Kevlar Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 In the last five years. But only £118K of it has been paid back by our ever so trustworthy retired civil servants https://www.three.fm/news/isle-of-man-news/government-overpaid-190000-in-public-sector-pensions-over-five-years/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Christian Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 1 hour ago, Kevlar said: In the last five years. But only £118K of it has been paid back by our ever so trustworthy retired civil servants https://www.three.fm/news/isle-of-man-news/government-overpaid-190000-in-public-sector-pensions-over-five-years/ Most of it to people who have died but they weren’t informed it seems. Hardly a massive problem and totally understandable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevlar Posted March 26 Author Share Posted March 26 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Steve_Christian said: Most of it to people who have died but they weren’t informed it seems. Hardly a massive problem and totally understandable. Really, in five years? When a relative of mine died Aviva wrote within three months to ask for the annuity over payment back. But then again that’s the real world not civil servant land. Edited March 26 by Kevlar 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 36 minutes ago, Steve_Christian said: Most of it to people who have died but they weren’t informed it seems. Hardly a massive problem and totally understandable. Or benefit fraud as it is known in the rest of the population. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Christian Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 (edited) 38 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said: Or benefit fraud as it is known in the rest of the population. Or a genuine mistake rectified once notification of death was provided. don’t shout at me. Just balancing the argument. (I don’t really care. It’s a small number in the grand scheme of government pensions) Edited March 26 by Steve_Christian Spelling 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevlar Posted March 26 Author Share Posted March 26 1 hour ago, A fool and his money..... said: Or benefit fraud as it is known in the rest of the population. Yes it’s benefit fraud. But civil servant benefit fraud doesn’t get you on the front page of the Courier portrayed as a scummer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moghrey Mie Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 9 hours ago, Kevlar said: Yes it’s benefit fraud. But civil servant benefit fraud doesn’t get you on the front page of the Courier portrayed as a scummer. Not necessarily. It could occur when a person has died and next month's pension payment is already in the pipeline. That would be counted as an overpayment needing to be recovered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non-Believer Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 There is still @ £78,000 outstanding though. Now given that Govt has been raising charges in some areas to raise as little as £8000 pa (and trumpeting it), one would expect them to be pursuing this outstanding £78k with at least equal diligence. How much did we raise kid's bus fares by, again? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevlar Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, Moghrey Mie said: Not necessarily. It could occur when a person has died and next month's pension payment is already in the pipeline. That would be counted as an overpayment needing to be recovered. That would only be a few grand. This is over £80K. Wouldn’t might but the registry is a government department so how can they not know when someone has died? As I said above Aviva managed to reclaim against a dead family member in three months. This is just another example of staggering government inefficiency when it comes to themselves. Yet some poor single mum is dragged through the courts and shamed in the papers for a benefits oversight. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, Non-Believer said: There is still @ £78,000 outstanding though. Now given that Govt has been raising charges in some areas to raise as little as £8000 pa (and trumpeting it), one would expect them to be pursuing this outstanding £78k with at least equal diligence. How much did we raise kid's bus fares by, again? You’d always expect that. Say that it’s 10 ( different ) people per month for £1000 average each. Say it’s due to death. It can take 2 or 3 months, or longer, to get probate to enable executors to pay back. If the pensioner had moved to UK then 6 months. So there’ll always be a sum owed, and government can’t do anything to recover immediately. As new overpayments will occur every month the important ( only relevant ) figure is how much is owed after 3 and 6 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 8 minutes ago, Kevlar said: Yet some poor single mum is dragged through the courts and shamed in the papers for a benefits oversight. There’s no similarity. And you can’t drag a corpse through court, unsurprisingly. The dead pensioner didn’t do anything wrong. 8 minutes ago, Kevlar said: That would only be a few grand. This is over £80K No, it’ll be much more than a few grand. See my previous post 8 minutes ago, Kevlar said: Wouldn’t might but the registry is a government department so how can they not know when someone has died? Not everyone stays and dies on Island after retiring. And it would take some cross checking. 8 minutes ago, Kevlar said: Aviva managed to reclaim against a dead family member in three months No, they wrote a letter. Treasury do the same. Often the earliest they know of death is when the bank account into which the pension is paid is closed. Writing a letter and receiving repayment will normally be weeks or months apart. 8 minutes ago, Kevlar said: staggering government inefficiency You’d prefer to waste £25-30k to employ someone to cross check registered deaths? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) 27 minutes ago, John Wright said: You’d prefer to waste £25-30k to employ someone to cross check registered deaths? But at least that person's estate will pay back any pension overpayment promptly. Eventually. Edited March 27 by Declan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 52 minutes ago, John Wright said: There’s no similarity. And you can’t drag a corpse through court, unsurprisingly. The dead pensioner didn’t do anything wrong. No, it’ll be much more than a few grand. See my previous post Not everyone stays and dies on Island after retiring. And it would take some cross checking. No, they wrote a letter. Treasury do the same. Often the earliest they know of death is when the bank account into which the pension is paid is closed. Writing a letter and receiving repayment will normally be weeks or months apart. You’d prefer to waste £25-30k to employ someone to cross check registered deaths? Pretty sure that once my Mum's death was registered, her state pensions ceased to be paid, didn't have to wait for probate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piebaps Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 According to Gov figures £141m will be paid in pensions in 24-25 (FOI 3723609) The overpayments reported are 0.13% 80% relate to payments made after the public servant has died but before the paying authority knew. There can be a lag time between death and registration of death - in my dad's case just over two weeks due to a requirement for a post mortem. The only way a paying authority would know is if a relative informed them - among all the other things that go on following a death. No matter how much the OP dislikes public servants (which can be the only reason for the post), the amounts involved are tiny and the amount written off even smaller (£292 between 14.08.2019 and 29.02.2024 (FOI 3709850). As JW quite rightly points out, even shapeshifting corrupt public servants can't commit fraud after they die. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non-Believer Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 2 hours ago, John Wright said: You’d always expect that. Say that it’s 10 ( different ) people per month for £1000 average each. Say it’s due to death. It can take 2 or 3 months, or longer, to get probate to enable executors to pay back. If the pensioner had moved to UK then 6 months. So there’ll always be a sum owed, and government can’t do anything to recover immediately. As new overpayments will occur every month the important ( only relevant ) figure is how much is owed after 3 and 6 months. I agree....I'm just saying that I hope that they pursue this outstanding amount with the same due diligence and enthusiasm that they pursue everybody else for much smaller amounts in charges and transgressions. Mind, this figure may get worse in years to come, having to pursue any overpayment to the number of weighty wheelbarrows that have been pushed off the island to retirements elsewhere in the last 10 years... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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