IOM Covid removing restrictions

[madmanxpilot]

Just now, The Old Git said:

60 million doses of Novavax to be bottled and finished in Barnard Castle instead of the EU. Priceless 

Whoever would have seen that Cummings.

[madmanxpilot]

3 hours ago, SleepyJoe said:

The over 70s are to get a third jab in September

I reckon if they want to keep the country lockdown free moving forward, we'll all be needing a variant tweeked top up sooner rather than later.

Edited March 29, 2021 by madmanxpilot

[wrighty]

3 hours ago, Banker said:

good graph from Chris witty showing how vaccinations reduce hospitalization dramatically 

Or to summarise, divide by 5.

[Kopek]

From the Briefing'''''''

''....

All of the new cases are linked to existing transmission.It's the fourth consecutive day no cases have been found from unknown sources.   ''.

When a few days ago they were describing these cases as ''Unexplained'' and now they are '' not from unknown sources '', does that mean they have re-named the unknown to now be known, even if still they don't know the original source?

Is this convenient?

[Numbnuts]

7 minutes ago, Kopek said:

From the Briefing'''''''

''....

All of the new cases are linked to existing transmission.It's the fourth consecutive day no cases have been found from unknown sources.   ''.

When a few days ago they were describing these cases as ''Unexplained'' and now they are '' not from unknown sources '', does that mean they have re-named the unknown to now be known, even if still they don't know the original source?

Is this convenient?

Yes ! But a dangerous game if there not being truthful 

[Boris Johnson]

48 minutes ago, madmanxpilot said:

Whoever would have seen that Cummings.

If he had said he was there to talk about future vaccine production instead of testing his eyesight he may well still be running the country...................................

[Newbie]

50 minutes ago, madmanxpilot said:

When speaking, they explained that the slide is after one dose, there is a significant improvement after the second. 

The slide shows hospitalisations as a proportion of infections at a given rate. As two shots of the vaccine reduces infection by circa 95%, the chance of that many people actually getting infected will be minimal.

Thanks for that explanation. Certainly, looking at the figures quoted, the hospitalisation rates after vaccination seem a bit pessimistic given that the data currently seems to show very high reductions in serious illness/hospitalisation following 2 doses. If the rates quoted are based on a particular level of infection in the community, but the actual rate will be much lower, it seems a bit of a pointless slide. Much easier just to say that a single dose of vaccine reduces the risk of hospitalisation by around 80% rather than trying to put figures on it which are almost meaningless. As I said before, if the figures were to be believed, it would mean around 10,000 under 65s admitted over a 4 week period

[Kopek]

15 minutes ago, Numbnuts said:

Yes ! But a dangerous game if there not being truthful 

,.... but cynics might say that they have been playing that game from the beginning?

We were ignorant at the outset and for that they can be forgiven but as it has reached it's final conclusion of opening up the restrictions, are we now being led down a path of ''It'll be OK'', ''Trust Us''!, last week we didn't know where these cases were arising from but this week they are all 'explainable'? Have they simply adjusted the explanation to suit the outcome?

[Utah 01]

2 hours ago, The Voice of Reason said:

calling the Chief Minister a Fat Farmer is not particularly helpful

Perhaps not - but a statement of fact and therefore true - or in the new 'normal' is the truth to be dictated by one side?

[The Voice of Reason]

2 hours ago, Gladys said:

“ For your own good then, why come on here” What is that supposed to mean?

I am perfectly willing to engage with reasoned argument. Just not with nonsense that any of the triumvirate are fat, ill dressed, have previously been bar staff or make the odd mispronunciation, etc,etc

I have made my opinions (you like to call them arguments) known on the topics you list where I think there is something to be said.

If you want to call those whom you disagree with” IOMG fan clubs” fine . A lot of people do think the Government, by and large have done a decent job throughout this pandemic, but you just choose to belittle those who do not share your views. It does appear to me from reading your posts that anything the IOM Government do  is bad and they are not to be given credit for anything. 
 

It is not and should not be a binary position.

Anyway unfortunately for you I’m afraid I shall not be censored and will continue posting on here, adding to the debate which Is the whole point of the thing. I would never for one moment suggest to you that you should move to another platform. That would be disrespectful.

