Charles Lewin - Obituary

[finlo]

10 minutes ago, dilligaf said:

I think Civil Servants have to put in 40 years at least, but police pay more in so can go earlier. I have no problem with that. I would not want their job

But they expect the rest of us to carry on till 67 with plans to push that to 72 how does that work for manual worker's?

[Non-Believer]

28 minutes ago, dilligaf said:

Maybe some on their 50’s, but 40’s ?????

As I have often pointed out. In my time, most people felt being a Civil Servant was a shit job so they went into banking or accountancy. Maybe their package was not as good in the long run, even when their salary was better for many years. Who’s sorry now, as the song goes.?

It's not the age they go at, it's the amount some of them take with them that's the problem. Particularly given the level of contributions, certainly up until recently.

[quilp]

I can only speak for myself but I would gladly pay more in contributions. It wouldn't have to be a great deal if everyone got on board. 

[finlo]

The main problem is most of those going now have paid little  or nothing into the system but will be a massive drain on it!

[Shake me up Judy]

The pension age for men will be creeping up again after this lot. They'll do to us what they did to women. Anybody under fifty will have a lot of years still ahead of them - if they still have a job.

[Stitch]

9 hours ago, dilligaf said:

It says he died on April 6th.

Strange then we don’t get confirmation of the rumours until after Easter Monday. Were they just erring on the safe side.?

Before you all flame me, I’ve known Buster for almost 60 years and well enough to know that he would laugh at that 

I'm guessing, that there are a few of us, that were taught by Pappa Quayle and Mrs Boni.

[NoTail]

8 minutes ago, Stitch said:

I'm guessing, that there are a few of us, that were taught by Pappa Quayle and Mrs Boni.

I'm one of them!  Braddan School., 1966--1969.

[KERED]

29 minutes ago, NoTail said:

I'm one of them!  Braddan School., 1966--1969.

Me too.  (And Fanny Lace)

[Derek Flint]

9 hours ago, finlo said:

Lot's of cop's are gone by 50 ask Derek and thats not a pop at Derek.

A full pension WAS 30 years so if you joined at 18 and a half you could be out at 48 and a half. It’s now 35 years. Contributions top out at 14% of salary. The adjustments mean that few will draw down their full pension in the future, which will suit goverment.

30 years in that job is enough, and I say that although I miss policing a lot. What I didn’t appreciate when I set out on the journey in 1990 was the compounding effect that shifts, stress and exposure to trauma have on you. I went a little bit early as you know, but I said on more than one occasion I wondered how much I had left in me mentally, let alone physically.

I’d lump in the other emergency services too for a better deal. Fire seems to do OK, but paramedics, and hospital staff should all be able to finish at 55, tops. 

[Shake me up Judy]

I get all that Derek and agree with much of what you say. However, I've always thought that we lose far too many experienced professionals at their peak; with all that experience, judgement, knowledge, training and skills. Give me a copper in his fifties over a youngster anyday. I've argued this before but I'd put the minimum recruitment age up a few years. I accept that it's a different picture in some of the other emergency services.

In the future, part-time work will increase for many of us, and this could be a way of retaining professional staff past the current retirement age.   

[WTF]

8 hours ago, finlo said:

The main problem is most of those going now have paid little  or nothing into the system but will be a massive drain on it!

and what they have paid never ended up in  a pot anyway,  it was spend by government,  the pot is just numbers on  paper.   it doesn't matter what you think you're paying into a pot if there isn't actually a pot.

[WTF]

Just now, Shake me up Judy said:

I get all that Derek and agree with much of what you say. However, I've always thought that we lose far too many experienced professionals at their peak; with all that experience, judgement, knowledge, training and skills. Give me a copper in his fifties over a youngster anyday. I've argued this before but I'd put the minimum recruitment age up a few years. I accept that it's a different picture in some of the other emergency services.

In the future, part-time work will increase for many of us, and this could be a way of retaining professional staff past the current retirement age.   

culverhouse got rid of a lot of experience and hired kids on  a less money so the police wages bill looked good,  the pension bill of course went up but that didn't matter.

[wrighty]

43 minutes ago, Derek Flint said:

 

I’d lump in the other emergency services too for a better deal. Fire seems to do OK, but paramedics, and hospital staff should all be able to finish at 55, tops. 

I disagree in part. Earlier retirement should be for those that dig roads etc rather than the likes of you and me. 
 

It is though right that a copper shouldn’t be chasing villains, a surgeon shouldn’t be getting up in the middle of the night and then work the whole of the next day, a nurse doing heavy manual handling, a paramedic doing call outs etc into our 60s. But they could do something rather than be able to take a pension (and then carry on doing something anyway). Careers should be designed with the aging individual in mind. You can’t work for 30 years and then expect 50% of your final salary for another 30 afterwards for doing nothing. 

In the medical profession there is a thought that doctors over 55 should not do on call. Many would happily work until 65 and beyond if that were removed, and the service would benefit from their continued presence and experience. 

[Derek Flint]

4 minutes ago, wrighty said:

I disagree in part. Earlier retirement should be for those that dig roads etc rather than the likes of you and me. 
 

It is though right that a copper shouldn’t be chasing villains, a surgeon shouldn’t be getting up in the middle of the night and then work the whole of the next day, a nurse doing heavy manual handling, a paramedic doing call outs etc into our 60s. But they could do something rather than be able to take a pension (and then carry on doing something anyway). Careers should be designed with the aging individual in mind. You can’t work for 30 years and then expect 50% of your final salary for another 30 afterwards for doing nothing. 

In the medical profession there is a thought that doctors over 55 should not do on call. Many would happily work until 65 and beyond if that were removed, and the service would benefit from their continued presence and experience. 

I think that’s a fair shout and totally reasonable. I’d have taken a redeployment for the remainder of my service (2 and a bit years)  and some time beyond that. Had I made it another rank up, it would have been easy to manage my confinement, and in UK forces the job would have had to make reasonable adjustments in any case. But I’d have certainly taken an opportunity to provide a few more years public service. What I wouldn’t have wanted though, was a non-job. 

Fully take your point on the manual trades too. I think the difference is that ‘stress factor’ that exists within policing, medicine and fire and rescue services. Perhaps when all this is done, we can start planning for a fairer,  more equitable world.

[Derek Flint]

52 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said:

I get all that Derek and agree with much of what you say. However, I've always thought that we lose far too many experienced professionals at their peak; with all that experience, judgement, knowledge, training and skills. Give me a copper in his fifties over a youngster anyday. I've argued this before but I'd put the minimum recruitment age up a few years. I accept that it's a different picture in some of the other emergency services.

In the future, part-time work will increase for many of us, and this could be a way of retaining professional staff past the current retirement age.   

I joined at 22. I would have been nowhere near ready at 18 and a half. In my service I think I saw perhaps half a dozen join at that age who were really good and in some cases exceptional. 

52 minutes ago, WTF said:

culverhouse got rid of a lot of experience and hired kids on  a less money so the police wages bill looked good,  the pension bill of course went up but that didn't matter.

Perhaps a tad unfair. There were still bits of Life On Mars that I recognized when I transferred here in 1998. The force desperately needed an enema. Mike Culverhouse - no love lost between us - did an exceptional job at administering that. The regrettable thing was that some of the execution was extremely poor, in part due to his newly formed internal hench team lacking the sophistication to do it well. This led to significant collateral damage and loss of a few good men. 

It was an uncomfortable period in the forces history but in the long term it was better for it.