slinkydevil Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 (edited) Active shooter riding around Brussels at the moment with an AK shooting people in the name of Islam. 8 dead so far. More of this to come over the next few months. Edited October 16, 2023 by slinkydevil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 Reuters article covering the Iranian involvement in hamas' upsurge and the antisemitic rhetoric trumpeted by the mad mullahs of Tehran. Hopefully they're next... https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/how-hamas-secretly-built-mini-army-fight-israel-2023-10-13/#:~:text=According to a U.S. State,Liberation of Palestine-General Command. Fuckers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 44 minutes ago, HeliX said: Nazism isn't really the same as writing off an entire group of people, but the bit of this post I wanna know more about is "Bollocks" in response to "There are no inherently savage peoples." What would make them inherently savage? Are you suggesting there's some sort of neurological difference causing it? I'd say that we humans are just sophisticated savages, at various levels of societal development, around the world. We've had thousands of years and countless examples of man's inhumanity to man. Not a neurological difference, more like indifference when it suits the occasion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, quilp said: I'd say that we humans are just sophisticated savages, at various levels of societal development, around the world. We've had thousands of years and countless examples of man's inhumanity to man. Not a neurological difference, more like indifference when it suits the occasion. Oh sorry, when I said inherently savage I meant regardless of environment. And I don't think people are - I think people are largely a product of their environment. As an aside, found this fairly interesting: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake me up Judy Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 People are born neither good nor bad. They're both. Their basic essence, the first principle, is the instinct for survival. In a world of limited resources that instantly becomes competition. Everything else follows. Study your Darwin, human evolution, and the journey of life from birth to death. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake me up Judy Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 8 hours ago, HeliX said: Oh sorry, when I said inherently savage I meant regardless of environment. And I don't think people are - I think people are largely a product of their environment. As an aside, found this fairly interesting: I'm a great admirer of the late Christopher Hitchens, but you do know that he turned 180 degrees on many of the big issues in the last years of his life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 1 hour ago, Shake me up Judy said: People are born neither good nor bad. They're both. Their basic essence, the first principle, is the instinct for survival. In a world of limited resources that instantly becomes competition. Everything else follows. Study your Darwin, human evolution, and the journey of life from birth to death. Well exactly, that's what I'm getting at. The way to stop there being a "murderous death cult" isn't war. It's removing the need for it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 18 minutes ago, HeliX said: Well exactly, that's what I'm getting at. The way to stop there being a "murderous death cult" isn't war. It's removing the need for it. My preferred methodology is to turn those preaching it into a polo mint... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrighty Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 52 minutes ago, P.K. said: My preferred methodology is to turn those preaching it into a polo mint... Well I for one am therefore glad you're not in charge and are limited to inane ramblings on an insignificant chat forum. Doubling up on the violence and killings won't solve the underlying problem. Has it ever? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake me up Judy Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 Yes. Sometimes it's absolutely necessary. It's solved a lot of problems in history. It's the hard truth and you've yet to learn and understand it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 15 hours ago, Roxanne said: Thanks for taking the time for this. I appreciate it. Although, I was more thinking long term, the end game. How do you see it panning out with regard it its effect on the whole world. It already seems to be having a massively negative effect from my, granted, limited knowledge. @Roxanne The history lessons, while interesting, are not all that relevant. IMHO the League of Nations in 1922 is the only viable starting point. There's a lot on here about "innocent" Palestinians being caught up in the conflict between Hamas and the IDF. I don't wholly go along with that. They conveniently forget the election in 2006: Hamas celebrates election victory Figures from Palestinian officials tonight confirmed Hamas's shock win in the Palestinian parliamentary election over the once-dominant Fatah party. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2006/jan/26/israel1 In Gaza the members of Hamas are called "Resistance Fighters" which gives an insight into the mindset of the Palestinians living there... After an incident like the Hamas assault all the usual suspects get up on their hind legs to try and foment international support for Hamas. This is typical: Former Hamas leader Khaled Meshaal calls for worldwide protests to support Palestinians Turkey's Erdogan says Israel response is 'disproportionate,' Jordan's king calls for diplomacy https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/hamas-turkey-jordan-mideast-1.6992379 The above piece has the usual refrain: Jordan's King Abdullah said on Wednesday no peace was possible in the Middle East without the emergence of an independent Palestinian state alongside Israel. "Our region will never be secure nor stable without achieving just and comprehensive peace on the basis of the two-state solution," the monarch said. Two things make this almost impossible IMHO. Firstly the ground Israel currently has was acquired by the blood of it's people in conflict with those who would wipe Israel out. They would view handing it back as dishonouring the sacrifices already made. Secondly would a Palestinian state bring an end to the conflict? Of course it wouldn't. Not until Iran with it's fomenting and financially supporting antisemitism is taken out of the equation anyway. Lot's on here try to make themselves look clever with their "you can't kill an idea" but, of course, you can kill those who preach it. As happened with the Nazis you have to remove the head of the snake. The removal of Hamas will at least give those in Gaza a chance to normalise the place. Mind you, they will be kept very busy with a massive re-building project... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 3 minutes ago, P.K. said: @Roxanne There's a lot on here about "innocent" Palestinians being caught up in the conflict between Hamas and the IDF. I don't wholly go along with that. They conveniently forget the election in 2006: Hamas celebrates election victory An election some 17 years ago! There has not been another one since. Would you hold the entire German population responsible for the atrocities of Nazi's because they elected the National Socialist Party in the 1930's? Would you hold the entire UK population responsible for 13 years of Conservative Government? Would you hold the entire UK population responsible for Brexit? An interesting recent example are the election in Poland over the weekend. The ruling PiS Party had been trying to rig the election in their favour. Hungary and Turkey are other examples where you might question whether or not democratic principles are entirely effective. Russia also has elections and look at what happens there. You may argue that the people should have known what they were voting for but not everything turns out the way it appears. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 43 minutes ago, wrighty said: Well I for one am therefore glad you're not in charge and are limited to inane ramblings on an insignificant chat forum. Doubling up on the violence and killings won't solve the underlying problem. Has it ever? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 2 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: An election some 17 years ago! There has not been another one since. Would you hold the entire German population responsible for the atrocities of Nazi's because they elected the National Socialist Party in the 1930's? Would you hold the entire UK population responsible for 13 years of Conservative Government? Would you hold the entire UK population responsible for Brexit? An interesting recent example are the election in Poland over the weekend. The ruling PiS Party had been trying to rig the election in their favour. Hungary and Turkey are other examples where you might question whether or not democratic principles are entirely effective. Russia also has elections and look at what happens there. You may argue that the people should have known what they were voting for but not everything turns out the way it appears. Your moral equivalency really cannot be applied to this conflict for it is unique in its own way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 2 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: An election some 17 years ago! There has not been another one since. You may argue that the people should have known what they were voting for but not everything turns out the way it appears. It's simply pointing out the mindset of the people involved. Like the way they call Hamas members "Resistance Fighters" when they're just a bunch of murderous thugs. I won't bother with all the "democracy isn't perfect" stuff if you don't mind... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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