Two PokerStars Announcements: IOM Chess Tournament and 2014 Poker Tournament

[HeliX]

Of course poker is a game of skill, like Chess, or even horseracing, the best will usually win but sometimes they don't thats why you can bet on it, facilitating gambling of real money games makes it gambling as you are just backing yourself rather than a horse.

I'm not sure why you've put horseracing in there. Spectators don't (typically) bet on Poker. Also if you lose a race in horse racing - you've lost, and the people betting have lost. Regardless of if you're the best there or not. If you lose a hand in poker when you're the best there, you're going to be more likely to win the others so it makes no real difference.

[Slim]

Of course poker is a game of skill, like Chess, or even horseracing, the best will usually win but sometimes they don't thats why you can bet on it, facilitating gambling of real money games makes it gambling as you are just backing yourself rather than a horse.

Do you play poker? You don't bet on the winner, you bet on your hand. The betting is part of the game, not a side thing and that's where a lot of the skill is. There's an element of risk, but it's not purely to chance. If it was you wouldn't have pro poker players.

[slinkydevil]

The national lottery is state sponsored gambling with no skill, just chance and crap odds at that. Even with your chip stack down you can fight back in poker with a bit of skill, and yeah a little luck too!

[Vulgarian]

Skill vs. luck in poker. There is some skill involved, but there is also enough luck to enable novice players to win, especially when playing against other novice players. It is the rewarding feeling of winning that gets people hooked on it. I think poker has perhaps slightly less capacity to become addictive than other gambling games based entirely on chance, but you don't have to look very hard on the internet to find testimonies of people who have become addicted to playing poker online.

 

I understand that many people do not play poker with real money. Games can become addictive without any money being involved. They do not directly impact the living standard of the player but can lead to other problems as they spend inordinate amounts of time on the game.

 

People have died playing world of warcraft. There are extremes. You can't declare a whole organisation morally wrong because some people are addicted to that activity and it's damaging. It's kneejerk crap, the company has a responsibility to minimise damaging behavour for sure, but why should they be branded as a dirty gambling site because of this prejudice, bollocks and misinformation? Poker isn't routelette, it's much closer to games than gambling. Buying equities is gambling, should we ban investments adverts?

 

We're not talking about banning anything. I'm just saying that we, and our government, should be thinking about what we are doing very carefully before getting into bed with this industry.

 

I'm not picking on Pokerstars specifically, who represent the less harmful side of the industry, but I am attacking the exploitative nature of gambling companies.

 

I am not against people advertising their events on the Events board, but don't try to pretend it's local news to get it better noticed.

[thommo2010]

Skill vs. luck in poker. There is some skill involved, but there is also enough luck to enable novice players to win, especially when playing against other novice players. It is the rewarding feeling of winning that gets people hooked on it. I think poker has perhaps slightly less capacity to become addictive than other gambling games based entirely on chance, but you don't have to look very hard on the internet to find testimonies of people who have become addicted to playing poker online.

 

I understand that many people do not play poker with real money. Games can become addictive without any money being involved. They do not directly impact the living standard of the player but can lead to other problems as they spend inordinate amounts of time on the game.

 

People have died playing world of warcraft. There are extremes. You can't declare a whole organisation morally wrong because some people are addicted to that activity and it's damaging. It's kneejerk crap, the company has a responsibility to minimise damaging behavour for sure, but why should they be branded as a dirty gambling site because of this prejudice, bollocks and misinformation? Poker isn't routelette, it's much closer to games than gambling. Buying equities is gambling, should we ban investments adverts?

 

We're not talking about banning anything. I'm just saying that we, and our government, should be thinking about what we are doing very carefully before getting into bed with this industry.

 

I'm not picking on Pokerstars specifically, who represent the less harmful side of the industry, but I am attacking the exploitative nature of gambling companies.

 

I am not against people advertising their events on the Events board, but don't try to pretend it's local news to get it better noticed.

 

But it is local news a big event is being hosted in the Isle of Man. Cant see how that isn't local news

[La_Dolce_Vita]

 

Shopping is advertised and also psychologically addictive. Other psychological addictions; exercise, sex, work, relationships, eating, throwing up...

People have died playing world of warcraft. There are extremes. You can't declare a whole organisation morally wrong because some people are addicted to that activity and it's damaging. It's kneejerk crap, the company has a responsibility to minimise damaging behavour for sure, but why should they be branded as a dirty gambling site because of this prejudice, bollocks and misinformation? Poker isn't routelette, it's much closer to games than gambling. Buying equities is gambling, should we ban investments adverts?

 

(http://www.indiana.edu/~engs/rbook/readabd.htm)

 

The free play poker isn't simply a funnel into paying customers either, lots of companies with free play don't even have a pay equivalent like xbox live and zynga. You can buy more chips but you can't cash out. They make from advertising, punters buying merch, or buying avatars or extra chips etc.

A distinction is made here because the companies AND government (Isle of Man) encourage behaviour that has a high potential for addition and because this advertising encourages vulnerable people to undertake behaviour that is far from sensible

 

Yes, shopping is advertising and products are advertised in all sorts of clever ways that make use of knowledge of 'human weaknesses' of thinking to get people to buy products. That's not good either. But gambling involves gambles. Putting certain amounts of money in when there is a likelihood of little or no return or coming out with less than what you put in.

