Moghrey Mie Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Hospitality owners also need to take some responsibility. If they see training as a 'burden' it does not bode well for the sector. They need to be training their staff and creating career paths for those who wish to work in the industry. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asitis Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Bureaucracy is killing the island, ask those who regularly have to wrestle with the FSA ! however it should be no surprise to anyone, as there are rafts of them everywhere looking to build empires ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 49 minutes ago, Moghrey Mie said: Whatever happened to the Hospitality Forum? There are too many venues for a population of 85,000. We can't sustain coffee shops on every corner. I agree about raising the threshold for tax payers. Anybody on the minimum wage shouldn't be paying income tax. I hope employees are in a union to fight for their interests. If the new rates are brought in, they'll be paying the highest tax bracket. 33 minutes ago, Declan said: I was expecting them to just blame the employees getting paid an increasing the minimum wage. When it's more nuanced than that, which the statement recognises. Why? Whenever there's a hospitality business bemoaning the situation its presented that way. But that may be Manx Radio's fault. The issue is not the minimum wage in itself, it's that a significant amount of it actually goes to the Government. Then an increase in employers NI too. The LVA are all for people having more money in their pockets. 30 minutes ago, Anthony Ingham said: A decent statement making some valid points, especially regarding tax thresholds and low earners. Unfortunately, statements like “. We reject the notion that the Island’s government cannot amend our VAT system when our fellow Crown Dependencies have zero or 5% sales tax rates” undermine the whole thing and show a basic lack of understanding of the VAT arrangements here and in Jersey. I know nothing about the situation in Jersey or Guernsey, other than they don't have it. Since you have greater knowledge, what is it about these two that's so different that means we couldn't implement a similar system here? Other than, 'Government would have to find the money somehow'. 14 minutes ago, Declan said: The Government could attempt to renegotiate the common purse agreement. But I recognise that is a drastic measure. Is there an opportunity to return some VAT in certain sectors, if the Govt wanted it? The Government can reduce or return VAT if they wish. They have done it in some sectors and others only pay 5%. Rebates were discussed. The proposal is the preferred option amongst the vast majority of hospitality businesses. I have some hospitality customers, so changes do affect me, even if indirectly. But you can't dismiss the fact that 74 businesses were there yesterday with another 50 or so wanting to attend but unable to. Given that, it's clear that this is the majority of the industry here that are at breaking point. It's not as simple as saying 'well there's a coffee shop on every corner'. Would I open a coffee shop here? No. Cocktail bar? Again, probably not. But there is plenty of opportunity for different sorts of uncatered for hospitality types that would bring a better experience and choice to customers on the Isle of Man. If people then had more money in their pocket, there would be more chance of them actually going out too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 8 minutes ago, Moghrey Mie said: Hospitality owners also need to take some responsibility. If they see training as a 'burden' it does not bode well for the sector. They need to be training their staff and creating career paths for those who wish to work in the industry. I think you've misunderstood the use of the word 'burden' there. It's the things they're having to do. Since the licensing law changes, the "Responsible Person" needs to be on the premises at all times. If they leave, there has to be another trained up. Even if it's for a matter of minutes. That training isn't cheap and, currently, can only be done through one provider. This is the type of thing they are talking about. If there was more money in the business, then most, that I know would be happy to train their staff further. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Some are struggling but not sure how a business can say it's struggling whilst opening three venues within a couple of miles of each other Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 1 minute ago, Passing Time said: Some are struggling but not sure how a business can say it's struggling whilst opening three venues within a couple of miles of each other You say that, but you might be surprised by the numbers at some places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Just now, jackwhite said: You say that, but you might be surprised by the numbers at some places. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blade Runner Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 2 minutes ago, jackwhite said: If the new rates are brought in, they'll be paying the highest tax bracket. The issue is not the minimum wage in itself, it's that a significant amount of it actually goes to the Government. Then an increase in employers NI too. The LVA are all for people having more money in their pockets. I know nothing about the situation in Jersey or Guernsey, other than they don't have it. Since you have greater knowledge, what is it about these two that's so different that means we couldn't implement a similar system here? Other than, 'Government would have to find the money somehow'. The Government can reduce or return VAT if they wish. They have done it in some sectors and others only pay 5%. Rebates were discussed. The proposal is the preferred option amongst the vast majority of hospitality businesses. I have some hospitality customers, so changes do affect me, even if indirectly. But you can't dismiss the fact that 74 businesses were there yesterday with another 50 or so wanting to attend but unable to. Given that, it's clear that this is the majority of the industry here that are at breaking point. It's not as simple as saying 'well there's a coffee shop on every corner'. Would I open a coffee shop here? No. Cocktail bar? Again, probably not. But there is plenty of opportunity for different sorts of uncatered for hospitality types that would bring a better experience and choice to customers on the Isle of Man. If people then had more money in their pocket, there would be more chance of them actually going out too. Jack You have always come across as a sensible poster and had some horrible abuse on here, because you are not Manx and know what you are talking about, but I disagree with you on one point above From my experience on the rock, there is/ was always too many businesses chasing the small amount of residents. 85K is a small amount of clients for any company In my old experience, someone comes up with a good idea and a few months later someone else has set up a copy/ similar business in competition and messed up both operations Maybe the hospitality sector needs a good clear out of not good businesses? Harsh comment I know, but that is just my take on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Ingham Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 10 minutes ago, jackwhite said: 49 minutes ago, Anthony Ingham said: I know nothing about the situation in Jersey or Guernsey, other than they don't have it. Since you have greater knowledge, what is it about these two that's so different that means we couldn't implement a similar system here? Other than, 'Government would have to find the money somehow'. Honestly it would be easier for you to look online than me try to explain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2112 Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 (edited) Did anyone notice Tim Johnston Minister Starship Enterprise, use of the well used and trotted out phrase, government can’t be expected to help everyone! True, but sadly IOMG in its obsession to grow the population, at any cost, has helped property developers - rightly or wrongly. - with funding, to get empty sites redeveloped. Edited April 19 by 2112 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 20 minutes ago, Blade Runner said: Jack You have always come across as a sensible poster and had some horrible abuse on here, because you are not Manx and know what you are talking about, but I disagree with you on one point above From my experience on the rock, there is/ was always too many businesses chasing the small amount of residents. 85K is a small amount of clients for any company In my old experience, someone comes up with a good idea and a few months later someone else has set up a copy/ similar business in competition and messed up both operations Maybe the hospitality sector needs a good clear out of not good businesses? Harsh comment I know, but that is just my take on it. I get what you're saying. As I said already, I wouldn't be opening another cocktail or coffee place here. The market is saturated. But then there are some unique little places in each town. Fynoderee in Ramsey. Foraging Vintners and Kerroo in Port Erin. Miller's Tale and Black Dog Oven in Peel. I think there's plenty of scope for these type of places. Perhaps cuisines that aren't catered for, from a restaurant point of view. So whilst I partially agree, I'd caveat it with the point above. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Imagine if they were paying corporation tax like all the firms in the UK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Ingham Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 1 minute ago, 2112 said: Did anyone notice Tim Johnston Minister Starship Enterprise, use of the well used and trotted out phrase, government can’t be expected to help everyone! True, but sadly IOMG in its obsession to grow the population, at any cost, has helped property developers - rightly or wrongly. - with funding, to get empty sites redeveloped. Obviously an increase in population also helps hospitality. There hasn’t been any government money dished out to help developers yet, so I am not sure why you focus on that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 3 minutes ago, Anthony Ingham said: Obviously an increase in population also helps hospitality. There hasn’t been any government money dished out to help developers yet, so I am not sure why you focus on that. ...it's chicken and egg. You need the hospitality here in the first place for these people to want to come over to eat, drink and whatever else. As it stands, the industry has indicated they will have significant issues in being here, should the present situation continue. The truth though is, it's unlikely they'll increase the population by anywhere near the amount they want to anyway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casta Posted April 19 Share Posted April 19 Was a rep from 1886 or Jaks at the meeting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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