 

Edited March 29, 2021 by The Voice of Reason

[piebaps]

1 minute ago, The Voice of Reason said:

 anything the IOM Government is bad and they are not to be given credit for anything. 

That's the forum motto

[Roger Mexico]

1 hour ago, madmanxpilot said:

When speaking, they explained that the slide is after one dose, there is a significant improvement after the second. 

The slide shows hospitalisations as a proportion of infections at a given rate. As two shots of the vaccine reduces infection by circa 95%, the chance of that many people actually getting infected will be minimal.

Two shots don't really seem to reduce infection by 95%.   The Israeli data that people quote a lot is flawed because it is based on those who asked for a test and misses people who didn't get tested for mild or asymptomatic  infections.  I linked to a piece recently that gave more reliable figures of about 80% reduction for Pfizer and 67% for Oxford.

The 80% reduction for one dose is based on a PHE paper and presumably the source for the 'divide by 5' graphics.  This looks reasonable (and around 80% reduction in hospitalisation seems duplicated elsewhere, but the PHE paper is only based in looking at the over-70s and may not apply in the same way to younger age-groups.

[madmanxpilot]

I was referencing the rate that Pfizer had announced and what the Israelis had also touted. The figure of 90% is used in the latest report coning out of the USA today. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/cdc-pfizer-moderna-covid-vaccines-found-90-percent-effective-real-n1262334

 

[Gladys]

1 hour ago, The Voice of Reason said:

“ For your own good then, why come on here” What is that supposed to mean?

I am perfectly willing to engage with reasoned argument. Just not with nonsense that any of the triumvirate are fat, ill dressed, have previously been bar staff or make the odd mispronunciation, etc,etc

I have made my opinions (you like to call them arguments) known on the topics you list where I think there is something to be said.

If you want to call those whom you disagree with” IOMG fan clubs” fine . A lot of people do think the Government, by and large have done a decent job throughout this pandemic, but you just choose to belittle those who do not share your views. It does appear to me from reading your posts that anything the IOM Government do  is bad and they are not to be given credit for anything. 
 

It is not and should not be a binary position.

Anyway unfortunately for you I’m afraid I shall not be censored and will continue posting on here, adding to the debate which Is the whole point of the thing. I would never for one moment suggest to you that you should move to another platform. That would be disrespectful.

 

I am not trying to censor anyone, but neither should you.  At first I thought IOMG did a very good job, but started questioning when the Dr Glover debacle reared its head.   The letter shredding event undermined the confidence I had.  Whether the letter existed or not, and if it did who it was from,  was neither here nor there.  But that it was used as a justification in some odd way of not only the Dr Glover situation but more importantly removing what seemed to a great many a vital tool in our armoury, on-island genomic testing. It was almost juvenile. 

Up until that point, I thought DA performed well;  he was well briefed and could speak confidently and fluently.

It seemed, however, with that letter that not only was Dr Glover treated with disdain, but so was the Great Manx Public.  The subsequent misunderstandings are well aired and debated on here. 

In a free democracy, openness and honesty of its government is paramount.  Even more so when a government takes away freedoms and manages, on a molecular level,  the health, wealth and wellbeing of its people. 

It is new territory, we all know that,  but if there had been a willingness to admit things had gone wrong, for example with the SP, testing and schools, and the mistakes were recognised and truly lessons were learnt, then I would have much more confidence in the decision making and sense checking involved.

The freedoms we enjoyed last year were much appreciated, honestly, but we were warned not to be complacent.  Whereas those steering the ship became complacent, they failed to prepare for inevitable return and put in place adequate systems and processes to deal with it.  

It is a hard and complex job, no doubt, but they have it and must rise to it.  If they don't just admit misjudgements rather than very ineffectually huffing and puffing around them, then confidence is hard to be regained.

See, no mention of any physical attributes?  That isn't the way to argue. 

[piebaps]

31 minutes ago, Gladys said:

See, no mention of any physical attributes?  That isn't the way to argue. 

Not even your lovely smile? 

Edited March 29, 2021 by piebaps