 times per week using the Steam Packet Ferry from Liverpool.

Its a very good service but I would suggest it can only get better if it moves down from Princes Landing Stage to the Princes Half Tide Dock.The current terminal is a poor facility for such a good service to use.

I did think this area (Princes Half Tide Dock) was to be part of Peel's grandiose waterfront development but apparently not if its being sold as a ferry terminal.

Road access is good (its on the dock road) and there is plenty of room for both a taxi terminal and bus stage. All the well known city facilities are within walking distance.

I think it will be a positive move provided the IOM Government can tie down the Steam Packet to using Liverpool.

 

[guzzi]

 

Its a very good service but I would suggest it can only get better if it moves down from Princes Landing Stage to the Princes Half Tide Dock.The current terminal is a poor facility for such a good service to use

 

.......

 

All the well known city facilities are within walking distance.

I think it will be a positive move provided the IOM Government can tie down the Steam Packet to using Liverpool.

 

 

 

I agree that the current terminal is poor, with few facilities or comforts for the foot passenger, and no access for vehicle passengers to any lounge facility at all.

 

But where the present terminal at the Pier Head really comes into its own is that walking or taking the Merseyrail into the City Centre is very easy. The new plans do not seem to me to show any pedestrian bridge across the dock entrance linking the new facility to Princes Parade. That leaves pedestrians having to walk around the new access road around the dock in order to get to Waterloo Road and the bus route. Effectively, you would have to walk around a Km before you were back where you would have been at the old Pier Head terminal.

 

The key thing for a foot passenger is that there is a bridge from the terminal across to Princes Parade.

[Andy Onchan]

 

Some expert on the national broadcaster said there's bog all there where this new docking facility is proposed

I'm getting to know the Steam Packet very well.

I am travelling between IOM and Ormskirk 3 times per week using the Steam Packet Ferry from Liverpool.

Its a very good service but I would suggest it can only get better if it moves down from Princes Landing Stage to the Princes Half Tide Dock.The current terminal is a poor facility for such a good service to use.

I did think this area (Princes Half Tide Dock) was to be part of Peel's grandiose waterfront development but apparently not if its being sold as a ferry terminal.

Road access is good (its on the dock road) and there is plenty of room for both a taxi terminal and bus stage. All the well known city facilities are within walking distance.

I think it will be a positive move provided the IOM Government can tie down the Steam Packet to using Liverpool.

 

 

 

I wouldn't be surprised if this falls at the first planning permission hurdle. If I had just bought one of those apartments within the half-tide dock area I don't think I'd be too pleased about having a ferry terminal right outside my front window/door.

[Andy Onchan]

It's interesting how Peel Ports/Holdings and Liverpool Council have played around with the World Heritage Status of Liverpool docks development to suit Peel Holdings ever-shifting search for easy money. Historical partnerships/relationships (ie. LPL/IOM), it seems, have little meaning these days.

 

In this link from a document produced in 2011, the cruise terminal was originally planned to be sited at Waterloo Dock and the Princes Half Tide area (Section 4.20):

 

http://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/Journals/1/Files/2011/5/20/Liverpool%20Waters%20-%20OUV%20Assessment%20-%20FINAL%20REPORT.pdf

[woolley]

 

 

I agree that the current terminal is poor, with few facilities or comforts for the foot passenger, and no access for vehicle passengers to any lounge facility at all.

 

But where the present terminal at the Pier Head really comes into its own is that walking or taking the Merseyrail into the City Centre is very easy. The new plans do not seem to me to show any pedestrian bridge across the dock entrance linking the new facility to Princes Parade. That leaves pedestrians having to walk around the new access road around the dock in order to get to Waterloo Road and the bus route. Effectively, you would have to walk around a Km before you were back where you would have been at the old Pier Head terminal.

 

The key thing for a foot passenger is that there is a bridge from the terminal across to Princes Parade.

 

Foot passenger provision is bad at Douglas if you are getting on the Ben. They couldn't make you walk much further within the harbour if they tried. Maybe they did try.