And gambling (as with other financial inducements) is something that working class people (especially the poorest) are particularly suspectible to being interested in and interested in continuing because they want or need money.

That's not the same with shopping where it is known very clearly what will be get out of a transaction. The problem with advertising products is that such products are made to seem needed or people are led to think that they are highly desirable. Again, wrong, but not anywhere as bad as gambling advertising.

[La_Dolce_Vita]

Am I misremembering, or do you also support decriminalization of drugs?

I support decriminalisation, yes. Though I don't think gambling should be illegal, if that's what you think I am talking about. It's advertising and making out that gambling is a good thing that I have a problem with.

It shouldn't never be promoted by a government and any promotion by those making money out of gambling as a business should be opposed.

I don't see why giving gambling a pleasant image is a bad thing. Gambling is entertaining, same as a lot of other things that cost money. If I go to the Casino with £30 on a night out, I treat the experience in a similar manner to if I had paid £30 to see a show.

I don't really have an issue with someone going off with a small amount of money to a casino or playing online and having the odd game once in a while.

 

But we're talking here about businesses actively promoting gambling. Do you understand now?

Can we just address this right now, a good poker player will always win against a bad poker player over any significant number of hands. It is very definitely a game of skill.

 

Poker is a game of skill

Funsponge!

And largely chance.

Er....yeah. But if you can comprehend the English properly you might be able to recognise the use of the word 'largely' there. It is about skill AND chance.

[La_Dolce_Vita]

But it is local news a big event is being hosted in the Isle of Man. Cant see how that isn't local news

Maybe spend some time reading the topics that come up on Local News. You may find that they are not events (i.e. occurrences of social interest on a specific date that involve a number of people attending.)

[Thomas Jefferson]

As a believer in a little thing called ethics, I agree that gambling ought to be discouraged, though as an anarchist I am also not in favour of outright banning it. I do not approve of the national lottery either. I believe that some short-term revenue may come from e-gaming -- I doubt any of it will ever reach those in need, though -- but nothing good will come of it in the long-term. It will not only further damage the island's already-tarnished reputation on the international stage, but I also think there is a general social law of reciprocity -- not a literal law but a general trend that for every action there is a reaction, or a ying for every yang, and all that stuff -- and that at some point we will get our "karma" for heavily basing our economy on finance and, more recently, e-gaming.

[Lonan3]

No one ever needed to promote gambling per se.

Deny it as much as we may, gambling is a basic human pastime; possibly for many the only opportunity to 'take risks' which is so much a part of our natures.

Personally, I've never been into gambling very much - an occasional lottery ticket, the odd pound or two in a one-armed bandit [showing my age - but sod it] or a bob or two on the Grand National. At the same time, I've worked with people who would gamble on almost anything, from horse or greyhound racing to which of two flies would leave a stale breadcrust first. Even in the days when there were no betting shops - when placing a bet involved illegally passing details and money to a bookie's runner, there were still plenty of people who spent far more than they could reasonably afford on their gambling habits. I would also suggest that, because there was none of the regulation and assistance that is available today, there were probably a lot more families who had to go without because of the main earner's desire to gamble.

Ultimately, those who wish to gamble will always do so. Nothing will prevent them. I would far rather see that happen within a properly regulated and controlled environment where, however inadequate it may be, there is some kind of safety net for those who are addicted. And if, as I am certain, gambling is an inevitable fact of life and businesses are flourishing because of it, I have no problems with the Isle of Man using it to provide employment for a large number of it's people.

[Thomas Jefferson]

I have no problems with the Isle of Man using it to provide employment for a large number of it's people.

 

An interesting point. What percentage of PokerStars staff were born in the Isle of Man?

[Bobbie Bobster]

 

I have no problems with the Isle of Man using it to provide employment for a large number of it's people.

 

An interesting point. What percentage of PokerStars staff were born in the Isle of Man?

A more interesting statistic would be what number of Isle of Man born workers have been unable to secure desired employment with PokerStars.

[Amadeus]

While I don't work for Stars, I do know that our industry requires a broad spectrum of skills, from IT to customer service, compliance, etc, so as long as IOM workers with the required skills are available, then I'm sure they would have a good chance to find employment. Thing is, though, it comes down to the individual person if he or she is suitable and willing to do a certain job, so not sure what a statistic like that would actually tell you without context for each individual person.

[Albert Tatlock]

 

 

I have no problems with the Isle of Man using it to provide employment for a large number of it's people.

 

An interesting point. What percentage of PokerStars staff were born in the Isle of Man?

A more interesting statistic would be what number of Isle of Man born workers have been unable to secure desired employment with PokerStars.

...and how many Manx rocket scientists work at Jurby?

[woolley]

 

 

 

I have no problems with the Isle of Man using it to provide employment for a large number of it's people.

 

An interesting point. What percentage of PokerStars staff were born in the Isle of Man?

A more interesting statistic would be what number of Isle of Man born workers have been unable to secure desired employment with PokerStars.

...and how many Manx rocket scientists work at Jurby?

Not many, but a lot of Manx scientists work in biomeds.